# Discussion thread for the Hamas Attacks Israel thread, October 2023 **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** israel-hamas-war\ **Created:** [October 9, 2023, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317 "2023-10-09T15:10:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 57
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1218 "2023-11-05T00:01:52Z")
That is good of you, the sort of thing I expect of a Moderator. ---
**Author:** ![Banquet\_Bear](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/banquet_bear/32/373_2.png) [@Banquet\_Bear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banquet_Bear)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1219 "2023-11-05T00:02:36Z")
> [@Riemann](#): > > So what? …I mean, this says it all, really. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1221 "2023-11-05T00:08:29Z")
And we believe hamas? I’m sure whoever decides to attack in Israel is aware that they may kill hostages, but hamas lies about many things. If hamas is destroyed, and new recruited members not armed, there will be no more hostages. ---
**Author:** ![Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/b487fb/32.png) [@Walken\_After\_Midnight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walken_After_Midnight)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1224 "2023-11-05T00:42:10Z")
> [@Is Israel an apartheid regime](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/is-israel-an-apartheid-regime/992614/3): > > _This will not end until Hamas is finished_. Hmm… > [@](#): > > There are additional trade-offs. Because the IDF does not intend to put large numbers of troops in the city, it has no practical way to prevent Hamas leaders from slipping away to the south. Furthermore, leaving the tunnel systems largely intact may allow parts of Hamas to live on underground beyond the current fighting. A remnant of Hamas surviving the war is at odds with public vows by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu and Defense Minister Yoav Gallant to completely destroy the militant group. > > … > > While the IDF is sure to defeat Hamas militarily, Israel’s ability to manage a post-conflict power vacuum is less certain. Israel withdrew troops from Gaza in 2005 after 38 years of occupation and does not want responsibility for governing the territory after the fall of Hamas. However, once Hamas is out, Iran will likely look to insert a more radical structure to keep Israel bogged down. Once the ground war is over, Israel must permanently solve the problem. > **[How Israel Plans to Defeat Hamas in Gaza](https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/11/03/israel-idf-hamas-gaza-war-military-strategy/)** > > The IDF hopes to eliminate the group’s commanders and infrastructure without fighting block by block or in the tunnels. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1225 "2023-11-05T00:45:26Z")
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**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1226 "2023-11-05T00:49:27Z")
---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1227 "2023-11-05T00:53:53Z")
Moderating: 1. I’ve moved most of the posts about whether Israel is an apartheid regime to their own thread. I left them in MPSIMS. I’m dubious the thread will survive there, as it is already sounding like it belongs in the pit, and will write more about that there. Also, the split of posts between threads isn’t as clean as i would like. But i did the best i could. 2. @Walken_After_Midnight, after discussion with other mods, i am banning you from this thread. I know this is a highly emotional topic, but it remains against the rules to insult and attack other posters outside of the pit. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1228 "2023-11-05T01:48:14Z")
I take it back. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1229 "2023-11-05T03:43:05Z")
> **[Protesters rally outside Netanyahu’s home in Jerusalem, call on him to resign](https://www.timesofisrael.com/liveblog_entry/protesters-rally-outside-netanyahus-home-in-jerusalem-call-on-him-to-resign/)** > > \* \* \* Toss him out on his ass. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1230 "2023-11-05T08:15:26Z")
Agreed. Can the Israelis then toss out Smotovich and ben-Gvir? And anyone else of that bent? ---
**Author:** ![nitter](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nitter/32/15360_2.png) [@nitter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nitter)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1231 "2023-11-05T12:01:31Z")
> **[Hamas Cofounder's Son Says Israel Should Gas Gaza Tunnels](https://www.thewrap.com/israel-gas-gaza-tunnels-hamas-cofounder-son-fox-news-video/)** > > “It sounds horrible, but I don’t see any other option,” Mosab Hassan Yousef said to Fox News' Brian Kilmeade Gas Man ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1232 "2023-11-05T13:05:04Z")
There is also talk of pumping them full of sea water, or sealing them with an expanding foam that hardens. I guess you could capture them as they claw their way out of the foam. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1233 "2023-11-05T14:29:14Z")
Far Right moron plays stupid games, wins stupid prize: > **[Netanyahu suspends Israeli minister over Gaza nuclear comment](https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-east/netanyahu-disciplines-israeli-minister-who-voiced-openness-hypothetical-nuclear-2023-11-05/)** > > Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Sunday disciplined a junior member of his cabinet who appeared to voice openness to the idea of Israel carrying out a nuclear strike on Gaza, where the war with Hamas is inflicting a spiralling Palestinian... > [@](#): > > Neither Eliyahu or his party leader are in the streamlined ministerial forum running the Gaza war. Neither would they have inside knowledge of Israel’s nuclear capabilities - which it does not publicly acknowledge - or authority to activate them. > > “Eliyahu’s statements are not based in reality. Israel and the IDF (military) are operating in accordance with the highest standards of international law to avoid harming innocents. We will continue to do so until our victory,” Netanyahu’s office said. He has been suspended from all further meetings. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1234 "2023-11-05T15:43:22Z")
There are some horrific videos making the rounds on the geolocator channels. I won’t link them here but they show bodies, shot dead, all along a roadway leading south. The guy filming blames an “Israeli airstrike” but the damage done to the bodies isn’t consistent with that at all. They’re scattered in a long row along a stretch of roadway with what looks like bullet holes in them. Now that the IDF is in Gaza it is trying to secure a humanitarian corridor south to enable evacuations. > **[IDF to open evacuation route from north to south Gaza Sunday morning](https://www.jpost.com/breaking-news/article-771741)** > > The IDF will open a humanitarian corridor to allow civilians to evacuate from northern to southern Gaza from 1 ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1235 "2023-11-05T18:35:38Z")
Is this confirmation that Israel possesses nuclear weapons? My sense of it is everyone believes Israel has nukes (and I would be surprised if they didn’t) but Israel has never admitted to having them (which seems a bit weird since I thought the main use of having nukes is deterrence). ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1236 "2023-11-05T18:48:16Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Is this confirmation that Israel possesses nuclear weapons? Per the quotes I included from the article, even if Israel _does_ have nuclear weapons, this guy and his party wouldn’t be cleared to know about them. So he doesn’t know anything that you and I don’t know, and he’s talking out of his ass. > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Israel has never admitted to having them (which seems a bit weird since I thought the main use of having nukes is deterrence). The main goal of nuclear weapons is deterrence. If you’re the US what you want to deter is anyone using nukes so you threaten global annihilation (MAD) and you have one nuclear doctrine. If you are France you are worried about someone toppling your global influence in Africa, Asia, etc so you threaten to introduce nukes into a conflict in a purely tactical matter as partof your doctrine. And if you’re Israel you want to deter your regional enemies from invading so you stay vague about if and when you mught introduce nukes to a conflict. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1237 "2023-11-05T21:11:30Z")
I thought the Israelis had built nuclear weapons with the South Africans (who destroyed theirs when apartheid ended) and when asked if the Israelis had them, only say, “We will not be the first to use them”. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1238 "2023-11-05T22:19:40Z")
> [@Babale](#): > > Far Right moron plays stupid games, wins stupid prize: Meanwhile, over on lefty Twitter, I’m seeing this idiot’s remark held up as proof that “iSrAeL iS dOiNG a gEnOcIdE” by the same people who still think Israel bombed that hospital. Sometimes the blind spots of the pacifist crowd just boggle my mind. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1239 "2023-11-05T22:40:24Z")
Which idiot? ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2023, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317/1240 "2023-11-05T22:43:22Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Which idiot Amiyah “Duke Nukem” Eliyahu up there. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317.md?page=56) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/discussion-thread-for-the-hamas-attacks-israel-thread-october-2023/991317.md?page=58)