# Discussion for the Israel-Hamas War: A thread in the Pit **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Tags:** israel-hamas-war\ **Created:** [November 5, 2023, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653 "2023-11-05T21:57:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/501 "2024-05-27T15:40:20Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > it doesn’t take a genius to tell that Gaza hasn’t been carpet bombed and every Gazan has not been killed There were still surviving European Jews in 1945, why oh why did we persecute those guys at Nuremberg? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/502 "2024-05-27T15:46:49Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Grannies and 5-year olds being sniped, people being starved, hospitals destroyed - genocide. > > And “human shields” only counts as an excuse, _maybe_, if the person is actually directly holding them between you and them. Bomb a house of 30 with kids and grannies, to get one guy, and you can fuck off with your “human shield” bullshit. It’s as much of a lie as “never again”, fascist-lover. > . You can use emotionally charged language as much as you’d like, but it does not change the fact that Israel makes extraordinary efforts to avoid civilian casualties. I’m not saying _every_ effort, and maybe that is a valid criticism; but compared to the way other Western armies fight (and _certainly_ armies overall), it _is_ a substantial effort. (For example, I know it doesn’t fit the narrative so doesn’t get reported on, but 800k-1mil civilians were successfully evacuated from Rafah over a couple weeks before the current operation, despite American whining that this would be impossible without a humanitarian crisis and four months). Certainly the IDF takes more care than US forces generally do. And the common retort is always “well the US is guilty of war crimes too!” To which I say. You are correct. They probably are. But if you think any army has ever fought any war without committing any war crimes, you’re fucking delusional, and you need to grow up and face the real world. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/503 "2024-05-27T15:47:36Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > it doesn’t take a genius to tell that Gaza hasn’t been carpet bombed and every Gazan has not been killed > > There were still surviving European Jews in 1945, why oh why did we persecute those guys at Nuremberg? More emotional empty rhetoric. Come back when you have a legitimate argument. 🙄 Do you honestly think Israel is dropping bombs specifically to kill civilians? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/504 "2024-05-27T16:13:37Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > people being starved This is another _perfect_ example by the way. How many people have _starved_ in Gaza? How many of those died because of a general lack of supplies rather than having some super specific dietary restriction that couldn’t be met during the war? And compare that number to the number constantly bleated by the media with weasel words like ‘food insecurity’ that do not actually mean anything? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/505 "2024-05-27T16:20:44Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > You can use emotionally charged language as much as you’d like Mmm, be a human about things, or be a fucking robot about murdered old ladies and kids? What to choose, what to choose… > [@Babale](#): > > but compared to the way other Western armies fight[…]the IDF takes more care than US forces generally do Whataboutism. And … have you _read_ what I have to say about America? I mean, like, _ever_? “Barely better than America” is still a failing grade, guy. This is almost as pointless as your attempted _tu quoque_ about SA in the other thread (that you then didn’t repond to when pointed out because, yeah, you had nothing) > [@Babale](#): > > if you think any army has ever fought any war without committing any war crimes Comiited them? No. What I expect is for decent people (and robots) to call them out for what they are, not bend over backwards to defend them. > [@Babale](#): > > you need to grow up and face the real world Already took my licks fighting the forces of fascist racist oppression in the _real_ world, mate. And which fascist bootlicker army have _you_ served in? Or were you just content to cosplay a Brown person from the sidelines? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/506 "2024-05-27T16:21:18Z")
(_All_ of these claims are bullshit, by the way, but 'sTaRvAtIoN is the easiest to quickly and 100% objectively disprove) ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/507 "2024-05-27T16:22:14Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > How many of those died because of a general lack of supplies rather than having some super specific dietary restriction that couldn’t be met during the war? What the fuck are you talking about??? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/508 "2024-05-27T16:22:31Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > And … have you _read_ what I have to say about America? I mean, like, _ever_? Yes, which is why I don’t take what you say about Israel seriously. Your view of the US is a caricature. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/509 "2024-05-27T16:22:31Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > How many people have _starved_ in Gaza? …so far. > [@Babale](#): > > weasel words like ‘food insecurity’ Tell me you’ve never actually gone hungry from want, without _telling_ me you’ve never gone hungry from want. I guess it’s easy not to starve when you get to steal from others to feed your own. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/510 "2024-05-27T16:23:24Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > What the fuck are you talking about??? What the fuck do you mean? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/511 "2024-05-27T16:24:14Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Your view of the US is a caricature. What, that it’s a warmongering hegemonic state riddled with racists? Don’t fight wars for hegemony and elect Trumps, and the US won’t look like a caricature. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/512 "2024-05-27T16:24:51Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Do you honestly think Israel is dropping bombs specifically to kill civilians? Yes, I honestly do. Not all the civilians, but I believe they do purposefully target people who aren’t actually Hamas, but are otherwise bothersome, like journalists and similar. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/513 "2024-05-27T16:25:34Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > How many people have _starved_ in Gaza? > > …so far. So you believe Israel is going to starve significant numbers of Gazans to wipe them out? When exactly is this gonna happen? Or are you always gonna claim this no matter how things in Gaza play out and like any other doomsday cultist you will always say “Yet!”? ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/514 "2024-05-27T16:26:08Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > And compare that number to the number constantly bleated by the media with weasel words like ‘food insecurity’ that do not actually mean anything? May I ask what’s the media’s goal by misleading people? like, what’s the incentive? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/515 "2024-05-27T16:26:32Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Yes, I honestly do. 🤣 Alright dude. Eta: I doubt there’s any point asking you for evidence? ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/516 "2024-05-27T16:27:36Z")
> [@MyFootsZZZ](#): > > May I ask what’s the media’s goal by misleading people? like, what’s the incentive? Same thing it always is - clicks. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/517 "2024-05-27T16:29:01Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > So you believe Israel is going to starve significant numbers of Gazans to wipe them out? Yes. > [@Babale](#): > > When exactly is this gonna happen? Not soon enough for some Israelis, obviously. > [@Babale](#): > > Or are you always gonna claim this I didn’t claim this on Oct 6th, so obviously not _always_. I’ll stop when Israel isn’t, you know, stopping aid, or shooting people collecting aid. Oh and the IOF isn’t tipping your violent thugs off about the timing of food deliveries, etc. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/518 "2024-05-27T16:30:45Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Same thing it always is - clicks. You think it’d get a lot of clicks? Despite the possibility that it has the potential to alienate a lot of their viewers? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/519 "2024-05-27T16:31:38Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > I doubt there’s any point asking you for evidence? What, the IOF is going to give it? My evidence is that journalists are clearly being targeted, because they are being disproportionately killed in this active warzone compared to any other current one. That, and the sniping little kids and grannies tells me IOF murderers generally have absolutely zero conscience problems targeting obvious civilians. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [May 27, 2024, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653/520 "2024-05-27T16:40:03Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > So you believe Israel is going to starve significant numbers of Gazans to wipe them out? > > Yes. > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > When exactly is this gonna happen? > > Not soon enough for some Israelis, obviously. > > > [@Babale](#): > > > > Or are you always gonna claim this > > I didn’t claim this on Oct 6th, so obviously not _always_. > > I’ll stop when Israel isn’t, you know, stopping aid, or shooting people collecting aid. Oh and the IOF isn’t tipping your violent thugs off about the timing of food deliveries, etc. I’ll note that you _still_ haven’t answered my question. You are predicting that significant numbers of Gazans are going to starve because Israel won’t let aid in, right? Like, that is the claim you are making here? If so, _when_ do you think this will happen? Because you can _always_ say “Oh, no one has starved _yet_, but Israel is still trying!”. It’s weasely as fuck. Just like a doomsday cultist who always moves the date of the apocalypse forward so they can never be proven wrong. These claims that Israel is sTaRvInG Gaza started on Oct 10th. Starvation hasn’t materialized. I think it won’t; but I also think that for the rest of the war we will continue to hear people breathlessly shouting “Starvation! Genocide!”. And _after_ the war, despite starvation and genocide not happening, they will point to the people screeching that they did as evidence that it was true. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-for-the-israel-hamas-war-a-thread-in-the-pit/992653.md?page=27)