# Discuss rape and Game of Thrones HERE - HBO show only; no book spoilers **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 21, 2015, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510 "2015-05-21T13:06:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/21 "2015-05-26T14:29:14Z")
For many, the objections to Sansa’s rape comes from the difference between book plot and show plot. As this thread specifically forbids book discussion I won’t delve into it, but you can’t have a full discussion on the topic without it. All that said, I don’t object to the choices the producers have made wrt Sansa and this plot line. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/22 "2015-05-26T15:40:16Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > :rolleyes: Mmhmm. ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/23 "2015-05-26T15:42:08Z")
> [@Enderw24](#): > > For many, the objections to Sansa’s rape comes from the difference between book plot and show plot. As this thread specifically forbids book discussion I won’t delve into it, but you can’t have a full discussion on the topic without it. > > All that said, I don’t object to the choices the producers have made wrt Sansa and this plot line. For those of us who have not read the books, it’s very possible to fully discuss the topic. “No book spoilers” is right up there in the thread title. If you feel that discussing the book’s approach is the only way to discuss the topic fully, you should go to a spoiler thread and have at, not whine about not being able to spoiler this thread. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/24 "2015-05-26T15:48:44Z")
> [@Bone](#): > > Ramsay pretty much rapes Miranda in the previous episode… It was rough sex - does Ramsay know any other kind? - but consensual, I thought. Miranda didn’t seem to mind in the least. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/25 "2015-05-26T16:12:22Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Miranda didn’t seem to mind in the least. Not the impression I got. She didn’t exactly look brimming with happiness, more unhappily tolerating what must be a frequent ordeal. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/26 "2015-05-26T19:08:13Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > For those of us who have not read the books, it’s very possible to fully discuss the topic. “No book spoilers” is right up there in the thread title. If you feel that discussing the book’s approach is the only way to discuss the topic fully, you should go to a spoiler thread and have at, not whine about not being able to spoiler this thread. Seems someone lacks reading comprehension. I don’t have a problem with the scene, nor do I have a problem discussing it. What I am saying is that there are other arguments to be made that go beyond “radical feminists using rape to advance an agenda.” And while I disagree with them, they’re still legitimate arguments to be made. These are arguments that are barred from discussion here which is fine. I accept that. But don’t pretend like you fully understand people’s objections when it becomes impossible for half the people to talk about those objections. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/27 "2015-05-26T20:42:43Z")
We really could use a new ‘rolls eyes’ smiley; that one kind of looks as though the smiley is _pleased_ with what he or she is looking at. ---
**Author:** ![amanset](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8dc957/32.png) [@amanset](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amanset)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/28 "2015-06-01T13:39:43Z")
> [@Enderw24](#): > > For many, the objections to Sansa’s rape comes from the difference between book plot and show plot. As this thread specifically forbids book discussion I won’t delve into it, but you can’t have a full discussion on the topic without it. > > All that said, I don’t object to the choices the producers have made wrt Sansa and this plot line. “For some”, you mean. I think you’ll find a lot more people have seen the show and not read the book than have. For them the book is utterly immaterial as they have no knowledge of what is in it. I was having just this discussion (the rape) last week with a friend that has only seen the show. She isn’t a radical feminist, but she had issues with that scene and the sexual violence full stop. Yet when I brought up Theon and the old lady that was flayed in the most recent (then) episode she didn’t seem to see them as bad, for some reason the concept of rape just brings it out. And the interesting discussion is why that is. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/29 "2015-06-01T13:44:20Z")
Anyone seen Outlander? The complaints about an implied rape in GoT seem quite petty compared to the graphic rape and torture in the last episode of Outlander. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/30 "2015-06-01T19:33:15Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Anyone seen Outlander? The complaints about an implied rape in GoT seem quite petty compared to the graphic rape and torture in the last episode of Outlander. I’m embarrassed to admit I have, as that show is as cheesy Harlequin Romance as it gets, but I was thinking similar thoughts during the many minutes (over multiple scenes) of on-screen raping action. I tried to imagine the reaction if those exact same scenes were between Ramsay and Sansa. My conclusion is that there would have been no reaction at all, as the people complaining about Sansa’s rape in GoT wouldn’t have survived the Outlander version of it. Their heads would have literally exploded. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/31 "2015-06-01T19:38:24Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > I see all the noise about Sansa’s rape as kind of akin to Gamergate: radical feminists using rape to advance an agenda. They are very clever in picking their targets. Sansa’s rape was just a horrible thing, Ramsay Bolton is arguably the most evil person in a show full of evil persons, so it makes their attack on the show defensible. > > Funny, I don’t remember a lot of fooforaw when Khal Drogo maritally raped Daenerys. You know why? Well, yes, but you don’t; because that happened in Season 1. Rape is something that can be used as a plot device; what people are becoming irritated by is the fact that “Game of Thrones” keeps going back to the same well. It may serve the plot to write a rape scene, but how many do you need before it starts to become a little weird? ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/32 "2015-06-01T20:07:22Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Well, yes, but you don’t; because that happened in Season 1. > > Rape is something that can be used as a plot device; what people are becoming irritated by is the fact that “Game of Thrones” keeps going back to the same well. It may serve the plot to write a rape scene, but how many do you need before it starts to become a little weird? Could be that marital rape shows up in GoT so often because a lot of medieval marriages involved what we would now describe as marital rape. GoT also shows lots of violent death, murder and torture repeatedly, much more so than marital rape. But people are OK with that. And I still maintain that the rape of Daenarys got a pass because it was done in a way that fulfilled romance novel fantasy rapes. Sansa’s rape was the opposite of a romance novel fantasy, her husband being a psycho who was seeking to humiliate both her and Theon by having Theon watch. That’s why it got all the pushback. ---
**Author:** ![koeeoaddi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/koeeoaddi/32/408_2.png) [@koeeoaddi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/koeeoaddi)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510/33 "2015-06-01T21:52:46Z")
> [@Evil\_Captor](#): > > And I still maintain that the rape of Daenarys got a pass because it was done in a way that fulfilled romance novel fantasy rapes. I wasn’t going to post to this thread since I am not a fan, but since you’ve mentioned it twice now I just wanted to note that this was the very point in the series where I smartly saluted my TV and moved on to other things. (“My moon!” Yeeeeesh.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-rape-and-game-of-thrones-here-hbo-show-only-no-book-spoilers/720510.md?page=1)