# Did Seven Samurai Invent the "Getting the Gang Together” genre? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 8, 2014, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079 "2014-08-08T02:05:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Tarwater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de0a6/32.png) [@Tarwater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarwater)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/1 "2014-08-08T02:05:14Z")
Because I’m having trouble thinking of an earlier instance. I wish I had more to add to this discussion. ---
**Author:** ![robardin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/43a26b/32.png) [@robardin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robardin)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/2 "2014-08-08T02:24:03Z")
Well, the Ancient Greeks had a story cycle about what the Achaeans had to do to assemble the right cast to wage and win the Trojan War, guided by prophecy and oracle… Not exactly a reunion though. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/3 "2014-08-08T02:30:05Z")
> [@robardin](#): > > Not exactly a reunion though. Most of the Seven Samurai didn’t know one another before the team was assembled. Some were added by happenstance instead of being selected for their skills. ---
**Author:** ![Tarwater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9de0a6/32.png) [@Tarwater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tarwater)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/4 "2014-08-08T02:37:41Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > Most of the Seven Samurai didn’t know one another before the team was assembled. Some were added by happenstance instead of being selected for their skills. My phrasing is probably misleading. I’m thinking in the context of films like Ocean’s Eleven, The Avengers, and so on, where a large part of the running time is dedicated to putting together the perfect team. They don’t have to know each other necessarily. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/5 "2014-08-08T03:13:32Z")
TVTropes claims that it is indeed the forbear of this convention in film. I can’t think, off the top of my head, of classic literature that fits your criteria. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 3:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/6 "2014-08-08T03:27:00Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > TVTropes claims that it is indeed the forbear of this convention in film. I can’t think, off the top of my head, of classic literature that fits your criteria. Robin Hood would be a strong contender. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/7 "2014-08-08T03:36:56Z")
Isn’t there fairytale where the hero picks up a bunch of companions on his way to the castle to court the princess, each of which has a weird skill. Then he’s given a bunch of seemingly impossible tasks, which happen to be exactly suited for his companions skills? Sorry for the vague description, but maybe someone remembers what I’m talking about. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/8 "2014-08-08T03:47:45Z")
When I was a kid, I had a sort of kids version of Journey to the West that started with a long “getting the gang together” sequence. I have no idea how faithful it was to the original though. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/9 "2014-08-08T03:56:42Z")
TVtropes has an entry [Avengers Assemble](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AvengersAssemble). They reference the Three Musketeers: " Losing his companions en route of a dangerous mission, D’Artagnan must spend three chapters collecting them back up and extricating them from the situations their particular personality quirks have gotten them into." Also see poetry in the link. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/10 "2014-08-08T03:57:20Z")
> [@Penfeather](#): > > Robin Hood would be a strong contender. How so? Little John and Friar Tuck perhaps have specific talents, but which of the others would have been recruited to the band for a particular task? ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/11 "2014-08-08T04:05:38Z")
**This movie** is the earliest example I can think of right off the top of my head: > **[Gung Ho!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gung_Ho!_(1943_film))** > > Gung Ho! (full title: Gung Ho!: The Story of Carlson's Makin Island Raiders) is a 1943 American war film directed by Ray Enright and starring Randolph Scott. The story is based somewhat on the real-life World War II Makin Island raid led by Lieutenant Colonel Evans Carlson's 2nd Marine Raider Battalion. > Lieutenant C.J. Cristoforos announces that the United States Marine Corps is seeking volunteers for a hazardous mission and special unit. Among the volunteers are a hillbilly who, when asked whet... ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/12 "2014-08-08T04:52:43Z")
Some serious thought (difficult, I know) might be given to the 12 Apostles as an instance. Maybe not the oldest, but old. Knights of the Round Table? Mount Olympus Gang? ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 5:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/13 "2014-08-08T05:53:34Z")
> [@Zeldar](#): > > Some serious thought (difficult, I know) might be given to the 12 Apostles as an instance. Maybe not the oldest, but old. That’s a good one. ---
**Author:** ![Steken](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@Steken](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steken)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/14 "2014-08-08T06:08:07Z")
Guys, guys - _[Water Margin](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_Margin)_. Classic Chinese novel - and the ultimate literary example of this. Basically the entire book is “and then they met _this_ awesome fellow, who joined the gang! and then this _other_ dude showed up, and he kicked ass, and he also joined the gang! the next fellow was fucking crazy but he was great too, you know, and so he, too, joined the gang! and do you wanna know who’s next to join the gang? then turn the page, motherfucker!” However, I don’t know a) if Kurosawa and/or his screenwriters got the idea from that book, b) if the “getting the gang together” theme originated in that book, c) if it’s a common enough trope in Chinese literature, or d) if the trope ever spread to Japanese literature, too. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/15 "2014-08-08T06:11:26Z")
I wonder how tvtropes missed Jason and the Argonauts, not the movie but the “older than feudalism” Greek myth. [http://www.pbs.org/mythsandheroes/myths\_four\_jason.html](http://www.pbs.org/mythsandheroes/myths_four_jason.html) > [@](#): > > Determined to reclaim his throne, Jason agrees to retrieve the Golden Fleece. Jason assembles a team of great heroes for his crew and they sail aboard the Argo. Even Hercules joins them (and I always think Disney should had put a young Hercules screwing up and leaving the Jason team as the reason why he was called “Jerkules” by a few early in the movie.) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/16 "2014-08-08T06:31:00Z")
I could be misremembering (I probably am) but I don’t recall the tale of Jason and the Argonauts really involve much about the _gathering_ of the Argonauts. Just a kind of, “and then Jason went to this boat, where there were a bunch of heroes.” ---
**Author:** ![jovan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/0ea827/32.png) [@jovan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jovan)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/17 "2014-08-08T06:58:18Z")
> [@Steken](#): > > d) if the trope ever spread to Japanese literature, too. One of the best-known legends in Japan is that of Momotaro, an important part of which involves the hero looking for the sidekicks he needs for his quest. According to Kurosawa, the two stories that served as inspiration for the scenario were Tolstoy’s War and Peace and Alexander Fadeyev’s The Rout. Neither books appear to feature the trope in question. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 7:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/18 "2014-08-08T07:33:57Z")
> [@Zeldar](#): > > Some serious thought (difficult, I know) might be given to the 12 Apostles as an instance. I really want to see the Gospels filmed like this now: [George Clooney]"Our newest recruit is Matthew, codename “The Taxman”. His specialty is government banking and financial systems. This operation is going to need money, lots of it, it has to be unmarked and untraceable, and that’s where Matt comes in. Next we have Simon, also know as Peter. AKA The Rock, or Rocky. Twenty years captaining triremes for the Phoenicians, busted down for insubordination. Simon now works the fishing boats out of Galilee, and we need him to move the haul, fast and silent. If it has oars or sails, Simon’s can pilot it."[/GC] ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 8:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/19 "2014-08-08T08:11:04Z")
> [@Zeldar](#): > > Some serious thought (difficult, I know) might be given to the 12 Apostles as an instance. Maybe not the oldest, but old. > > Knights of the Round Table? > > Mount Olympus Gang? The Gospels don’t really spend that long on the process of Apostle recruitment. And other then Judah and Peter, they don’t actually do much as individuals. So I don’t think that’s a great example. I’ve seen versions of King Arthur that do focus a lot on his gathering various Knights for the grail quest (it was a well known enough part of the story for Monty Python to make fun of it). But I don’t know if any pre Kirosawa versions feature it. It’s kind of a film specific troph. In a book you can just pause the main narrative to introduce each new character. But in a movie with a large “gang”, you can’t really do that. You have to do it as part of the main story, so having the main character having a scene where he gathers each new member individually and establishes that characters basic traits makes sense. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [August 8, 2014, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079/20 "2014-08-08T08:32:59Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > It’s kind of a film specific troph. In a book you can just pause the main narrative to introduce each new character. But in a movie with a large “gang”, you can’t really do that. You have to do it as part of the main story, so having the main character having a scene where he gathers each new member individually and establishes that characters basic traits makes sense. It features a fair bit in comics too. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-seven-samurai-invent-the-getting-the-gang-together-genre/695079.md?page=2)