# Discussion for the Israel-Hamas War: A thread in the Pit **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** israel-hamas-war\ **Created:** [November 5, 2023, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653 "2023-11-05T21:57:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 103
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2041 "2024-10-25T00:03:57Z")
> [@InfraBlue](#): > > No. Not everyone doesn’t want it. You suffer from reading comprehension difficulties. It is imperative that you and the global community be relieved of your apathy, ignorance, cynicism, and resentment and shown the better course for your own good. A thesaurus is not an adequate replacement for thinking. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2042 "2024-10-25T00:08:33Z")
Meanwhile, in news that surprises exactly no one, it turns out that Hamas had a direct line to Al Jazeera, had at least six of their journalists on Hamas’ payroll, and dictated what Al Jazeera journalists should and should not discuss, what terms they should use for specific events, and so on. > **[Failed rocket launches and secure lines: IDF further implicates Hamas, Al...](https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/article-825959)** > > Cooperation ranged from prohibiting the channel from criticizing the terrorist organization to concealing incidents of failed launches and even establishing a secure communication line. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2043 "2024-10-25T00:30:19Z")
> [@InfraBlue](#): > > They want its establishment in all of Palestine. Yes, Hamas does want to establish its theocracy in all of Palestine and Israel. Quite the admission on your part. > [@InfraBlue](#): > > How is it “borderline antisemite,” exactly? What do you think would happen to Israel’s Jewish population if they came to be outnumbered by mass immigration from Arab Muslim states where being Jewish is punishable by death? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2044 "2024-10-25T00:50:34Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > What do you think would happen to Israel’s Jewish population if they came to be outnumbered by mass immigration from Arab Muslim states where being Jewish is punishable by death? In that scenario, the Arab Muslim states surrounding them would no longer be bombed by Israel, which as I learned on SNL this weekend would mean they’d be transformed into shining beacons of progressivism and all become gay. ---
**Author:** ![InfraBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infrablue/32/6366_2.png) [@InfraBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InfraBlue)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2045 "2024-10-25T01:10:02Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Yes, Hamas does want to establish its theocracy in all of Palestine and Israel. Quite the admission on your part. M’kay. > [@Smapti](#): > > What do you think would happen to Israel’s Jewish population if they came to be outnumbered by mass immigration from Arab Muslim states where being Jewish is punishable by death? We should do everything in our power to prevent this from happening. ---
**Author:** ![InfraBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/infrablue/32/6366_2.png) [@InfraBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InfraBlue)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2046 "2024-10-25T01:12:46Z")
M’kay. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2047 "2024-10-25T01:18:20Z")
> [@InfraBlue](#): > > We should do everything in our power to prevent this from happening. You’re the one arguing for Palestinian “right of return” - I.e. asserting demographic pressure on Israel until Jews are a minority and the state of Israel ceases to exist. Stop speaking in riddles and say what you mean. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2048 "2024-10-25T01:20:16Z")
> [@InfraBlue](#): > > We should do everything in our power to prevent this from happening. How about you fuck right off, and Israelis can worry about their own security rather than rely on the grace of the Great White Savior, Infrablue? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 5:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2049 "2024-10-25T05:21:17Z")
Pakistan is a multi-ethnic state. It’s one _religion_, though. And what actual question about it to me had I not responded to? And what makes anyone think I’m a fan of Pakistan, any more than Turkey, or Iran, or whatever red herring you want to wave around. Your _tu quoque_ attempts are beyond laughable. And when have I ever called Israel a theocracy in this thread? Take that strawman and shove it up you Zionist asses. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2050 "2024-10-25T05:28:01Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Pakistan is… one _religion_, though. Unlike Israel, but like Hamas’ state. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2051 "2024-10-25T05:29:58Z")
So, Pakistan - _not_ an ‘ethnostate’. Glad you agree ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2052 "2024-10-25T10:01:48Z")
Neither is Israel ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2053 "2024-10-25T10:22:12Z")
…and did I ever call it one? I mean, _ever_? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 12:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2054 "2024-10-25T12:36:35Z")
> [@DeadTreasSecretaries](#): > > Horseshoe theory I guess. I saw this meme yesterday and your post made me think of it: [![](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EhbMECwXcAEeehb.jpg) ](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EhbMECwXcAEeehb.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2055 "2024-10-25T13:36:54Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Meanwhile, in news that surprises exactly no one, it turns out that Hamas had a direct line to Al Jazeera, had at least six of their journalists on Hamas’ payroll, and dictated what Al Jazeera journalists should and should not discuss, what terms they should use for specific events, and so on. That’s not surprising. And also, that doesn’t excuse Israel targeting journalists. Armies pay doctors, and you’re not supposed to aim at them, either. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2056 "2024-10-25T13:43:23Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > And also, that doesn’t excuse Israel targeting journalists They weren’t targeted for being journalists. Did you read the article? They were Hamas (and PIJ) _militants_ who also moonlighted as journalists feeding Al Jazeera the party line. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2057 "2024-10-25T13:54:14Z")
Did we read the same article? It said the journalists were instructed on how to cover various news events (basic propaganda 101) and were involved in secure communication between Hamas and the news organization. That’s what journalists DO during wars. i bet the BBC has a similar relationship with the UK govt. And i wouldn’t be surprised if the Jerusalem Post does similar stuff with the Israeli government. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2058 "2024-10-25T13:55:44Z")
My bad, the first sentence talks about the six “journalists” being militants and is a hyperlink to the article that’s more specific: > **[IDF reveals: Six Al Jazeera journalists are Hamas, PIJ terrorists](https://www.jpost.com/israel-news/article-825877)** > > The exposed journalists are part of Hamas's military wing operating as the vanguard of Hamas's propaganda war against Israel. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2059 "2024-10-25T13:59:10Z")
And by the way, you are incorrect about journalists regardless; journalists, even civilian ones who aren’t directly employed by an army or militant group, can be valid targets under certain conditions. For example, if they are inciting crimes against humanity or violations of international law. (I don’t think that applies in the case of Al Jazeera, or Hamas’ pet Al Jazeera journalists, but it certainly can apply to some of the Hamas controlled outlets that exist within Gaza, under some circumstances). ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 25, 2024, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/2060 "2024-10-25T14:26:43Z")
> **[Journalist casualties in the Israel-Gaza war - Committee to Protect Journalists](https://cpj.org/2024/10/journalist-casualties-in-the-israel-gaza-conflict/)** > > The Israel-Gaza war has taken an unprecedented toll on Gazan journalists since Israel declared war on Hamas following its attack against Israel on October 7, 2023. As of October 25, 2024, CPJ’s preliminary investigations showed at... > To date, CPJ has determined that at least five journalists were directly targeted by Israeli forces in killings which CPJ classifies as murders: [Issam Abdallah](https://cpj.org/data/people/issam-abdallah/), [Hamza Al Dahdouh](https://cpj.org/data/people/hamza-al-dahdouh/), [Mustafa Thuraya](https://cpj.org/data/people/mustafa-thuraya/), [Ismail Al Ghoul](https://cpj.org/data/people/ismail-al-ghoul/), and [Rami Al Refee](https://cpj.org/data/people/rami-al-refee/). CPJ is still researching the details for confirmation in at least 10 other cases that indicate possible targeting. > … > **As of October 25:** > > 1. 128 journalists and media workers were confirmed killed: 123 Palestinian, two Israeli, and three Lebanese. > 2. 41 journalists were reported injured. > 3. 2 journalists were reported missing. > 4. 69 journalists were reported [arrested](https://cpj.org/2024/05/arrests-of-palestinian-journalists-since-start-of-israel-gaza-war/). > 5. [Multiple assaults, threats, cyberattacks, censorship, and killings of family members](https://cpj.org/2023/10/attacks-arrests-threats-censorship-the-high-risks-of-reporting-the-israel-hamas-war/). > > CPJ is also investigating numerous unconfirmed reports of other journalists being killed, missing, detained, hurt, or threatened, and of damage to media offices and journalists’ homes. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653.md?page=102) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653.md?page=104)