# Did US judges in death penalty cases ever say May God have mercy on your soul? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 20, 2017, 10:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599 "2017-03-20T10:31:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/21 "2017-03-21T15:41:56Z")
> [@Enola\_Gay](#): > > Can’t remember the name of the killer, but he killed Polly Klass & I watched his sentencing on TV and after he was sentenced to death, the judge said “May God have mercy on your soul.” So clearly, at least some judges say it. The judge also said “This is always a traumatic and emotional decision for a judge. You’ve made it very easy today by your conduct.” ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/22 "2017-03-21T15:44:54Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > It’s been twenty years and he’s still not dead - I wish God would have mercy on him sooner. > > Regards, > Shodan Damn. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/23 "2017-03-21T16:10:11Z")
The phrase is not set forth in any state or Federal guide to trial practice of which I’m aware - but it is somewhat traditional (and has been popularized by Hollywood over the years), so it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s still said here or there. It’s clearly within a judge’s discretion at capital sentencing. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/24 "2017-03-21T17:09:31Z")
One may ask–I, in fact, for one, will ask–about the “I now pronounce you …” at weddings. Even at civil events overseen by a judge in his law office. Seems like the legal status of the words and the cultural nexus are similarly intertwined over a similar amount of time. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/25 "2017-03-21T17:26:06Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > The phrase is not set forth in any state or Federal guide to trial practice of which I’m aware - but it is somewhat traditional (and has been popularized by Hollywood over the years), so it wouldn’t surprise me if it’s still said here or there. It’s clearly within a judge’s discretion at capital sentencing. A tradition which started in British India, and still exists in all (AFAIK) successor states there is that when a judge signs off on a death sentence, the nib of the pen used to sign the order is broken by him or her. Do you have something similar in the US, or like the black cap English judges used? ---
**Author:** ![Evan\_Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b487fb/32.png) [@Evan\_Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evan_Drake)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/26 "2017-03-21T17:56:34Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > One may ask–I, in fact, for one, will ask–about the “I now pronounce you …” at weddings. Even at civil events overseen by a judge in his law office. > > Seems like the legal status of the words and the cultural nexus are similarly intertwined over a similar amount of time. Got to say something. Tradition eases life by providing formula. Would you rather have: “_Yer now hitched: git along lil dogies_.” At a society wedding in St. Patrick’s NY ? ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/27 "2017-03-21T18:42:26Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > One may ask–I, in fact, for one, will ask–about the “I now pronounce you …” at weddings. Even at civil events overseen by a judge in his law office. > > Seems like the legal status of the words and the cultural nexus are similarly intertwined over a similar amount of time. I’ve performed 5 weddings as a minister in the universal life church. There are three required parts of a wedding; invocation, declaration of intent, and pronouncement. The invocation is just introducing the couple. Declaration of intent is the “do you take you” part. The pronouncement is “I now declare you wed” part. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/28 "2017-03-21T20:28:54Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > …Do you have something similar in the US, or like the black cap English judges used? No, not that I’ve ever read about. As it happens, I saw a movie once in which a late 1700s English judge didn’t use a cap but had more of a small black square of cloth that he put on the top of his head. ---
**Author:** ![Evan\_Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b487fb/32.png) [@Evan\_Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evan_Drake)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/29 "2017-03-21T21:10:05Z")
I pretty sure that was the cap — just as a scull-cap is called a cap. From some B/W film set on the Old Bailey. ( No matter how silly scull-caps look [more so than most old caps which look silly to us] they had a purpose made of steel under a Cavalier hat in 17th century warfare. ) ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/30 "2017-03-21T21:11:25Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > The pronouncement is “I now declare you wed” part. What is the pronouncement in a Jewish wedding, “You are bound to me by the laws of Moses and Israel”, or the Rabbi’s saying blessings? ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/31 "2017-03-21T22:26:07Z")
As far as flourishes at sentencing time go, I always thought it took extra flair for judges to say things like “Time will pass and seasons will come and go. Spring with its wavin’ green grass and heaps of sweet-smellin’ flowers on every hill and in every dale. Then sultry Summer, with her shimmerin’ heat-waves on the baked horizon. And Fall, with her yeller harvest moon and the hills growin’ brown and golden under a sinkin’ sun. And finally Winter, with its bitin’, whinin’ wind, and all the land will be mantled with snow. But you won’t be here to see any of 'em; not by a damn sight, because it’s the order of this court that you be took to the nearest tree and hanged by the neck til you’re dead, dead, dead, you olive-colored son of a billy goat.” (attributed to Roy Bean) Or an [even more elaborate such peroration](https://books.google.com/books?id=Njw68N7fi4kC&lpg=PT7&ots=5FPyiSZNth&dq=judge%20said%20the%20sun%20the%20birds%20but%20you%20won't&pg=PT7#v=onepage&q=judge%20said%20the%20sun%20the%20birds%20but%20you%20won't&f=false) in a recent novel by an author who clearly enjoys this sort of thing. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2017, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/32 "2017-03-21T23:58:43Z")
As I said, I believe that most judges are assholes. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/33 "2017-03-22T00:00:29Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > No, not that I’ve ever read about. As it happens, I saw a movie once in which a late 1700s English judge didn’t use a cap but had more of a small black square of cloth that he put on the top of his head. Paging through several 19th-century novels courtesy of Google Books, I noticed a recurring trope: when the judge dons the black cap, it’s because he’s about to pass a sentence of death. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/34 "2017-03-22T00:02:05Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > As I said, I believe that most judges are assholes. Indeed, I was thinking of you when I posted. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/35 "2017-03-22T00:02:21Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Judges always seem to be assholes to me. > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > As I said, I believe that most judges are assholes. **Moderator Note** Professional jabs are against the rules of GQ. No warning issued, but don’t do this again. Colibri General Questions Moderator ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/36 "2017-03-22T00:54:53Z")
> [@Johanna](#): > > Paging through several 19th-century novels courtesy of Google Books, I noticed a recurring trope: when the judge dons the black cap, it’s because he’s about to pass a sentence of death. Yes. This is the only circumstance in which a judge puts on a black cap. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/37 "2017-03-22T01:01:44Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > I’ve performed 5 weddings as a minister in the universal life church. > > There are three required parts of a wedding; invocation, declaration of intent, and pronouncement. > > The invocation is just introducing the couple. Declaration of intent is the “do you take you” part. The pronouncement is “I now declare you wed” part. In the Catholic rite of marriage, and in the rite of marriage used by most of the major western traditions, there is no “I now declare you wed” bit, or at best it’s an optional bit. The business end of the ceremony is the exchange of vows by the spouses. Given how the common law dealing with marriage had been influenced by the Christian tradition, I’d bet with a fair degree of confidence that, at common law, it’s the exchange of vows in the presence of witnesses that’s legally effective to solemnise a marriage. To the extent that marriage ceremonies have been prescribed by statute, you’d need to look at the statute for the jurisdiction concerned to see what the essential elements of the ceremony are. Note that in many jurisdictions there’s a prescribed ceremony for the civil celebration of marriage, but if the couple are married in a religious ceremony the statute merely requires that they be married “according to the rites and ceremonies” of the church concerned, or some such language. In which case “I now declare you wed” would be essential if, but only if, it’s regarded as essential by the religion or denomination in question. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/38 "2017-03-22T11:14:44Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > To the extent that marriage ceremonies have been prescribed by statute, you’d need to look at the statute for the jurisdiction concerned to see what the essential elements of the ceremony are. Note that in many jurisdictions there’s a prescribed ceremony for the civil celebration of marriage, but if the couple are married in a religious ceremony the statute merely requires that they be married “according to the rites and ceremonies” of the church concerned, or some such language. In which case “I now declare you wed” would be essential if, but only if, it’s regarded as essential by the religion or denomination in question. I’ve never performed a marriage where religion played a part, so I can’t comment. ETA: Immediately after my nephew’s wedding ceremony, one of the bride’s uncles approached me. He was still drying his eyes. He said, “Your congregation is blessed to have you”. I was speechless. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/39 "2017-03-22T13:16:57Z")
Yes, my understanding of the common law is that it’s the couple that does the marrying, by exchanging vows. The officiant doesn’t marry them; the officiant guides them through the ceremony by which they marry each other. “I now declare you…” isn’t an action by the officiant that finalises the wedding, but declares that it has happened, in accordance with the laws of the jurisdiction. ---
**Author:** ![Evan\_Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b487fb/32.png) [@Evan\_Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evan_Drake)\ **Post date:** [March 22, 2017, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599/40 "2017-03-22T13:34:03Z")
Thus it was in the old days. A man and woman shacked up for the usual reasons. Not always with 'til death do us part — more like so long as we both agree. Maybe a little ceremony to please the Gods. And the Ancestors. Then primitive religion took over, with the local priests wanting a cut: marriage was sanctified. And then, with The Rise of the Nation State, 300 - 400 years ago government wanted to register births, deaths & marriages. Government prolly won’t last, Marriage is purely a religious thing and the State adds nothing. The priest/registrar adds very little. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-us-judges-in-death-penalty-cases-ever-say-may-god-have-mercy-on-your-soul/782599.md?page=3)