# Did Something Change? \[Public attitudes following the San Bernardino shootings\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 3, 2015, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358 "2015-12-03T21:34:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/41 "2015-12-04T16:49:34Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I’m afraid what’s going to be needed to change things is more a competent mass murderer and much higher body counts, perpetrated by a right wing white Christian. That pair in San Bernardino were pikers- all those guns, all that ammo, all those bombs and only 14 killed? The end result isn’t people saying “fucking guns”, it’s people getting even more biased against Muslims. When you get “one of us” mowing down hundreds if not thousands in a large public gathering, then maybe things could change. But don’t hold your breath. Would you consider that a worthwhile trade to enact your agenda? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/42 "2015-12-04T17:08:51Z")
I think the same thing has happened many times before. In the immediate aftermath of a major shooting, there’s a feeling of “we need to do something about this”. But enacting laws takes time. Gun control opponents lay low until that feeling fades and then reassert themselves later to block legislation. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/43 "2015-12-04T17:16:10Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I think the same thing has happened many times before. In the immediate aftermath of a major shooting, there’s a feeling of “we need to do something about this”. But enacting laws takes time. Gun control opponents lay low until that feeling fades and then reassert themselves later to block legislation. Or, conversely, gun control advocates lay low until there is a sensational tragedy then they come out of the wood work to try and capitalize on it and gather as much political hay as they can, milking it for every concession they can while the public is still angry and shocked over the event and riding on emotion. Sort of like Bush after 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![74westy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/74westy/32/3950_2.png) [@74westy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/74westy)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/44 "2015-12-04T17:22:56Z")
> [@Smitty](#): > > Sure. And let’s have a national database for Muslims. And bug all mosques without a warrant. And kill the entire bloodline of anyone committing a terrorist act. > > Draconian doesn’t sound so good when it doesn’t match up with your own politics, does it? No. In a country where reasonable gun control is considered equivalent to killing someone’s entire bloodline nothing’s going to change. ---
**Author:** ![JXJohns](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jxjohns/32/469_2.png) [@JXJohns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JXJohns)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/45 "2015-12-04T17:51:13Z")
> [@74westy](#): > > No. In a country where reasonable gun control is considered equivalent to killing someone’s entire bloodline nothing’s going to change. The term mentioned earlier was draconian gun control, not reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![Stoneburg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@Stoneburg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stoneburg)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/46 "2015-12-04T18:20:26Z")
> [@JXJohns](#): > > The term mentioned earlier was draconian gun control, not reasonable. On this issue, people think draconian rules are reasonable, and other people think reasonable rules are draconian. How do you solve that? ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/47 "2015-12-04T18:46:17Z")
> [@74westy](#): > > No. In a country where reasonable gun control is considered equivalent to killing someone’s entire bloodline nothing’s going to change. I ask this with sincerity, not snarkiness: What are the reasonable controls you propose? I’m not the first person introducing this, not even in this thread. What should change? “Draconian” is not an answer. What would you change, and answer in the context of second amendment protections. I ask that not because I’m a second amendment “gun guy.” (I’m not–I don’t own any guns.) I ask because that’s reality, in that restrictions can exist but can’t amount to a ban, not according to SCOTUS. So, what should have been in place? ---
**Author:** ![Bone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bone/32/407_2.png) [@Bone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bone)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/48 "2015-12-04T20:10:46Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Or, conversely, gun control advocates lay low until there is a sensational tragedy then they come out of the wood work to try and capitalize on it and gather as much political hay as they can, milking it for every concession they can while the public is still angry and shocked over the event and riding on emotion. Sort of like Bush after 9/11. You mean like, inserting anti-gun amendments into unrelated items? Say it aint so! [HR 3762, amendments right after the San Bernardino attacks, included two.](https://www.congress.gov/bill/114th-congress/house-bill/3762/amendments) The first was from Feinstein that wanted to circumvent due process and include anyone on the terror watch list as a prohibited person for NICS. That failed, 45 yes to 54 no. The second was from Toomey that reintroduced the failed Machin-Toomey bill from 2013. That failed 47 yes to 50 no. Note that the Toomey bill got 6 fewer votes than it did in 2013. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2015, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/49 "2015-12-04T20:16:38Z")
I don’t see anything changing. I expressed some of my confusion and frustration over in GD. I don’t see what meaningful restrictions can be imposed without either a rewriting of the 2d Amendment, or a Supreme Ct which is willing to read it narrowly. I wouldn’t hold my breath for any in the near future. Moreover, I don’t see what regulations would be effective. There are already some 400 million guns out there. There is simply no likelihood that we will confiscate a significant portion of those. And unless we get rid of the 2d Amendment, I’m not sure how we meaningfully restrict folk from buying any number of guns - which can then be sold/stolen and misused. And I don’t know that I want our society to toss a ton of gun owners/users into jail to replace the drug offenders who may be released. IMO, our justice system does not need additional mandatory minimums. But, that is something that CAN be done. And a lot of folk benefit from pandering as being “tough on crime,” so it might be a gooid idea to buy stock in private incarceration firms! :rolleyes: And I am not in favor of what I consider the two most likely changes - either increasing the number of weapons carried, or further restricting civil liberties under the guise of protecting against guns. I readily acknowledge that I am thrilled (and surprised) to have not seen an increase of shootings by concealed carry folk. Good on you all. But my personal opinion is that I do not feel as tho my personal safety is enhanced through the proliferation of guns in every social arena. Sorry to all you intelligent and responsible gun owners (the majority.) But I prefer my chances of only some isolated nutcase coming into my grocery store with a gun, as opposed to having a number of my fellow shoppers and store employees packing. And I take all this Patriot Act bullshit seriously. I, for one, am not comforted by the intrusions and inconveniences that have become customary under the ostensible goal of protecting us against terrorism. But that is a lot easier to do than repealing an amendment. Those of us who value our privacy only have a penumbra in our favor! 😃 People (myself included) like to talk as tho they care, but generally fall short of actually changing their lives in any significant way. Look at all the progress we’re making re: global warming. Humans (myself included) tend to be lazy, selfish creatures, wishing any sacrifice to be made by others. Nothing significant is going to change. Instead, we’ll just get used to the idea that there is some chance (pretty small) that you will be the victim of random gun violence. Once the frequency of shootings gets to a certain level, it will just become background noise. ---
**Author:** ![Fiveyearlurker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/da6949/32.png) [@Fiveyearlurker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiveyearlurker)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/50 "2015-12-05T00:35:31Z")
> [@JXJohns](#): > > The term mentioned earlier was draconian gun control, not reasonable. If reasonable people compromise with reasonable people, the result is somewhere in the middle where it belongs. If reasonable gun control advocates try to compromise with lunatics who are opposed to tightening gun control for the mentally ill, and they try to remain reasonable, the result is too far toward lunacy. So, until I see the gun lunatics show any sign of being grown ups, I would say start working on as draconian rules as possible to get to the middle. ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/51 "2015-12-05T01:24:42Z")
At some point we have to accept that people without a criminal background are legally entitled to guns, and sometimes these people turn into mass murderers. This is the price of living in a free society. It’s not worth trading that in, to most Americans. ---
**Author:** ![Scandic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecb155/32.png) [@Scandic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scandic)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/52 "2015-12-05T01:43:08Z")
The muslim gunman had an argument with his college NICHOLAS THALASINOS which was a very religious far-right zionist from Israel. A few days before he was killed Nicholas wrote this: > [@](#): > > WHY is the LIBERAL MEDIA so UPSET there is a SOCIOPATHIC KILLER in a Planned Parenthood office?!? [INNOCENT BABIES are KILLED there EVERY DAY](http://http://heavy.com/news/2015/12/nicholas-nick-thalasinos-inland-regional-center-san-benardino-shooting-jewish-religion-israel-facebook-page-wife-funeral-terrorism-blog-posts/) [He hated Obama](http://http://heavy.com/news/2015/12/nicholas-nick-thalasinos-inland-regional-center-san-benardino-shooting-jewish-religion-israel-facebook-page-wife-funeral-terrorism-blog-posts/) ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/53 "2015-12-05T02:11:08Z")
I have owned guns for over 40 years. I agree with reasonable gun control laws. My guns generally gather dust for most of the year, until summer when i enjoy target shooting. I represent 10s of millions of of legal gun owners in the USA. Why should I be demonized because of wackos who use guns? And it really pisses me off when reporters or congress critters dont know shit about guns. If you are gonna rag guns, at least know how they fucking work! It’s not “automatic assault weapons” or “90 millimeter pistols” or like I heard today, they also had a .22 “long rifles”. come on! Not to forget what California state senator Kevin de Leon said about semi-auto rifles “has the ability with a .30 caliber clip to disperse with 30 bullets within a half a second." Talk about complete lack of knowledge and bullshit. We can have a conversation but we dont need the bs ---
**Author:** ![John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_stamos_left_ear/32/3198_2.png) [@John\_Stamos\_Left\_Ear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Stamos_Left_Ear)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/54 "2015-12-05T02:24:51Z")
> [@Klaatu](#): > > I have owned guns for over 40 years. I agree with reasonable gun control laws. > > Why should I be demonized because of wackos who use guns? I see this a lot in my Facebook feed. Gun owners on the defensive feeling persecuted. I don’t get it. The “melt down all guns and criminalize ownership” opinion is fringe at best and in a climate where even the “reasonable” gun laws you claim to support cannot pass, do you really think they’re gonna be coming for your guns? I don’t know why you guys are so defensive about this. But part of the reason that shit doesn’t change is because the NRA prays on that slippery slope paranoia. Why are you (and so many like you) buying into that nonsense? ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/55 "2015-12-05T02:30:45Z")
I have no paranoia that the gov is gonna take my guns, and the reasonable gun laws are already passed. What other “shit” would you prefer to be passed? ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/56 "2015-12-05T02:41:19Z")
Because totalitarians don’t want that the common people should posess the means of self-defense. This is a common thread that unites them. Left, right, commie-nazi fascist whatever, they all agreed (or agree) on that. Insert the name of your favorite mass-murdering dictator in the last century - hundred million dead (not counting the wars mind you). The demonization of the NRA doesn’t make any sense. If the government was concerned about terrorism - they would be encouraging civilian firearms ownership and training, the borders would not be wide open to millions of illegals. It’s difficult to take them seriously. ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/57 "2015-12-05T02:41:42Z")
I agree, eliminate the gun show loophole, uh, outlaw 30 rd magazines, we would agree on a lot of things but one thing im not is defensive ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/58 "2015-12-05T02:43:37Z")
that was for stamos ---
**Author:** ![Klaatu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/59 "2015-12-05T02:46:02Z")
the thing is, as a law abiding gun owner your proposals to me are kinda ridiculous, why cant i have a 30 round mag,for my ar 15, it will never be used for mayhem, who are you outlawing? ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [December 5, 2015, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358/60 "2015-12-05T02:48:45Z")
Two radical, fanatical, Muslims created pipe bombs in their pipe bomb factory in order to murder civilians. Nope, nothing has changed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-something-change-public-attitudes-following-the-san-bernardino-shootings/739358.md?page=4)