# Did you ever learn to drive a column-shifted manual transmission (3-on-the-tree)? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 12, 2013, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011 "2013-08-12T06:26:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/21 "2013-08-12T11:15:47Z")
> [@Beelzebubba](#): > > I made the mistake of trying to drive from London out to Bath and Stonehenge on my first visig to the UK in 2003. But the rental car was a horrid little Peugeot from hell and it was a manual. As if driving on the wrong side of the car on the wrong side of the road wasn’t difficullt enoguh, trying to shift my left hand made it almost impossible. Meh, grew up in Australia driving right hand drive manuals, but owned a left hand drive manual Westphalia Kombi for driving around Europe. Don’t remember having any problems with the changeover of hands. And yes, when I was a teen one of my best mates had an early 70’s straight six, three-on-the-tree Holden (GM) Torana, or as it was known “the 'Rana”. We all drove one another’s cars from time to time as a type of bonding exercise, I guess. I think he might still own it. Last I heard it was in a shed on a rural property owned by his father in law. Those early seventies straight six Holdens had an extremely distinctive sound, both in terms of exhaust note and the noise they made when you shifted them. It wasn’t just my mate when I was in my teens who drove one. When I was a little kid several of my little mates’ fathers had them. There’s a guy who owns a beautifully restored one who is often in traffic alongside me when I’m riding to work in the morning. When he moves off it makes that distinctive sound and it takes me back about forty years. ---
**Author:** ![Crotalus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crotalus/32/41_2.png) [@Crotalus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crotalus)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/22 "2013-08-12T11:44:21Z")
The car in which I learned to drive and took my license test was a 1964 Chevrolet Belair with a 3-speed column shift manual transmission. The last manual transmission car I owned was a 1992 Saturn, which was killed by a deer in 2002. ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/23 "2013-08-12T12:36:05Z")
I learned how to drive with 3 on the tree. We actually had a station wagon that had 3 on the tree and this weird electronic overdrive that worked from the gas pedal (let off the gas and reapply to activate, floor it to disengage). I used a manual shift when driving around the UK and Australia (different trips!). I was fine, unless I had to react quickly, then my right hand would fly out and smash into the door panel looking for the shifter. ---
**Author:** ![Parenchyma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Parenchyma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Parenchyma)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/24 "2013-08-12T12:42:54Z")
Yes! My first car was a used '68 Dodge Dart, slant six. I loved it. Raggedy handling but endured like a tank. All my subsequent cars have also been manual transmission: another used Dart, then used Toyota pickup, new Toyota pickup, new Scion Xb (which has the back seats removed and I use a bit like a pickup). Hope I have some decent options for manual transmissions in my future cars. ---
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/25 "2013-08-12T12:56:39Z")
3 on the tree - 69 Chevy Nova 3 on the tree - 75 Dodge Tradesman Van 4 on the floor - Datsun (yes right before the name change to Nissan) 200 SX 83 Toyota van - It was a floor manual manual but I can’t remember the gears 80 Toyota Corolla - 5? on the floor (can’t quite remember) 85 Ford Ranger - 3 on the tree. I’m old but my 27 year old son can drive a stick since his first car was the POS Ford Ranger (it had about 200,000 miles on it when he got it) When learning to drive he once accidentally shifted the truck into reverse instead of third. The truck of course let out a loud grinding gear meshing ruckus. I mentioned to son, “you’ve tripped the reverse gear indicator alarm”. Doofus looked right at me and said, “Really?” :smack: ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/26 "2013-08-12T13:12:07Z")
62 Chevy Van. 68(?) Chevy Pickup. Our family owned a mobile home park and these where our service trucks. I was driving them around the park when I was about 12. I’m sure that would give a lawyer a heart attack now. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/27 "2013-08-12T13:16:05Z")
Sure… I learned to drive standard on a '72 Chevy pickup with 3 on the tree. The only hard part was learning that the “H” pattern was neither aligned along the steering column (to go into reverse or 2, push toward front), nor perpendicular(R/2 would be to the left). Instead it was at a sort of 20-30 degree angle off from aligned. Once I got that figured out, it wasn’t so hard. What was good is that once I’d learned on that old junker, driving newer and more modern manuals seemed easy, because everything was tight and there wasn’t much slop or give at all relative to the Chevy. ---
**Author:** ![OttoDaFe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ottodafe/32/356_2.png) [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/28 "2013-08-12T13:16:23Z")
One of the cars I learned to drive on (my father insisted we learn on as wide a variety as possible) was my grandfather’s 1948 Plymouth. Weighed approximately the same as a Sherman tank, no power steering — but a steering wheel that could double as a ship’s helm to compensate — and three on the tree. One odd feature of the car was something called [fluid drive](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluid_Drive), which placed an almost-but-not-quite torque converter between the engine and clutch. This reduced the (theoretical) need to use the clutch other than to change gears. The owner’s manual said that it was possible simply to leave the car in third gear, and I suppose that was (theoretically) true — in which case **Beelzebubba** ’s '75 Granada would leave it in the dust. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/29 "2013-08-12T13:17:15Z")
> [@Beelzebubba](#): > > For years, the VW Beetle showd the a 1-2-3-4 arranged in the typical H-pattern. But they didn’t bother to share the location of Reverse and the ‘trick’ to engage Reverse even if you knew where it was! I’m not sure about earlier models, but the '73 VW my dad had, you had to put it in Neutral, press downward on the entire gearshift and then move it upward and to the Left (while maintaining downward pressure)…it was a pain even if you knew how to do it! They used that Reverse lockout for years and years. My '81 Rabbit was that way. I drove it towards the end of its life, and the shift linkage had gotten so sloppy that you couldn’t move the shifter far enough left to get into 1st without pushing down as if to go into R. Then it was a bit of a crapshoot as to which gear you’d get. Fortunately it was a diesel, so you could just start in second - unlike most of the stupidly underpowered 4 cyl. cars of that era, it developed a fair number of its puny horses at low rpms. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/30 "2013-08-12T13:57:54Z")
> [@Beelzebubba](#): > > Anyway…even among the rather small minority of us drivers who can drive a vehicle with a manual transmission, I have never driven a column-mounted manual shift (most commonly a 3-speed manual and largely phased out in by the mid-to-late 70s, maybe a few years later in pickups). There isn’t a shift diagram like you find on the shift knob of a floor-mounted manual shifter. As with any manual, once you drive it a few minutes you’ll never even look at the shift diagram again…until you drive a 6-speed for the first time and need to figure out where they hell REVERSE has gone! But left to my own devices, if handed the keys to a 3-speed manual on the column, it would take me quite a bit of trial and error to figure out where each gear is located…and I’d probably end up making a 2nd to R shift and leave the tranny laying on the ground at some point unless they had a some sort of primitive lockout for that. I drove a three-on-the-tree a couple times; my grandparents’ Ford pickup. I’d only had my license a few years, and had only driven one or two other manuals. It wasn’t too hard, though. For a new challenge, try a Porsche sometime. I don’t know if it’s true on all of them, but my dad’s 928 had reverse where you’d expect first to be, first where you’d expect second, etc. I think the idea is that in a sports car you’ll save a split second because the 2nd-to-3rd and 4th-to-5th shifts are straight back. Tough to autocross though, because you have that dogleg shift between 1st and 2nd. ---
**Author:** ![JerrySTL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e274bd/32.png) [@JerrySTL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerrySTL)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/31 "2013-08-12T14:01:16Z")
I had an 1962 Chevy with a 3-on-the-tree. It’s was sloppy and jammed quite a bit. After about 6 months I converted it to a floor shifter. Besides the USA, I lived in England for 4 years. Therefore I can shift with both my left and right hands. My bicycle is a 30-speed. Considering how little power my bike’s ‘engine’ (AKA me) has, I have to shift a lot. ---
**Author:** ![BubbaDog](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bubbadog/32/333_2.png) [@BubbaDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BubbaDog)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/32 "2013-08-12T14:16:53Z")
> [@JerrySTL](#): > > I had an 1962 Chevy with a 3-on-the-tree. It’s was sloppy and jammed quite a bit. … I carried a 2 foot piece of broomstick in my 69 Nova. It came in handy when the linkage got locked up. I could put the end of the broomstick on one of the link paddles, whack the other end of the broomstick with my palm, and usually unlock the linkage. I also carried a clean rag in case I had to go extra dirty and grab one of the linkage rods to untangle it. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/33 "2013-08-12T14:16:55Z")
On my first attempt to learn to drive in 1966 with my dad’s 1958 Chevy station wagon, standard column shift, I inadvertently turned left towards the ditch as I pulled down on the lever to shift up… Fortunately I recovered just in time. Now what is interesting to me in this case is that I had just explained this episode to my daughter last night as I drove her to the pub in her new 2013 Toyota Corolla, manual transmission, standard floor shift. I was forgetting to use the clutch at stops and had to relearn the co-ordination with the clutch and stick shift upon taking off. Neither her or her companion had any idea that there was such a thing as a column shift. ---
**Author:** ![california\_jobcase](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9d8465/32.png) [@california\_jobcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/california_jobcase)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/34 "2013-08-12T14:43:29Z")
I had a '67 Dodge Dart with a three on the tree. I currently have two vehicles with five speed manuals- '08 Yaris and '09 Ranger. As an aside, I had a friend who owned a '77 Camaro with a straight six and three-speed manual. That car had the worst starting interlock I have ever seen- to start it, it had to be in reverse with the clutch disengaged (pedal shoved down). OK, the clutch is a no-brainer, but in reverse? Imagine stalling in an intersection. You couldn’t coast and turn the key to restart- you had to stop to put the damn thing in REVERSE before you could start it. If that were my car, the reverse start switch part would have been disabled the day it came off the lot. ---
**Author:** ![JerrySTL](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e274bd/32.png) [@JerrySTL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerrySTL)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/35 "2013-08-12T14:50:09Z")
I just remembered another thing about my '62 Chevy with the 3-tree: first gear was unsynchronized. You had to come to a complete stop to engage first or know how to blip the throttle to match engine speed to road speed while downshifting. ---
**Author:** ![Beelzebubba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Beelzebubba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beelzebubba)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/36 "2013-08-12T14:53:21Z")
> [@OttoDaFe](#): > > One of the cars I learned to drive on (my father insisted we learn on as wide a variety as possible) was my grandfather’s 1948 Plymouth. Weighed approximately the same as a Sherman tank, no power steering — but a steering wheel that could double as a ship’s helm to compensate — and three on the tree. > > One odd feature of the car was something called [fluid drive](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fluid_Drive), which placed an almost-but-not-quite torque converter between the engine and clutch. This reduced the (theoretical) need to use the clutch other than to change gears. The owner’s manual said that it was possible simply to leave the car in third gear, and I suppose that was (theoretically) true — in which case **Beelzebubba** ’s '75 Granada would leave it in the dust. Actually, there was an EVEN slower version of the Granada, a glacier could outrun it! The larger 250 (4.1L) Thriftpower Six was only rated at 81hp (6hp more than than 200) but it was available with the 3-speed Cruise-O-Matic automatic transmission! Ford stated a 0-60 time of 26.8 seconds for it…so that means well over 30 seconds…it’s hard to fathom Even though I’ll always be a manual transmission devotee, I must admit there are four things I love about my first automatic transmission vehicle- 1- It has an Aisin 6-speed Automatic that is more responsive than any automatic I’ve ever experienced (mostly in rental cars and vehicles of family members). But it always seems to be in the right gear and you can’t catch the thing flat-footed! 2- When you’re going downhill, a slight tap on the brake will cause it to downshift from 6th to 5th gear for engine braking, much like an HD pickup truck with a tow/haul mode. 3- TORQUE! 3.7L V6 270lb-ft @ 4250rpm, can be going 40-45mph in 6th gear and even a slight grade doesn’t require a downshift to maintain my speed. 4- HORSEPOWER- 273hp @ 6250rpm, quick off the l line from a stop, but truly impressive at highway speeds- going 65mph on the highway in 6th, floor it and it’ll drop two or even three gears and take off like a bat out of hell… Bonus 5th- I’m glad it doesn’t have a freakin’ column shifter! I never cared for automatics on the column, like my grandma’s Buick Electra and mom’s Olds Cutlass Supreme had…although I don’t care for the stupid ‘gated’ (a maze if you ask me) shifter in my CX-9, needlessly complicating something so simple really pisses me off!!! ---
**Author:** ![Sahirrnee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sahirrnee/32/13937_2.png) [@Sahirrnee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sahirrnee)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/37 "2013-08-12T14:54:13Z")
I learned to drive a stick on my father’s Chevy van. It was three on the tree and I was all of 5’2" and barely 100 pounds. I had to almost stand up to drive it. Later I got my little Chevy LUV which was a lot easier to drive being that it was more ‘my size’. My uncle used to tease me and call it a Tonka Toy. It had 4 on the floor and I loved that little truck. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/38 "2013-08-12T14:55:10Z")
I’ve never driven a column-shifted manual, but almost every one of my daily driver vehicles has been manual, from a 4-speed MGB to a 6-speed Mazdaspeed3. I had relatives with column-shifted vehicles, including my dad’s sweet 70-something brown Dodge van with the yellow shag carpeting. ---
**Author:** ![Pai325](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pai325](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pai325)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/39 "2013-08-12T14:57:52Z")
Yes, I learned both stick and automatic in drivers ed. My daughter, however, did not learn to drive a stick in school and my attempts at teaching her were unsuccessful. ---
**Author:** ![Beelzebubba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Beelzebubba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beelzebubba)\ **Post date:** [August 12, 2013, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011/40 "2013-08-12T15:18:02Z")
> [@Pai325](#): > > Yes, I learned both stick and automatic in drivers ed. My daughter, however, did not learn to drive a stick in school and my attempts at teaching her were unsuccessful. Let me preface my comment by saying that it is in NO WAY intended to be sexist, just an observation based on my personal experiences- I’ve taugtht quite a few people (or attempted to, at least) how to drive a manual over the years. My experience has been that if women are going to ‘get it’, they are amazingly quick learners and pick it up very quickly! Guys will just keep on and on until they burn out a clutch, strip out a few gears or eventually make the the damn thing keep moving…and even after a few years, some still can’t shift smoothly or even do a smooth launch… But I haven’t taught anyone in a long time because, to be blunt, I hated it! :dubious: If anyone asks me to teach the now, I usually say YES…but NOT in my car!!! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/did-you-ever-learn-to-drive-a-column-shifted-manual-transmission-3-on-the-tree/666011.md?page=3)