# Discuss this "letter to Dr. Laura" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 23, 2004, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634 "2004-05-23T10:57:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/1 "2004-05-23T10:57:25Z")
I only put “letter to Dr. Laura” in quotes because I have no idea if it was actually ever sent to Dr. Laura, but that’s what the email I got it in claims and I suspect if it wasn’t originally sent to her, it has been by now. This has been of particular interest to me because it is so unique. Most of the email glurge that shows up in inboxes is either non religious or strongly pro-Judeo-Christian. I checked the bible verses on [bibleontheweb.com](http://bibleontheweb.com), and they hold up, which is another thing that sets this apart from the vast majority of inbox junk. So, while I suspect I’m not the first doper to read this, especially since I have no idea how old it is, here it is: > [@](#): > > Dear Dr. Laura > > Thank you for doing so much to educate people regarding God’s Law. I > have learned a great deal from your show, and try to share that > knowledge with as many people as I can. When someone tries to defend > the homosexual lifestyle, for example, I simply remind them that > Leviticus 18:22 clearly states it to be an abomination. End of debate. > > I do need some advice from you, however, regarding some of the other > specific laws and how to follow them. > > 1. When I burn a bull on the altar as a sacrifice, I know it creates a > pleasing odor for the Lord - Lev.1:9. The problem is my neighbors. > They claim the odor is not pleasing to them. Should I smite them? > > 2. I would like to sell my daughter into slavery, as sanctioned in > Exodus 21:7. In this day and age, what do you think would be a fair > price for her? > > 3. I know that I am allowed no contact with a woman while she is in > her period of menstrual cleanliness - Lev.15:19-24. The problem is, > how do I tell? I have tried asking, but most women take offence. > > 4. Lev. 25:44 states that I may indeed possess slaves, both male and > female, provided they are purchased from neighboring nations. A friend > of mine claims that this applies to Mexicans, but not Canadians. Can > you clarify? Why can’t I own Canadians? > > 5. I have a neighbor who insists on working on the Sabbath. Exodus > 35:2 clearly states he should be put to death. Am I morally obligated > to kill him myself? > > 6. A friend of mine feels that even though eating shellfish is an > abomination - Lev. 11:10, it is a lesser abomination than > homosexuality. I don.t agree. Can you settle this? > > 7. Lev. 21:20 states that I may not approach the altar of God if I > have a defect in my sight. I have to admit that I wear reading > glasses. Does my vision have to be 20/20, or is there some wiggle room > here? > > 8. Most of my male friends get their hair trimmed, including the hair > around their temples, even though this is expressly forbidden by Lev. > 19:27. How should they die? > > 9. I know from Lev. 11:6-8 that touching the skin of a dead pig makes > me unclean, but may I still play football if I wear gloves? > > 10. My uncle has a farm. He violates Lev. 19:19 by planting two > different crops in the same field, as does his wife by wearing > garments made of two different kinds of thread (cotton/polyester > blend). He also tends to curse and blaspheme a lot. Is it really > necessary that we go to all the trouble of getting the whole town > together to stone them? - Lev.24:10-16. Couldn.t we just burn them to > death at a private family affair like we do with people who sleep with > their in-laws? (Lev.20:14) > > I know you have studied these things extensively, so I am confident > you can help. Thank you again for reminding us that God’s word is > eternal and unchanging. > > Your devoted disciple and adoring fan, > Jack Like I said above; whether it’s true in the Snopes sense that Jack is a real person that sent this to Dr. Laura, I have no idea. It is, however, true in the sense that all the bible verses check out and it raises some very valid points. So what do you think about this? Jews, Christians, Gays, innocent bystanders? Is it possible for someone to simultaneously believe in the infallibility of the bible / the God of Jacob and Israel, and still be pro-homosexuality? If people truly believe that the almightly guided the hands that wrote this book, then why aren’t these laws honored in today’s society? ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/2 "2004-05-23T11:15:59Z")
Because gays are _ickkyyyyyyyy!!_ and shellfish isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/3 "2004-05-23T11:19:02Z")
[Here’s another thread about it.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=26093) [and here’s a good post from another thread about it.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=488160&postcount=8) ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/4 "2004-05-23T11:21:14Z")
Well, I could rehash 101 GD and Pit threads. I could “wax elegant”, as an old computer science prof of mine put it, on the kindness and love an old friend of mine and his partner continue to show me and each other. Instead, I’m tired, a bit lazy, and I’ve got to get ready for church, so I’ll simply give you a [cite: Matthew 22:34-40.](http://www.biblegateway.com/cgi-bin/bible?passage=Matthew+22%3A34-40&NIV_version=yes&language=english) > [@](#): > > Hearing that Jesus had silenced the Sadducees, the Pharisees got together. One of them, an expert in the law, tested him with this question: > “Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the Law?” > > Jesus replied: " ‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind.’ This is the first and greatest commandment. And the second is like it: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’ All the Law and the Prophets hang on these two commandments." I’m a Christian, not a Paulian or a Levitican. I follow what Christ tells me is most important. I do what I believe God requires me to do. If you believe He requires you to do otherwise, so be it. CJ ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/5 "2004-05-23T11:33:59Z")
> [@Siege](#): > > Well, I could rehash 101 GD and Pit threads. I could “wax elegant”, as an old computer science prof of mine put it, on the kindness and love an old friend of mine and his partner continue to show me and each other. Instead, I’m tired, a bit lazy, and I’ve got to get ready for church, so I’ll simply give you a [cite: Matthew 22:34-40.](http://www.biblegateway.com/cgi-bin/bible?passage=Matthew+22%3A34-40&NIV_version=yes&language=english) > I’m a Christian, not a Paulian or a Levitican. I follow what Christ tells me is most important. I do what I believe God requires me to do. If you believe He requires you to do otherwise, so be it. > > CJ 😕 That’s a non-sequitur if I’ve ever heard one. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/6 "2004-05-23T12:11:40Z")
> [@Cisco](#): > > 😕 That’s a non-sequitur if I’ve ever heard one. It’s surprising, then, that you didn’t notice that the question posed in your OP was also a non-sequitur. > [@Cisco](#): > > Is it possible for someone to simultaneously believe in the infallibility of the bible / the God of Jacob and Israel, and still be pro-homosexuality? The logical conclusion of the thing you quoted in the OP is that it’s not possible to “believe in the infallibility of the bible / the God of Jacob and Israel” without being a hypocrite, i.e. a false pretender to virtue or piety. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 12:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/7 "2004-05-23T12:25:34Z")
OK, let me put it more simply. I am “pro-homosexual” as some would put it because I do not believe homosexuals are inherently more sinful than anyone else and I do not condemn them because I can’t see how it would appropriate for me to do so given the log in my own eye. Look, I really don’t have the time or the energy to rehash arguments I have made around here more times than I can count. Among other things, if I’m not able to consistently follow one of eight lines of harmony on a page for two anthems this morning, my choir director may give me something to _really_ repent of! :eek: Read the threads, OK? Do a search for posts by me or **Polycarp** in GD. Then, get back to me, but don’t expect me to change my views or call one of the finest people I know a bigger sinner than I am because an urban legend tells me to. When asked what the greatest commandments are, what our obedience depends on, Christ only speaks of love, not sex. To me, this means whenever I fail to love my neighbor as myself, including now, I am clearly sinning. If I condemn another human being for being attracted to someone of the same sex, even if that person never acts on that attraction, then again, I am actively committing a sin. Read the threads; read any one of the Gospels, then you tell me how a Christian can single out homosexuals for condemnation. CJ ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/8 "2004-05-23T14:04:56Z")
Pretty much what **Siege** said. The standard that she and I, and our church, goes by is that our duty as Christians is to follow the three or four laws that Jesus classed as most important, applying anything else in the Bible as it is mediated and interpreted by those laws. In other words, regardless of my own personal standards as to the morality of, e.g., eating shellfish, if I see someone else (say **gobear** ) eating oysters, I should react, not with the view that God prohibited doing so in Leviticus and I am therefore obliged to correct **gobear** of his sin, but rather follow the Second Great Commandment, the Golden Rule, and similar guidance in how I ought to behave toward him. She and I, and **skammer, Baker** and a few others, are sworn before God to “seek and serve Christ in all persons, loving your neighbor as yourself” and to “strive for justice and peace among all people, and respect the dignity of every human being.” Substitute “having gay sex” for “eating shellfish,” and nothing changes but the details; the principles on which we are to act are identical. To be completely thorough, though, it is only fair to explain the conservative Christian stance, which **Siege** and I do not hold to, in terms that do not misrepresent it. First would be the idea that there are absolute values of sin, specified in Scripture. And it is the right and duty of the Christian to attempt to bring other sinners to salvation by convincing them of their sins and the need to repent and accept Christ. If necessary, leaving those who insist on sinning to stew in their sins if they prove recalcitrant to this, it becomes necessary to influence society to remove from the ambit of legal, protected acts the commission of such sins, in order to protect others from being influenced to commit them. Now, how do acts such as having/administering an abortion or committing gay sex acts differ from eating shellfish or wearing cotton/linen blend clothing? Simply that in this understanding, following Paul’s teachings, we are free from the Law of Moses, which cannot bring salvation – but not free to sin but rather free to live new lives in Christ. The dietary, ritual, and similar provisions of the Law are therefore not binding – but the moral code underlying them **is**. In general, such moral strictures are addressed at least tangentially in the New Testament, and can be divined by Paul or James or somebody making reference to unrepentant sinners who commit acts that parallel the OT prohibitions. This of course is not what either Jesus or Paul actually said, but it furnishes a basis on which conservative Christians may selectively determine what constitutes a violation of the moral law while ignoring the provisions of the dietary and ritual laws. (I’d be quite interested in seeing how this threefold breakdown of the Law stands as measured against the Talmudic classification of the Laws, by the way.) For us, however, this perspective is dead wrong – not because it cannot be founded in Scripture, for it certainly can, but **because it goes flatly against the behavior that Jesus taught was incumbent on His followers**. Matters such as “Judge not, lest you be judged. For with the measure with which you judge you will also be judged.” The condemnation of the Pharisees for doing the same sort of legalistic interpretation of God’s commandments in Matthew 23. The underlying principle of the Parable of the Sheep and Goats: “Inasmuch as you have done this unto one of the least of these, you have done it unto Me.” And above all, what Jesus, following Hillel, insisted repeatedly was the core and full meaning of the Law: To love God with all of oneself, to love one’s neighbor as oneself, to act towards him or her as you would wish he or she acted towards you. Forgiveness, mercy, compassion…all that sort of thing. Like the conservatives, we are selective in our interpretation of Scripture. Unlike them, we are following the direct commandment of Jesus in how to interpret it. Finally, to address the last paragraph of the OP, there are probably as many schools of thought as to the inspiration of the Bible as there are people who have given it any thought. The idea of direct verbal inspiration is merely one of them, and not one held by even all conservative Christians. Most people see God’s message being gotten across in bits and pieces by His efforts to influence fallible human beings who could each accept one small piece of it, and promulgate that piece in their writings. So we see stuff like Leviticus as being the Israelite legal code attributed backwards to Moses as the lawgiver – just as the 26th Amendment, written in 1971, is considered part of the Constitution written in 1787 and ratified in 1787-89. We see Paul addressing the culture and conditions of Corinth and Colosse at the time of writing. And we do not blindly and legalistically take a given passage as binding in the particular language used in addressing what was significant there and then as carrying over to a different culture and situation today. Paul’s quite vehement – and justified – condemnation of those who enslaved boy prostitutes in Corinth and those who hired their services has little to do with what **matt\_mcl** and **Potter** , or **Mr Visible** and his partner, feel towards each othe today. ---
**Author:** ![TellMeI\_mNotCrazy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tellmei_mnotcrazy/32/3419_2.png) [@TellMeI\_mNotCrazy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TellMeI_mNotCrazy)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/9 "2004-05-23T16:54:24Z")
I may have missed someone pointing it out, but this is almost a dead ringer for an episode of the West Wing where Bartlet takes on a Dr. Laura-type who has taken on a notoriously anti-gay stance. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/10 "2004-05-23T17:20:20Z")
Since this letter is ostensibly addressed to Dr. Laura, and Dr. Laura claims to be an Orthodox Jew, not a Christian, then I think that Christian perspectives on the Bible would not be an applicable defense to how _Dr. Laura_ reads Leviticus. Really, the question should be how does Orthodox Judaism reconcile the questions raised by the letter quoted in the OP, not how do Christians do it. I have no doubt that there are answers and that _cmkeller_\* or **Zev** could supply them for us, I’m just trying to remind everyone that Dr. Laura is not purporting to espouse a Christian viewpoint but a Jewish one. ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/11 "2004-05-23T17:23:11Z")
TellMeI’mNotCrazy is correct - that’s straight from a West Wing episode. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/12 "2004-05-23T17:31:42Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > Since this letter is ostensibly addressed to Dr. Laura, and Dr. Laura claims to be an Orthodox Jew, not a Christian, then I think that Christian perspectives on the Bible would not be an applicable defense to how _Dr. Laura_ reads Leviticus. > > Really, the question should be how does Orthodox Judaism reconcile the questions raised by the letter quoted in the OP, not how do Christians do it. > > I have no doubt that there are answers and that **cmkeller** or **Zev** could supply them for us, I’m just trying to remind everyone that Dr. Laura is not purporting to espouse a Christian viewpoint but a Jewish one. Actually, in the second thread **Marley23** linked to, **Zev** does just that. CJ ---
**Author:** ![Hamish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a5b964/32.png) [@Hamish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamish)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/13 "2004-05-23T17:32:22Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > I have no doubt that there are answers and that **cmkeller** or **Zev** could supply them for us, I’m just trying to remind everyone that Dr. Laura is not purporting to espouse a Christian viewpoint but a Jewish one. In the first thread linked by **Marley23** above, they do just that. They pointed out that observant Jews _do_ obey some of these rules (the dietary laws, the rules for menstruation), that the death penalties can only by meted out by a Biblical court, that the sacrifices can only be performed by priests in the temple, and that Jews are required to observe the law of the land (regarding slavery). So unfortunately, none of it works for Dr. Laura. Feel free to apply it to any Christian homophobe, however. ---
**Author:** ![DadWagonDriver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/edb3f5/32.png) [@DadWagonDriver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DadWagonDriver)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/14 "2004-05-23T19:56:47Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > Substitute “having gay sex” for “eating shellfish,” and nothing changes but the details Since I lauged for about 10 minutes after reading this line, can I make it my sig? ---
**Author:** ![yosemite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/3ab097/32.png) [@yosemite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yosemite)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2004, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/15 "2004-05-23T20:31:29Z")
I’ve heard that Dr. Laura has [“abandoned” Judaism](http://www.somethingjewish.co.uk/articles/305_a_response_to_dr__la.htm), at least somewhat. Also: > [@](#): > > She added that she was envious of the Christian faith, and hinted at embracing it. Sad, because I used to listen to Dr. Laura (this was probably 5-6 years ago) and she wasn’t that bad. (I still disagreed with her on things and thought she tended to get grumpy, but she wasn’t _that_ bad.) In fact, she had a surprisingly tolerant stance towards gays, and often told her uptight callers to lighten up and mind their own business in regards to gay people. I have no doubt that she influenced more than a few borderline intolerant people to ease up in their condemnations of homosexuality. What has happened since then, I cannot say, since I stopped listening. I have to say that it seems weird to me how she seems to switch religions so frequently. When I started listening (about 8 years ago) she was _just_ embracing Judaism. And now she’s already done with it and wanting to move onto something else? Sheesh. I guess some people do continue to search and search all through their lives and I guess there’s nothing wrong with that, but it becomes disconcerting to hear them so _strongly_ advocate one faith (“This is IT! I’ve FOUND IT!”) and later go, “Well, wait, never mind. That wasn’t the right one after all. But hey! What about THIS one?” And so on. In regards to the Christian stance towards homosexuality, I agree with Siege and Polycarp with this one. I also want to say that I’ve got enough of my own problems, I don’t want to heap problems on other people. I’ve also got this “leper” thing going on. (I guess that requires explanation.) It’s hard growing up in Southern California as a fat chick with bad skin. I was treated like a leper—taunts from passers-by in cars, from fellow students, and so forth. I know what it feels like to be treated like crap for something that shouldn’t be anyone else’s business. (And I imagine that a gay person gets far more crap than a fat chick with bad skin!) I have no desire to treat someone else like crap for something that isn’t any of my business. I’d feel condemned if I did so. ---
**Author:** ![beagledave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6de8d8/32.png) [@beagledave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beagledave)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2004, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/16 "2004-05-24T00:02:55Z")
[Snopes](http://www.snopes.com/politics/religion/drlaura.asp) take on this. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2004, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/17 "2004-05-24T01:36:46Z")
> [@wmulax93](#): > > Since I lauged for about 10 minutes after reading this line, can I make it my sig? Be my guest – I haven’t been honored by a .sig quote in a long time! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2004, 6:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/18 "2004-05-24T06:11:22Z")
**Yosemite** , I have noticed that _several_ of the people whose insights I value most at SDMB have experienced rejection at some point in their lives. Maybe that is one of the things that makes you so _inclusive_ of others. I wish that Dr. Laura had her _stuff_ together the way that you do. ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [May 29, 2004, 11:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discuss-this-letter-to-dr-laura/246634/19 "2004-05-29T11:00:44Z")
> [@Munch](#): > > TellMeI’mNotCrazy is correct - that’s straight from a West Wing episode. Actually, it’s the other way around.