# Discussion thread for the Hamas Attacks Israel thread, October 2023 **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** israel-hamas-war\ **Created:** [October 9, 2023, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317 "2023-10-09T15:10:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 154
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2024, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3195 "2024-01-03T17:37:09Z")
Other than being an evil warmongering supporter of genocidal colonialists? /s ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2024, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3196 "2024-01-03T21:39:41Z")
…from Human Rights Watch: Israel have detained thousands of Palestinians both before October 7th, and in increasingly bigger numbers since October 7th. This report tells the story of workers held incommunicado for several weeks: > [@](#): > > [Israeli](https://www.hrw.org/middle-east/north-africa/israel/palestine) authorities held thousands of workers from Gaza in [incommunicado](https://gisha.org/en/illegally-detained-workers-october-2023-en/) detention for several weeks following the October 7 attacks, subjecting at least some of them to inhumane and degrading conditions, Human Rights Watch said. Thousands more remain stranded in the occupied West Bank without valid legal status and vulnerable to arrest. > > … > > On December 19 and 21, Human Rights Watch wrote to the Israeli military and Israel Prison Service with its findings asking for comment, but received no response, as of writing. > > … > > “They [forced me to take] off all my clothes…and they took pictures of me.…They beat me intensely, I was naked during this, it was humiliating. The worst part was when the dogs were attacking [me]. I was blindfolded and cuffed with metal shackles, I didn’t know if the dogs were controlled by someone or just left to attack me, I was terrified.” > > … > > [The Israeli forces] “made us undress,” he said. “[We were] completely naked. They handed us Pampers to wear and thin white overalls…. We stayed blindfolded and cuffed [with zip ties on our hands and feet] for 10 days… We kept asking why we are detained. We never got an answer, only verbal assaults and death threats.” > > He said he was beaten for hours, then dragged on gravel face down and attached to a wall or fence by his cuffed hands, and then beaten again: “Every time I fell on the ground I was forced to stand up, and again more beatings and I fell on the ground. With every beating and fall the plastic zip ties on my hands became tighter and more painful.” > > … > > On October 23, six human rights organizations in Israel filed [an urgent petition](https://hamoked.org/document.php?dID=Updates2378) with Israel’s High Court, which stated Israeli authorities had [refused](https://gisha.org/en/illegally-detained-workers-october-2023-en/) to provide any information about where workers were being detained, under what law, and for how long. > > On November 2, Gisha and HaMoked [submitted](https://gisha.org/en/israeli-cabinet-decision-to-return-gaza-workers-to-the-strip/) a second urgent petition to Israel’s High Court stating that “the detainees were being held…without access to legal representation” and allegedly subjected to “physical violence and psychological abuse, as well as…inhumane conditions.” > > … > > The released Palestinian workers [gave](https://arabic.euronews.com/2023/11/03/palestinian-workers-expelled-israel-devastated-gaza-arresting-torturing-hamas-war) media [interviews](https://euromedmonitor.org/en/article/5915/Tortured-to-Death:-Horrific-Testimonies-of-Gazan-Workers-Held-in-Israel), [describing](https://twitter.com/muhammadshehad2/status/1720539190402670871) [abuses](https://www.facebook.com/alarabytelevision/videos/1329648770986706/?extid=CL-UNK-UNK-UNK-AN_GK0T-GK1C) and degrading [conditions in detention,](https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/11/1/he-threw-up-blood-palestinian-detainees-face-abuse-in-israeli-custody) including being subjected to [electric shocks](https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/06/middleeast/gaza-workers-allege-abuse/index.html#:~:text=He%20also%20described%20how%20some,detained%20with%20him%20being%20shocked.), urinated on, attacked by dogs, as well as held for several days without food or water. Human Rights Watch was not able to verify these accounts. [Gisha](https://gisha.org/en/testimonies-by-two-brothers-workers-from-gaza-about-their-unlawful-detention-by-israel/) interviewed two brothers who had similar accounts of being [blindfolded](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/gazan-work-permits-missing-israel-b2432631.html), [beaten](https://www.middleeasteye.net/news/israel-palestine-war-gaza-workers-torture-abuse-detention), and held [without](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-10-26/ty-article/.premium/gazan-workers-describe-inhuman-treatment-at-israeli-detention-facilities-since-war-started/0000018b-6631-d473-a5fb-66f9fa930000) any [communication](https://jewishcurrents.org/gazan-workers-stuck-in-purgatory-after-israel-revokes-permits) with either their families or [lawyers](https://static.gisha.org/uploads/2023/10/Workers-letters-october-2023-1.pdf). More at the link. > **[Israel: Gaza Workers Held Incommunicado for Weeks](https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/01/03/israel-gaza-workers-held-incommunicado-weeks)** > > Israeli authorities held thousands of workers from Gaza in incommunicado detention for several weeks following the October 7 attacks, subjecting at least some of them to inhumane and degrading conditions. Thousands more remain stranded in the... Right now, at least, 8000 Palestinians are being held in Israeli jails, hundreds from Gaza, many more from the West Bank. An unknown amount of people are also being detained in camps in Gaza, with families having little to no access, many don’t even know if people are being held captive or are dead. > **[More than 8,000 Palestinians in Israeli jails, rights groups say](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/dec/21/more-than-8000-palestinians-in-israeli-jails-rights-groups-say)** > > Number held without charge at historic high amid intensified wave of arrests after 7 October attacks by Hamas ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2024, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3197 "2024-01-03T23:12:03Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > According to this from the Times of Israel they were: [https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/for-years-netanyahu-propped-up-hamas-now-its-blown-up-in-our-faces/) You’re referring to aid from Qatar to the Palestinians as well as an increase in work permits from Israel. I’ll say it again, Hamas is supported by Iran. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2024, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3198 "2024-01-03T23:18:08Z")
Netanyahu helped that money flow to Hamas. He could have tried to help other Palestinian groups, but he found it beneficial to help Hamas because that reduced the chance of an independent Palestinian state. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2024, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3199 "2024-01-03T23:55:18Z")
I certainly hope this isn’t true, because if it is it’s utterly unacceptable. Then again, I can completely believe Netenyahu pushing an idea like this. > **[Israel in Secret Talks to ‘Resettle’ Palestinians in Congo: Report](https://www.thedailybeast.com/israel-in-secret-talks-to-resettle-palestinians-in-congo-report-says)** > > Saudi Arabia has also reportedly been floated as an option. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3200 "2024-01-04T14:59:12Z")
[Depopulation](https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=Awrhdda0xJZlB58IaCxXNyoA;_ylu=Y29sbwNiZjEEcG9zAzEEdnRpZAMEc2VjA3Nj/RV=2/RE=1704408373/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fthemedialine.org%2ftop-stories%2fpalestinians-furious-with-israeli-officials-call-for-voluntary-emigration-of-gazans%2f%23%3a~%3atext%3dPalestinians%2520are%2520outraged%2520at%2520statements%2520made%2520by%2520several%2cPalestinians%2520living%2520there%2520to%2520leave%2520for%2520other%2520countries./RK=2/RS=CAfD0JYLOW1Fjo8w8oCZ0GBCBxE-) of Gaza has been the plan from the beginning. The link is from last November. “Israeli Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich said on Tuesday that Gaza could not survive as an independent entity and that it would be better for Palestinians living there to leave for other countries.” ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3201 "2024-01-04T15:04:27Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Then again, I can completely believe Netenyahu pushing an idea like this. [https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-denies-it-is-talking-to-other-countries-about-absorbing-gazan-immigrants/](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-denies-it-is-talking-to-other-countries-about-absorbing-gazan-immigrants/) Smotrich is the one making noise behind it, but it’s not a thing that would actually happen. > [@Crane](#): > > [Depopulation](https://r.search.yahoo.com/_ylt=Awrhdda0xJZlB58IaCxXNyoA;_ylu=Y29sbwNiZjEEcG9zAzEEdnRpZAMEc2VjA3Nj/RV=2/RE=1704408373/RO=10/RU=https%3a%2f%2fthemedialine.org%2ftop-stories%2fpalestinians-furious-with-israeli-officials-call-for-voluntary-emigration-of-gazans%2f%23%3a~%3atext%3dPalestinians%2520are%2520outraged%2520at%2520statements%2520made%2520by%2520several%2cPalestinians%2520living%2520there%2520to%2520leave%2520for%2520other%2520countries./RK=2/RS=CAfD0JYLOW1Fjo8w8oCZ0GBCBxE-) of Gaza has been the plan from the beginning You do understand that you’re doing the equivalent of pointing at AOC under Biden’s government and saying “See, the United States is officially banning meat and gasoline!”? ‘Smotrich Rants’ and ‘Official Israeli Policy’ are not the same thing, just like the existence of Jewish Space Lasers is not official US policy despite what MTG said. The fact that Smotrich or MTG spread their bullshit while dressed like government officials is undeniably a problem, but pretending that their national governments’ policies are fully aligned with the stream of BS coming out of their mouths is just crazy. That wasn’t even true of the BS coming out of _Trump’s_ mouth when he was president, although of course that was an even bigger problem (and he could back up his nonsense with Executive Action). ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3202 "2024-01-04T15:24:13Z")
Smotrich and Gvir are Ministers of Finance and National Security, respectively. AIUI, those are Cabinet positions, appointed by Netanyahu. That’s more like Yellen and Mayorkas rattling sabers, not AOC and MTG. Fully aligned? Almost certainly not. But they’re allowed to spread their hate while leading government agencies without public pushback. And to compare leaders of government loud Representatives is disingenuous. ---
**Author:** ![Crane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crane/32/3495_2.png) [@Crane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crane)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3203 "2024-01-04T15:26:31Z")
Perhaps so, but Smotrich, Ben Gvir and Netanyahu are in a position to promote the [plan](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/likud-minister-slams-smotrich-ben-gvir-s-unrealistic-call-for-gazan-emigration/ar-AA1ms5bj): " The “voluntary” resettlement of Palestinians from Gaza is slowly becoming a key official policy of the government, Zman Israel, The Times of Israel’s Hebrew sister site, [reported on Wednesday](https://www.timesofisrael.com/israel-in-talks-with-congo-and-other-countries-on-gaza-voluntary-migration-plan/), citing a senior official as saying that Israel has held talks with several countries for their potential absorption." This may be bullshit, but the world runs on bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3204 "2024-01-04T17:52:34Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > You do understand that you’re doing the equivalent of pointing at AOC under Biden’s government and saying “See, the United States is officially banning meat and gasoline!”? It’s a bit frustrating to keep hearing this. Who, in your opinion, is both making statements about the future of Gaza, and is in a position to make it happen? When we look at who’s in a position to make it happen, it’s people who are keeping their mouths shut. When we look at people who are talking about plans, we’re told they can’t influence what happens. Is it fair to say that any public statements from the members of the War Cabinet may be taken as illustrative of Israel’s official stance? Here’s what I’m finding on the War Cabinet (gift link): > **[Israel formed a unity government. Who’s in the new emergency war cabinet?](https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2023/10/12/israel-unity-government-netanyahu-gantz/?pwapi_token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJyZWFzb24iOiJnaWZ0IiwibmJmIjoxNzA0MzQ0NDAwLCJpc3MiOiJzdWJzY3JpcHRpb25zIiwiZXhwIjoxNzA1NzI2Nzk5LCJpYXQiOjE3MDQzNDQ0MDAsImp0aSI6IjA3ZTIzNDkwLTg2YjItNDFhMC1hOGIzLTY0OTY1OTgyNjJhYyIsInVybCI6Imh0dHBzOi8vd3d3Lndhc2hpbmd0b25wb3N0LmNvbS93b3JsZC8yMDIzLzEwLzEyL2lzcmFlbC11bml0eS1nb3Zlcm5tZW50LW5ldGFueWFodS1nYW50ei8ifQ.1czpGLPYzf_RrICd94Xat09PYSS0jGTg6CKiL2pVHiY&itid=gfta)** > > Opposition leader Benny Gantz and Defense Minister Yoav Gallant joined Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu to create a new war cabinet to oversee war with Hamas. So, members include: -Netanyahu -Benny Gantz -Yoav Gallant -Gadi Eisenkot (observer) -Ron Dermer (observer) Is this correct? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3205 "2024-01-04T18:00:01Z")
Moderating: > [@Chisquirrel](#): > > Fully aligned? Almost certainly not. But they’re allowed to spread their hate while leading government agencies without public pushback. And to compare leaders of government loud Representatives is disingenuous. First, i couldn’t parse this paragraph, so I reached out to @Chisquirrel. @Chisquirrel says that they intended to compare _representatives_ of a government to _leaders_ of a government. And also, agreed that they should have said “inappropriate”, not “disingenuous”. Just a reminder that it’s also inappropriate to accuse other posters of being disingenuous in this forum. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3206 "2024-01-04T18:29:43Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > When we look at who’s in a position to make it happen, it’s people who are keeping their mouths shut I guess I’m surprised that this is surprising to you. Morons who are there to bolster Bibi’s ability to keep himself out of jail run their mouths; serious adults do not. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > So, members include: > -Netanyahu > -Benny Gantz > -Yoav Gallant > -Gadi Eisenkot (observer) > -Ron Dermer (observer) > > Is this correct? That’s the war cabinet, correct. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Is it fair to say that any public statements from the members of the War Cabinet may be taken as illustrative of Israel’s official stance? It’s certainly _much more indicative_ of Israel’s official stance, yes. Some things (especially those said by Netanyahu) should be taken with avgrain of salt due to the context of him very likely no longer being in charge by the time “the day after” comes around. Which is the problem at the heart of the matter - I find the odds that the current government will be the one dealing with the war’s aftermath to be minuscule, and I think the politicians involved know this, too. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3207 "2024-01-04T18:47:56Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > I guess I’m surprised that this is surprising to you. ??? Political leaders engaged in major governmental actions (such as wars) tend to be public about their plans. Not their specific daily plans, but their long-term intentions. The government has been very clear about their goal of eliminating/disempowering Hamas. It’s weird that they’re being so close-mouthed about the postwar future of Gaza. The likelihood that Netanyahu won’t be in charge doesn’t remove the weirdness. _Somebody_ is going to be in charge, and it seems like it’d be helpful if the applicants for the job were a little more forthcoming in what they’d like to see happen. It may be because there are few good choices that people are being so mum. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3208 "2024-01-04T19:06:25Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > I find the odds that the current government will be the one dealing with the war’s aftermath to be minuscule, and I think the politicians involved know this, too. This terrifies me. Not that i want any of them in power. But they have a really strong motive to make sure the war lasts as long as possible. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3209 "2024-01-04T19:12:01Z")
A lot of progressives think this is long overdue. [https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4385866-sanders-calls-for-end-us-funding-netanyahu-immoral-war/](https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/4385866-sanders-calls-for-end-us-funding-netanyahu-immoral-war/) ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3210 "2024-01-04T20:19:52Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > This terrifies me. Not that i want any of them in power. But they have a really strong motive to make sure the war lasts as long as possible. Perhaps, but the only thing protecting them from being removed today is a sense that during a war is not the time to make political moves; IMHO if Netanyahu comes to be seen as dragging on the war for political reasons that strategy would crash and burn. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > ??? Political leaders engaged in major governmental actions (such as wars) tend to be public about their plans. Not their specific daily plans, but their long-term intentions. The government has been very clear about their goal of eliminating/disempowering Hamas. It’s weird that they’re being so close-mouthed about the postwar future of Gaza. Really? Did Churchill give speeches about his plans for post-War Germany at the beginning of the war? > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > The likelihood that Netanyahu won’t be in charge doesn’t remove the weirdness. _Somebody_ is going to be in charge, and it seems like it’d be helpful if the applicants for the job were a little more forthcoming in what they’d like to see happen. I think we will see this start to happen when politicians are jockeying to build a post-Bibi coalition (or even prepare for elections). I don’t think you will see anyone say “hold off on kicking Bibi out for me for now, but once you do, we will need a new PM, and that should be me because…”. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > It may be because there are few good choices that people are being so mum. There definitely are very few good choices. I am hopeful that part of the reason for the silence is that the adults in the room are keeping their heads down and working on opening up new diplomatic options, such as assistance from Arab countries in managing Gaza post-war while working on a permenant two state solution. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3211 "2024-01-04T22:03:53Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > The likelihood that Netanyahu won’t be in charge doesn’t remove the weirdness. _Somebody_ is going to be in charge, and it seems like it’d be helpful if the applicants for the job were a little more forthcoming in what they’d like to see happen. Ask, and ye shall receive! Can you ask for peace in the middle east (or at least for @Babale to get a few million dollars) next? Gallant issues some cautious remarks about post war Gaza, gets criticized for it: > **[Israeli defense minister: Palestinians will be responsible for post-war Gaza](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2024-01-04/ty-article/.premium/israels-defense-minister-palestinian-players-to-be-responsible-for-gaza-after-war/0000018c-d59a-ddba-abad-d7bbc7660000)** > > \*\*\* > [@](#): > > Israel’s Defense Minister Yoav Gallant told reporters Thursday that after the war in Gaza is over, “Hamas will not rule Gaza, and Israel will not exercise civil control over Gaza. It’s Palestinians who live in the Gaza Strip, which is why Palestinian players will be responsible for it, on the condition that they are not hostile toward Israel and will not operate against it.” > [@](#): > > According to the defense minister, on the day after, a multi-polar mechanism for civil rule over Gaza must be established, containing four elements: a [multi-national force](https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2023-11-19/ty-article/.premium/multinational-force-just-a-bypass-around-the-palestinian-authority/0000018b-e8ae-d6b8-a5ab-ecee5d580000), a Palestinian administrative mechanism, Egypt and Israel. > > The multi-national force, led by the U.S., Western European nations and moderate Arab countries, will take charge of rebuilding the Gaza Strip and serving as the address for international agencies interested in helping. > > The second pole will be a civil Palestinian apparatus, which already exists in the Gaza Strip. It is composed, according to Gallant, of local committees and factors that are not hostile toward Israel. > > The third element is Egypt, which controls a border crossing into Gaza. According to Gallant, Israel and Egypt, in collaboration with the U.S., are working on creating a way to effectively isolate and secure the border between Egypt and Gaza. The final element is Israel itself, which will provide information that will direct the civil operations of the multi-national force. Israel will supervise the entry of goods into the Gaza Strip. From what I saw, Netanyahu spokespeople basically said “We will decide this in meetings of the cabinet, not in the media - stop blabbing” while Daniel Hagari (IDF spokesperson) said “You’re giving our plans way to the enemy - stop blabbing”. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3212 "2024-01-04T23:16:40Z")
…any plan that allegedly involves a “multi-national force, led by the U.S., Western European nations and moderate Arab countries, taking charge of rebuilding the Gaza Strip” isn’t really a plan anyone here can take seriously. Nobody, not the US, not any of the Western European nations, not any of the moderate Arab countries have expressed any interest in this at all. It’s a sound byte for domestic consumption. Not an actual plan. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [January 4, 2024, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3213 "2024-01-04T23:56:10Z")
Egypt has actively engaged in the process of negation for all the previous engagements between Hamas and Israel. ---
**Author:** ![WreckingCrew](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wreckingcrew/32/4080_2.png) [@WreckingCrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WreckingCrew)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2024, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/3214 "2024-01-05T01:41:41Z")
Your comparison of the current Israeli War Cabinet to a single US Representative is utterly absurd. Yes, it is very likely that the cabinet will be voted out, but it is not guaranteed. But more importantly, they are in fact the current leaders of the Israeli government. What they say while holding those positions has to be viewed as the official opinion of the Israel government at this time. That is kind of the point of being the War Cabinet. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317.md?page=153) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317.md?page=155)