# Did Trump Miscalculate? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [August 13, 2017, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543 "2017-08-13T15:31:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/121 "2017-08-15T17:34:48Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > We need to stop deluding ourselves. The GOP has for years been apologetic to right wing causes. Er, they are the Right Wing party, of course they will be apologetic to right wing causes. Point granted. Regardless, the GOP can no longer plausibly deny that white nationalists form part of their winning coalition, that their current President didn’t assist in bringing this about, and that he is, in fact, one of them. Before Trump, they could claim this with a (relatively) straight face. Now? They are the party of Nazis, white supremacists, and, depending upon how this Russia thing plays out, possibly traitors. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/122 "2017-08-15T17:59:35Z")
I would love to believe that this was the proverbial ‘straw that broke the camel’s back’ for Trump. I really would. Unfortunately, I find it hard to believe that this will have more impact than the hundred or so OTHER unbelievable things he’s already said or done. The problem is, for those who form his support, facts don’t really matter. They just make up more pleasing facts. What will it take to alienate these folks? Unfortunately, I think it will require nothing less than some disaster that directly and visibly affects them. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/123 "2017-08-15T18:05:54Z")
[GOP stands by Trump after Charlottesville](http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/346605-gop-stands-by-trump-after-charlottesville) > [@](#): > > Republicans in Washington are largely standing by President Trump despite discomfort with his response to the violent and deadly clashes in Charlottesville, Va. > > Although they are openly questioning why it took Trump 48 hours to forcefully denounce the KKK members, neo-Nazis and white supremacists who turned a quiet, peaceful college town into a deadly war zone, they say they don’t think the president is a racist and that they are ready to work with him on policy. > > “I don’t think the president is some sort of closet racist who’s deliberately stirring up the devils of our nature,” Rep. Tom Cole (R-Okla.), a veteran lawmaker and former member of leadership, told The Hill. > > “Because of the nature of the attack, he should have been more specific. Within 48 hours, he was,” Cole added. “Probably he missed an opportunity, but we’re all singing from the same song book now, and that’s a good thing.” Looks like more of the same, so far. Of course, these guys will follow where the populace leads for the most part, so we’ll see if there’s any fallout. But I’m doubting it right now. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/124 "2017-08-15T18:18:57Z")
I’m not saying the straw is broken re: Trump, the GOP, etc. I am saying it is no longer plausibly deniable that the GOP is _the_ party of white supremacists and neo-nazis. For millions, the brand association between the GOP, the Confederacy, and Nazi’s was openly displayed for the first time in, well, ever. Note that 4 CEO’s have resigned from Trump’s economic advisory council, meaning they wanted to be sure _their_ brands weren’t tainted. Tainted with what? An association with Nazi’s. Why would they be associated with Nazi’s? Because of the CEO’s affiliation with the current GOP President. So _something_ is happening - before this weekend, the GOP brand was relatively unsullied. Now, it’s sullied enough that corporate CEO’s are fleeing the association. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/125 "2017-08-15T18:26:24Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > I’m not saying the straw is broken re: Trump, the GOP, etc. I am saying it is no longer plausibly deniable that the GOP is _the_ party of white supremacists and neo-nazis. For millions, the brand association between the GOP, the Confederacy, and Nazi’s was openly displayed for the first time in, well, ever. > > Note that 4 CEO’s have resigned from Trump’s economic advisory council, meaning they wanted to be sure _their_ brands weren’t tainted. Tainted with what? An association with Nazi’s. Why would they be associated with Nazi’s? Because of the CEO’s affiliation with the current GOP President. > > So _something_ is happening - before this weekend, the GOP brand was relatively unsullied. Now, it’s sullied enough that corporate CEO’s are fleeing the association. I _want_ you to be right (and me to be wrong) on this. ---
**Author:** ![Crybaby\_Boobie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crybaby_boobie/32/545_2.png) [@Crybaby\_Boobie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crybaby_Boobie)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/126 "2017-08-15T18:29:16Z")
I don’t think he’s a closet racist either. I think he’s pretty open about it. ---
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/127 "2017-08-15T18:55:01Z")
> [@Okrahoma](#): > > For those who think that Republicans will run away from Trump in 2018: I don’t know that anyone here is under the illusion that Trump’s favorability among Republicans is currently in dire jeopardy. [Gallup’s](http://www.gallup.com/poll/203198/presidential-approval-ratings-donald-trump.aspx) most recent poll has him currently at 79%. It’s not real difficult to understand why any republican facing an upcoming primary isn’t going to be overly critical of the president, unless those numbers continue to erode over the next few months (His support among republicans is declining at about the same rate it did for the population as a whole, it just started out much higher). But once the primary is concluded and the general election starts gearing up, those same republican candidates are going to start looking at Trump’s favorability ratings among independents and democrats and suddenly start distancing themselves. Seriously, just look at the polling results I linked to. Those are worrisome trends for any republican looking _beyond_ the primary, unless they begin reversing direction. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/128 "2017-08-15T19:07:14Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > My first reaction to all this was, “Great, now we’re all either Nazis or liberals.” > > I DO think that Trump’s both-siderism is a kind of tic or reflex conditioned by excessive Fox-news style media consumption. It just really bit him in the ass this time since so many people believe racists and bigots are a key part of his base. Because- that’s the case. > > Now that either he, or more likely his handlers, have realized how his callous response looks here at home and to the rest of the world, he has come out against the KKK &etc. Good for him, what a big boy step! > > I am pretty surprised that I actually believe this about the POTUS in 2017, but: yeah, I do think he just lost the 2020 election, assuming he makes it that far. All these white nationalists, xenophobes and so on are really tired of stuffed-shirt politicians who don’t really represent their interests. They thought Trump was their guy, but even as weasely as he was about it, he just condemned white nationalism. Rightly so, but he’s just another poseur to them now, and can Trump win without the support of the racists who are smart enough to notice such things? I don’t think so. Nonetheless, the GOP plutocrats have plenty of influence for some time to come, and wasn’t that always the point? > > Maybe David Duke will get the GOP nomination in 2020. He’s at least the real deal. And we’ll end up with more corporate Democrats, which will make a lot of people take a 3rd look at the Racist Party, rinse and repeat… You can’t be serious. David Duke as the GOP nominee? Well we do live in the universe in which Trump is president, so you may be right.:eek: ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 7:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/129 "2017-08-15T19:13:30Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > No, it’s pretty accurate. I’m sorry you think it’s intolerant of me not to tolerate your intolerance. Still with the strawman. Actually, it’s not accurate at all. I’m sorry you think violence is acceptable to shut down speech or assemblies you disagree with. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/130 "2017-08-15T19:18:41Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > That’s disgusting. Trump is president. Yes that’s right. President of the USA, Trump. Now that means a LOT of people voted for him or against the Left. That means if you want a chance to start chipping away support you need to appeal not attack some of his voters. Deplorable, disgusting, stupid, racist, etc are not the words one should use to convince Trump voters that can be swayed. Imagine you are wanting to go on a date, unless you are in 4th grade you don’t say “ew you are nasty” and put a toad down his or her shirt. You bring a flower. ---
**Author:** ![Muscleman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f1d935/32.png) [@Muscleman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Muscleman)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/131 "2017-08-15T19:28:17Z")
Nah ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/132 "2017-08-15T19:50:32Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Still with the strawman. > > Actually, it’s not accurate at all. I’m sorry you think violence is acceptable to shut down speech or assemblies you disagree with. Oh, I see. It’s not OK for me to protest against fascists, because if I protest I _must_ approve violence. Now _THAT’S_ a strawman! ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/133 "2017-08-15T20:06:49Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Oh, I see. It’s not OK for me to protest against fascists, because if I protest I _must_ approve violence. > > Now _THAT’S_ a strawman! No. The original strawman was the statement that people were opposed to peaceful counterprotest. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/134 "2017-08-15T20:12:00Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Imagine you are wanting to go on a date, unless you are in 4th grade you don’t say “ew you are nasty” and put a toad down his or her shirt. You bring a flower. Is this one of those "do as I say… " thingamajigs? Or more of a “those who can’t…” whatchamacallit? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/135 "2017-08-15T20:17:48Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > Is this one of those "do as I say… " thingamajigs? Or more of a “those who can’t…” whatchamacallit? Nice try, but let’s start with a flower. 🌹 ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/136 "2017-08-15T20:23:24Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > No. The original strawman was the statement that people were opposed to peaceful counterprotest. Except I didn’t say that, did I? ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/137 "2017-08-15T20:34:30Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Except I didn’t say that, did I? > [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > It seems to me that according to the alt-Reich, fascists’ free speech rights are being trampled, because the Left isn’t allowed to exercise their free speech right to disagree. The left in this case are the counterprotesters. Are you claiming that the so-called alt-Reich are denying the Left the ability to exercise peaceful free speech? If not what exactly are you claiming? ---
**Author:** ![gytalf2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ac91a4/32.png) [@gytalf2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gytalf2000)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/138 "2017-08-15T20:34:33Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > The thread title suggests that Trump actually calculates—that he carefully considers what to say and do—about which I have my doubts. Yeah, me too! ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/139 "2017-08-15T20:42:29Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > Nice try, but let’s start with a flower. 🌹 I think I need to reread the thread about restraining orders. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2017, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543/140 "2017-08-15T20:42:35Z")
In the past 20 minutes, Trump just came out in support of the statue, alt-right protestors, asked “What about the alt-left?”, and placed him and the GOP firmly on the side of the Confederacy and Nazi protesters. Kelly kept his head down, looking at the floor, for much of it. I rest my case. The GOP brand is now inextricably linked to the Confederacy and the Nazi’s. (Or is it “Nazis”?) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-trump-miscalculate/793543.md?page=8)