# Dio, at it again and raising the bar **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 20, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888 "2010-06-20T18:19:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/301 "2010-06-22T00:35:36Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > Cite for what? That Dio generally has a liberal political viewpoint? I thought that was common knowledge. Or that I generally have a liberal political viewpoint, and that’s why I usually agree with his politics? I’m telling you that now. (psst–notice what he bolded, and then C&P: :smack: ) ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/302 "2010-06-22T01:00:40Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > It’s a discourse problem. People don’t have to be people on the Interwebs, and they don’t have to treat other people as people. They can be indignant blowhards and treat anyone who disagrees with them like no-account losers. There’s no accountability because nobody knows who you are. You can make any outrageous claim you want – who’s going to call you on it? I begin to think the point of participating isn’t even to talk about x, and definitely not fight ignorance. It’s to blow off steam. The way some people use the road to be assholes, other people use a discussion board. At least nobody gets hurt. > > It’s amusing to think that any two people might actually be brothers. Or colleagues. Or neighbors. They have a pleasant exchange then go inside and call each other names. Good premise for a book, maybe. Are you sure you’re related to Dio? You seem … normal. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/303 "2010-06-22T01:03:20Z")
> [@Wile\_E](#): > > Are you sure you’re related to Dio? You seem … normal. Meiosis is tricky that way, those damn chromosomal crossovers. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/304 "2010-06-22T02:49:08Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > (psst–notice what he bolded, and then C&P: :smack: ) I guess I just don’t understand – there’s nothing to cite, as all I stated was an opinion: I don’t agree with conservatives, but I don’t agree with people who think in blank-and-white terms even more. Maybe there’s some confusion because I accidentally capitalized the word “conservative”. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/305 "2010-06-22T03:00:35Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > I guess I just don’t understand – there’s nothing to cite, as all I stated was an opinion: I don’t agree with conservatives, but I don’t agree with people who think in blank-and-white terms even more. > > Maybe there’s some confusion because I accidentally capitalized the word “conservative”. He was jokingly asking you to provide a “cite” that there is a such thing as “conservative thinking.” ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/306 "2010-06-22T04:19:11Z")
> [@Bearflag70](#): > > Hey, **Dio** , [this one’s for you](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ytCEuuW2_A). > > 🙂 Man, this is still killing me. What about [this one.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iMpXAknykeg) Your sound effect is better, though. Mine is generic. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/307 "2010-06-22T04:59:55Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Do you go around asking people this when you meet them? You must be a hit at parties. Lessee - another crispy critter is reported in the news, various parents weigh in with various opinions as to whether or not the one who left the kid in the car is at fault/should be punished/etc. OTOH, a dog gets fried at a show and the comments I hear are all essentially the same - “how can anyone do something that stupid?” No need for a poll, but then I’d think you would know that. > [@Mighty\_Girl](#): > > Bolding mine > > Nobody is making excuses for parents that go do their hair at the beauty salon and leave their kids in the car (which actually happened once). That is not what we are talking about. 😕 It’s ok to leave the kid in the car at the office but not the beauty salon? Or do you think it is only neglectful if they knowingly leave the kid in the car? ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/308 "2010-06-22T05:15:00Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > Lessee - another crispy critter is reported in the news, various parents weigh in with various opinions as to whether or not the one who left the kid in the car is at fault/should be punished/etc. OTOH, a dog gets fried at a show and the comments I hear are all essentially the same - “how can anyone do something that stupid?” Every time you’ve brought up your dog show friends they have come off as a bunch of over-privileged judgmental hags, so I’m not surprised that they would react that way. You have no compassion at all for an accident? What if someone drops their dog, or steps on its paw, or catches its tail in the door? All those things could result in injuries to the dog, and all can be caused by a moments inattention. And, ignoring the fact that you are a stone-hearted monster for a moment, how do you interpret the fact that many of these parents are \*not \*found guilty of criminal neglect, and I’m sure the unfortunate dog owner is seldom charged with animal cruelty. Of course, all of the above is irrelevant if you are talking about people who \*deliberately \*left their dogs in the car, and I suspect you are (due to the aforementioned differences between a dog and a baby, and the fact that when you drive to a dog show, surely you are expected to exit the car bearing a dog). If that is the case then these people are responding to a completely different situation than that which is being discussed in these two threads, rendering your entire post meaningless. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/309 "2010-06-22T05:22:21Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > First off, by ackowledging that you need a note, you are acknowledging that this is a piece of information that you might forget. I didn’t say I needed a note to check my car for the presence of dogs before I leave it, since something like that is on top of my mind and is as much a habit as making sure I don’t lock myself out of the car, or to remember to take my purse. What I said was if I found myself to be capable of “zoning” out on something, I’d leave myself a note or something like that to make sure I remembered the whateveritis. > [@](#): > > And **Dio** and others are saying that it’s impossible to forget. As I said, I don’t speak for **Dio** , but I really don’t see how anyone can forget something they claim is so all important to them. > [@](#): > > Dumbass, the carseat is often fixed in the car and is there whether or not the baby is in it. Well, then, if having the carseat in there all the time is the reason you think parents who fry their kids should be excused, perhaps it isn’t such a good idea to have it there when it is unoccupied. > [@](#): > > The point is that these parents were not necessarily neglectful. Some might have been, sure, but if you read the Washington Post article it’s pretty clear that those were not neglectful parents. Nobody is saying "eh, what’s a couple of fried babies, who cares?’ people are saying that the deaths of those children were the result of one moments forgetfulness, a single terrible error with tragic consequences. The suffering of a parent in these circumstances is surely more of a burden than any legal punishment would be. We’re trying to show a little compassion - I realize that that is a human emotion you don’t understand, but read the article and you might feel an inkling of it. With all of the press on parents abusing and killing their children, it still amazes me when someone insists on continuing to believe that all parents love their children and must be suffering because of “one moments forgetfulness, a single terrible error with tragic consequences”. And it isn’t one moment, since one needs to leave a kid in a car for longer than that to kill it. How do you go from forgetting your kid for 20 minutes to a couple of hours, to “suffering”? ETA: I just noticed how far along this thread got, so if there were any other posts directed at me since page 2, I’m afraid I’ll be skipping over them. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/310 "2010-06-22T05:22:28Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > 😕 It’s ok to leave the kid in the car at the office but not the beauty salon? Or do you think it is only **neglectful** if they **knowingly** leave the kid in the car? (Bolding mine) What.. Do you even… nah! Fuck! :smack: Nevermind. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/311 "2010-06-22T05:38:18Z")
> [@Meyer6](#): > > Every time you’ve brought up your dog show friends they have come off as a bunch of over-privileged judgmental hags, HA! All humans are judgmental about some things, but dog show people are no more or less. Over-privileged? There are a few but most are just regular people. I realize it bothers you that a relatively large portion of society doesn’t think as you do, but that doesn’t make them over-privileged, judgmental, or hags (particularly since many are men). > [@](#): > > You have no compassion at all for an accident? What if someone drops their dog, or steps on its paw, or catches its tail in the door? All those things could result in injuries to the dog, and all can be caused by a moments inattention. Do you honestly think that those are the same things as flat forgetting a child in a car for upwards of several hours? An accident is one thing, being [neglectful](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/neglectful) is another - _characterized by neglect; disregardful; careless; negligent_ > [@](#): > > how do you interpret the fact that many of these parents are \*not \*found guilty of criminal neglect, Apparently, most of the criminal system think that no parent could possibly feel anything but overwhelming love for their children. > [@](#): > > and I’m sure the unfortunate dog owner is seldom charged with animal cruelty. You would be wrong. I don’t know about dogs fried in store parking lots, but those fried at a show (which is rather rare - I can’t even remember the last time it happened) are charged if the dog dies, and sometimes if it doesn’t. > [@](#): > > Of course, all of the above is irrelevant if you are talking about people who \*deliberately \*left their dogs in the car, and I suspect you are Why in the world would I? Who deliberately leaves their dog in a car when doing so is likely to kill it in the next hour? > [@](#): > > (due to the aforementioned differences between a dog and a baby, and the fact that when you drive to a dog show, surely you are expected to exit the car bearing a dog). Not as soon as you get there - first you set up. And you don’t let that work or gossiping with friends to allow you to forget to get back to the car long before the dogs would be in any danger. Also, going to shows is probably less than half the destinations I take the dogs to. For example, one of the them is a service dog so he frequently goes on errands with me, but on good days I go alone. In eight years of using a service dog, I have yet to leave him in the car when it is at all warm out. ---
**Author:** ![curlcoat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ea5d25/32.png) [@curlcoat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/curlcoat)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/312 "2010-06-22T05:39:38Z")
> [@Mighty\_Girl](#): > > (Bolding mine) > > What.. > > Do you even… nah! Fuck! :smack: > > Nevermind. Uh, sure. If you are unable to explain what you mean, I guess there isn’t anything I can do to help. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 5:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/313 "2010-06-22T05:56:48Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > I didn’t say I needed a note to check my car for the presence of dogs before I leave it, since something like that is on top of my mind and is as much a habit as making sure I don’t lock myself out of the car, or to remember to take my purse. What I said was if I found myself to be capable of “zoning” out on something, I’d leave myself a note or something like that to make sure I remembered the whateveritis. And how would you figure out you were capable of zoning out? By doing it _just once_, right, and then learning your lesson from it? But that _just once_ is enough! Seriously, I’m beginning to wonder if you or \*\*Dio \*\*even read your own posts. > [@](#): > > With all of the press on parents abusing and killing their children, it still amazes me when someone insists on continuing to believe that all parents love their children and must be suffering because of “one moments forgetfulness, a single terrible error with tragic consequences”. And it isn’t one moment, since one needs to leave a kid in a car for longer than that to kill it. How do you go from forgetting your kid for 20 minutes to a couple of hours, to “suffering”? The brain fart involved in forgetting something like this is only for one instant. The fact that they then left and time passed does not negate that. At that point the parent was not thinking about the kid in an immediate sense because in their mind the kid was at daycare. It’s not like for several hours they thought about their children every few minutes and wondered where they were and then just blew it off. Nobody has said that ‘all parents love their children’ - I highly doubt you would find anyone who believes that, given the cruel and brutal acts some parents are capable of. Many people have pointed out that there are stories of kids left in cars where it \*is \*clear that the parent was negligent (as in “oh, I’ll just leave little Snowflake here while I get my hair done, she’ll be fine!”). But some of us can see that in the Washington Post article (which I suspect you never read), there were parents who just made a terrible mistake. Do you really believe that they aren’t suffering? What about the one who tried to wrestle the gun from the police officer at the scene, in order to kill himself right then and there? Is that the act of someone who feels no remorse? The fact that you are trying to conflate true child abuse and deliberate negligence with the subject at hand tells me that you either don’t really understand the subject or that you don’t intend to argue honestly. I’m not actually sure which of these I think is more likely coming from you, but it hardly matters because both are unlikely to win anyone over. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/314 "2010-06-22T06:16:23Z")
> [@curlcoat](#): > > HA! All humans are judgmental about some things, but dog show people are no more or less. Over-privileged? There are a few but most are just regular people. I realize it bothers you that a relatively large portion of society doesn’t think as you do, but that doesn’t make them over-privileged, judgmental, or hags (particularly since many are men). This is hilarious coming from you - you’re the one who has such a gigantic problem with people disagreeing with you, especially when it comes to any mention of children. Anyways, if it makes you feel better I’ll take back the hags part. How does over-privileged judgmental twits sound? I stand by that assessment given the way you portray them and press them into service as a mysterious body that agrees with your bizarre world view. So if that doesn’t jive with how they actually are, it’s really your fault, not mine. > [@](#): > > Apparently, most of the criminal system think that no parent could possibly feel anything but overwhelming love for their children. You are such a dumbass. This is possibly the stupidest argument yet in this thread, and considering your competition that is saying something. I this is true, then why are there about 3 million child abuse cases taken in legally each year in the US ([cite](http://member.preventchildabuse.org/site/DocServer/Child_Maltreatment_Fact_Sheet_2005.pdf?docID=221)), the vast majority of which involve parents? Hell why do Child Protective Services and the Foster care system even exist? ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/315 "2010-06-22T06:21:27Z")
**Meyer6** , it’s _ **curlcoat** _ you’re dealing with here. Better brace yourself for a few days of mind-blowing obtuseness and verbal meandering. Anyway, you know the drill. Good luck hon. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Girl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7bcc69/32.png) [@Mighty\_Girl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Girl)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/316 "2010-06-22T06:33:23Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > **Meyer6** , it’s _ **curlcoat** _ you’re dealing with here. Better brace yourself for a few days of mind-blowing obtuseness and verbal meandering. Anyway, you know the drill. > > Good luck hon. 😃 I figured as much and decided to dedicate my time to something more useful and satisfying, like watching my toenails grow. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/317 "2010-06-22T06:45:23Z")
> [@Mighty\_Girl](#): > > I figured as much and decided to dedicate my time to something more useful and satisfying, like watching my toenails grow. Engaging in ‘debate’ with **curlie-girl** is akin to the sense of fulfillment that one gets from repetitive head-banging. Strangely mesmeric and comforting in it’s own masochistic way, but such a fucken relief when you finally stop. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/318 "2010-06-22T06:47:52Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > It’s a discourse problem. People don’t have to be people on the Interwebs, and they don’t have to treat other people as people. They can be indignant blowhards and treat anyone who disagrees with them like no-account losers. There’s no accountability because nobody knows who you are. You can make any outrageous claim you want – who’s going to call you on it? I begin to think the point of participating isn’t even to talk about x, and definitely not fight ignorance. It’s to blow off steam. The way some people use the road to be assholes, other people use a discussion board. At least nobody gets hurt. There’s some of that. But recall that the Pit is explicitly intended as a safety valve. The serious :dubious: work of fighting ignorance occurs in other forums. This has actually been a pretty funny thread. > [@Hentor](#): > > I disagree. It sounds to me, flipping around to the other end of the spectrum, like saying that everyone has a non-zero chance of compulsively checking that the stove is off. Even if I agree that the chance of anything could never be zero, in reality there is a proportion of people whose realistic, functional probability of forgetting for an extended period of time that their child is still in the car is zero. Stripping out the rhetoric, I suspect that we agree. The background probability for leaving a kid in a hot car is pretty low. And some are more susceptible to this than others. Those who are absent minded (like myself) suffer a heightened risk, absent deliberate steps taken offset this temperament. Still, most of us experience less than 70 years of adulthood or 25,600 days. Even at its end, most will not be able to appreciate that once in a million day crowning moment of stupidity. Yet by definition it resides in all of us: it’s just hard to get a grip on something that would occur only once if we had some 40 lifetimes placed back to back. Though to be clear, leaving a kid in a hot car might very well be rarer than 1/1,000,000 day chowderheadedness. ---
**Author:** ![Meyer6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cc9497/32.png) [@Meyer6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meyer6)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/319 "2010-06-22T06:54:27Z")
> [@kambuckta](#): > > **Meyer6** , it’s _ **curlcoat** _ you’re dealing with here. Better brace yourself for a few days of mind-blowing obtuseness and verbal meandering. Anyway, you know the drill. > > Good luck hon. 😃 Yeah, I’m done I think - I’ve been through the \*\*curlcoat \*\*experience before and I know there is no satisfaction to be had. I have better things to do - in fact I might join \*\*Mighty\_Girl \*\*in watching her toenails grow, if she’ll have me. It’s just frustrating to me to see so much ignorance remaining when this board supposedly exists to eradicate it. I can handle disagreement - hell, isn’t that why we come to the BBQ Pit? - but it’s the obtuse, foot-stamping insistence of her arguing style that gets me. **Dio** ’s absolutist stance annoys me, but at least he seems to be reasonably intelligent under that veneer, whereas \*\*curlcoat \*\*is as dumb as a bag of hammers, and about as likely to ever listen to anything anyone else has to say. Oh well. However I do enjoy getting to call people dumbass. It’s frowned upon where I work. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2010, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888/320 "2010-06-22T07:12:31Z")
Yeah, seriously, once **curlcoat** comes into a thread, you know it’s downhill all the way. Nothing at all to be gained by hanging around. It’s a shame really…what could otherwise be a lively (albeit heated) debate about [_insert any topic at all here_] ends up with our fave narcissist blithely sticking her virtual fingers in her ears whilst secretly enjoying the scorn she so richly deserves. And of course, the thread ends up being all about her, just as she planned at the outset. That she and **Doggy** share the same side in this one must freak the shit out of him. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dio-at-it-again-and-raising-the-bar/543888.md?page=17)