# Diogenes, go take a nap **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 19, 2010, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306 "2010-09-19T17:42:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 16
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/301 "2010-09-21T11:18:16Z")
> [@PlainJain](#): > > > [@Mtgman](#): > > > > Well, you could have left his daughters out of it entirely… > > I think it was a teaching tool. And a damn fine one at that. How **Dio** doesn’t see the comparison to his own douchery is beyond me. But if he was perceptive we wouldn’t be having this thread, would we? > > Still I’m glad **BE** did it and not me… because really, I thought about it. I do think this is a teaching tool, but very likely not in the way you do. Perhaps if you weren’t so drawn to group-think and prone to making justifications based on what the majority of people think or feel, you’d be better able to evaluate the appropriateness of individual actions. I can’t recall Diogenes ever taking a cheap-shot personal swipe at someone’s family. At least, that’s what we all thought at the weekly Diogenes Defenders meeting last night. ---
**Author:** ![MsWhatsit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/eb8c5e/32.png) [@MsWhatsit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MsWhatsit)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 11:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/302 "2010-09-21T11:52:42Z")
Is someone paying you $1 every time you use the words “group-think”? If so, can I get in on some of that action? ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/303 "2010-09-21T12:00:50Z")
> [@MsWhatsit](#): > > Is someone paying you $1 every time you use the words “group-think”? If so, can I get in on some of that action? Wow, if they were, I’d have two whole dollars! I think you’re right; it’s astounding that I’ve used a word twice in a single thread. Thanks for your observation. It’s as valuable as all your other contributions. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/304 "2010-09-21T12:57:15Z")
How was it a swipe at his family? That one day his daughters will be attractive is a “swipe”? Isn’t it more accurate to describe it as a swipe at Dio himself and his expressed hang-ups and hypocrisies? And this isn’t some bullshit rationalization, I honestly think you missed my point. But I won’t belabor it. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/305 "2010-09-21T14:02:48Z")
> [@magellan01](#): > > > [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > > > I don’t enjoy being pitted and never think about trying to get attention. The aspects of my psychology that get me pitted are honestly not grounded in attempts to be provocative or cause reactions (or get attention), but in impulsiveness, lack of filter (that may be getting worse with age), a few hair-trigger issues and a hyperbolic style that often comes over as more literal than I intend it to. I don’t post with calculating or long-range motives. I just sometimes pop off without thinking at all. I think people give me too much credit. I’m not calculating or devious. I’m just a loudmouth. Also, it’s a message board, so I can vent more colorfuly than I can IRL. > > I appreciate your honesty here. And I know you’re not alone in this. I suggest you print this out and tape it to your wall. Then when you find yourself getting into an “Is” vs “Is not” battle, read it. I don’t expect it wold give you pause in every instance, nor should it, but it might prevent the most ridiculous fights, which would improve things for everyone. And you mainly. I find myself turning into “crotchety ol’ guy” as I get older (my family just rolled their eyes when I proclaimed, in the middle of Gran Torino, that THERE was my role model! Hey, Clint does tell people to get off his lawn, too). What to do about it? I’ve often typed out a response to a GD or Pit thread, then _ **before** _\*\* I hit Submit\*\*, I go get a refreshing ice-cold beverage, pet the dogs, _then_ return to the discussion and see if I really want to keep blowing my own vuvuzela. My other trick is to keep reminding myself of a couple of basic premises: Experience Does Not Equal Evidence; If everyone thinks you’re being a jerk, you just might be one, even though you know you’re just trying to make a point; And, that we’re here to fight Ignorance, not each other. I’ll be watching this thread, because any advice for Dio is advice for me – and many of us. And I sometimes make my not-that-well-thought-out comments IRL! (actually lost a best friend with a witty-but-he-took-it-wrong comment… and the sad thing is, it was so hilarious that I’d do it all over again) ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/306 "2010-09-21T14:23:47Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > > [@Klaatu](#): > > > > DtC says “Infertility is not a disability just because a judge says so.” > > > > So the settlements are illegal just because a judge says so? :dubious: > > Yeah, that looks like a total fail to me. Judges can rule on disability as defined by the law, but that’s not necessarily relevant to disability as the word is commonly used. > > To extend the example, yeah the settlements are illegal because a judge says so (assuming he’s backed on appeal.). They may or may not be wrong (that’s a matter for debate) but they are illegal. Actually, in point of fact - a court ruling is only significant if the court in involved has jurisdiction over the persons at issue. The original statement was that the settler, a poster, was a criminal. Whatever the rights and wrongs of being a settler, this is legally silly, because the settler is not subject to rulings of international law - that only binds nations, not individuals. The extent to which a nation is truly 'bound" by international law, lacking a sovereign to enforce it, is another issue - one that can be debated seperately - but it is irrelevant here; as it stands, a settler is not a “criminal”, unless what they are doing is illegal under some local laws, because they are not as persons subject to the court’s jurisdiction. Such laws do exist in Israel, as there are “illegal settlements” (that is, ones lacking the relevant permits). Now as to the point on disability - true, a court ruling does not in atself establish whether something is or is not a “disability”. It is persuasive evidence, nothing more. However, the WHO also defines “disability” as consisting of things such as infertility. The weight of the evidence suggests that it is, in fact, a “disability” and considered as such by the relevant authorities. There is no evidence so far posted on the other side, save bald allegation. ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/307 "2010-09-21T14:28:02Z")
> [@digs](#): > > I’ve often typed out a response to a GD or Pit thread, then _ **before** _\*\* I hit Submit\*\*, I go get a refreshing ice-cold beverage, pet the dogs, _then_ return to the discussion and see if I really want to keep blowing my own vuvuzela. Or, if you are a troll like Diockless there, just slip in a few “No its not” or “Thats not what I said” style posts, keeps those plates spinning nicely. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/308 "2010-09-21T14:52:08Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > I am disappointed in the SDMB. 6 pages of this crap? > > What percent of those 6 pages has been “is too” “is not”? Is two. ---
**Author:** ![bucketybuck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@bucketybuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bucketybuck)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/309 "2010-09-21T14:57:39Z")
> [@Enderw24](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > I am disappointed in the SDMB. 6 pages of this crap? > > > > What percent of those 6 pages has been “is too” “is not”? > > Is two. Is nought. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/310 "2010-09-21T15:00:13Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > > [@Enderw24](#): > > > > Is two. > > Is nought. As it was all inevitably destined to come to. ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/311 "2010-09-21T15:44:48Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > > [@Enderw24](#): > > > > Is two. > > Is nought. I’m just trying to figure out _how_ you two planned this, and how long it took to manipulate the entire board to set up the perfect thread, and the perfect setup… ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/312 "2010-09-21T16:01:20Z")
Was knot. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![PlainJain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/5daacb/32.png) [@PlainJain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PlainJain)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/313 "2010-09-21T16:39:14Z")
> [@bucketybuck](#): > > > [@Enderw24](#): > > > > Is two. > > Is nought. Glolf clap, well played. ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/314 "2010-09-21T16:58:51Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Good timing! > > I was just thinking that if we dug a pit, and put **Rand Rover** and **Diogenes the Cynic** in it, then covered it with a device to turn self-centered, illogical arguments into energy… > > Well, let’s just say we’d have a shitload of energy. You might be on to something, here. Talk about a renewable resource! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/315 "2010-09-21T17:53:30Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > > [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > > > Well, if you like I can suggest you favour the opposite extreme, i.e. his daughters get religion, join a Catholic order, die after long lives as virginal nuns, having worked tirelessly for decades to spread the Word of Christ and discourage the use of Satanic birth control. > > IIRC, his wife is Catholic, and his daughters are being raised as Catholic, going to parochial school, and all that jazz. If I wasn’t capable of using some discretion and anticipating how my post would be received, I might say something along the lines of, “Well, that oughta make them total sluts.” But I wouldn’t say that, because even though I am technically allowed to say it, it would be jerkish. For what it’s worth, **Bryan** , I laughed at your joke (and got why you made it). ---
**Author:** ![Wile\_E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c37758/32.png) [@Wile\_E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wile_E)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/316 "2010-09-21T20:05:19Z")
When I saw this thread my first impulse was to make a snarky comment like “Dio is being pitted again? Why don’t we just have a sticky thread?”. Then I started reading the thread and thought about posting something agreeing with the OP but I thought that would be futile. Then I decided to have a sandwich instead, and it was good. So to anyone thinking of posting here, have a sandwich. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/317 "2010-09-21T21:47:11Z")
Well, there was the thread where he told someone that a miscarriage was not as bad as the loss of a child. Which maybe be true, but he did so [in the thread about said miscarriage](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=385511). He finds it [amusing to make fun of people with phobias](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6387279&postcount=148) On a lighter note, he believes the whole “[blacks have better rhythem than whites](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=9743260#post9743260%5Burl)”. ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/318 "2010-09-21T21:57:21Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > He finds it [amusing to make fun of people with phobias](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=6387279&postcount=148) That’s not making fun. That’s tormenting. What an asshole. He did “what any guy would do.” Bull fucking shit. This is the same guy who claims he would get on a school bus to confront the kids who were picking on his daughter, and yet he does arguably worse shit to someone else’s daughter. I used to love the guy but he has turned into a real fucking prick know-it-all jerk. He really thinks that he can tell if a phobia is real or imagined? Just because it seems silly to him? As if phobias are supposed to make sense? He has a serious superman complex going on. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/319 "2010-09-21T22:06:17Z")
> [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > I can’t recall Diogenes ever taking a cheap-shot personal swipe at someone’s family. At least, that’s what we all thought at the weekly Diogenes Defenders meeting last night. He takes swipes at lots of people and lots of families. Should it matter whether or not it’s someone who can answer back or can be recognized by something as anonymous as a screen name? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2010, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306/320 "2010-09-21T22:29:43Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > > [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](#): > > > > I can’t recall Diogenes ever taking a cheap-shot personal swipe at someone’s family. At least, that’s what we all thought at the weekly Diogenes Defenders meeting last night. > > He takes swipes at lots of people and lots of families. This is a fucking lie. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306.md?page=15) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/diogenes-go-take-a-nap/554306.md?page=17)