# disgruntled vs. gruntled **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 2, 2001, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813 "2001-02-02T02:44:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![beckwall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b487fb/32.png) [@beckwall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beckwall)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/1 "2001-02-02T02:44:47Z")
if it is possible to be disgruntled, then is it possible to be gruntled? what exactly would that mean? ---
**Author:** ![dragonlady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/5f8ce5/32.png) [@dragonlady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dragonlady)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/2 "2001-02-02T05:17:28Z")
As a postal worker, I await the answer with impatience. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/3 "2001-02-02T05:31:54Z")
Did you ever consider looking it up in a dictionary? It’s in mine (Merriam Webster’s Ninth New Collegiate Dictionary - 1987). It derives from back-formation of _disgruntle_, and means “to put into a good humor.” (Curiously, “gruntle” appears to be an old synonym for “grumble,” so it would seem on the surface that “disgruntled” should mean exactly the opposite of what it really means.) ---
**Author:** ![Arjuna34](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/eb8c5e/32.png) [@Arjuna34](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arjuna34)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/4 "2001-02-02T05:38:00Z")
From [http://www.m-w.com](http://www.m-w.com) : > [@](#): > > Main Entry: grun·tle > Pronunciation: 'gr&n-t&l > Function: transitive verb > Inflected Form(s): grun·tled; grun·tling /'gr&nt-li[ng], 'gr&n-t&l-i[ng]/ > Etymology: back-formation from disgruntle > Date: 1926 > : to put in a good humor \ ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/5 "2001-02-02T06:20:13Z")
Okay, so Americans really **do** have a different kind of English than the rest of us folks … In my mother-tongue version of English, _gruntle_ is to grunt or grumble (from before 1425), while _disgruntled_ doesn’t mean “not gruntled” but “ **very** gruntled”! I think the language term is “intensifier” for _dis_ in this case, but that’s just off-the-top guessing. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Ryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7feea3/32.png) [@The\_Ryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Ryan)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/6 "2001-02-02T06:31:43Z")
If you debunk something, is it no longer bunk? ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 6:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/7 "2001-02-02T06:48:02Z")
No. “De” here is also an intensifier. You are “thoroughly” calling something “bunkum” or “bunk” ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/8 "2001-02-02T13:17:24Z")
On every cover of the Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers (Gilbert Shelton, Rip Off Comics) is the claim that there are millions of ‘gruntled customers’ ---
**Author:** ![Spritle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@Spritle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spritle)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/9 "2001-02-02T13:26:02Z")
Well, this is kinda long, but seeinz how this thread was about to fall off the page, I’ll post it. With no offense to the OP, this thread is probably not going to last too long so my posting won’t tie up that much band width. “How I met my wife” by Jack Winter/The New Yorker [Note: Remainder of post removed, for copyright purposes --Chronos] [Edited by Chronos on 02-05-2001 at 12:14 PM] ---
**Author:** ![DVous\_Means](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@DVous\_Means](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DVous_Means)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/10 "2001-02-02T13:52:36Z")
After that very long post, a short joke… Q. How would you describe a pig with laryngitis? A. Disgruntled 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/11 "2001-02-02T14:41:33Z")
The prefix _dis-_ at one time was indeed used as an intensifier (definition #5). Thus, as **Ice Wolf** has already pointed out, “disgruntled” meant “very gruntled.” This pretty much supplanted the milder “gruntled,” until someone recoined the word with a contrary meaning. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/12 "2001-02-02T15:57:57Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mjollnir \* > \*\*The prefix _dis-_ at one time was indeed used as an intensifier (definition #5). Thus, as **Ice Wolf** has already pointed out, “disgruntled” meant “very gruntled.” This pretty much supplanted the milder “gruntled,” until someone recoined the word with a contrary meaning. \*\* I think Cecil covered this question once and his answer pretty much agrees with the notion that the “dis-” prefix in this case is an intensifier, not a negation. In America we might say “gruntled” or “regruntled”, but only for a humorous effect. I don’t think those words are acceptable in standard usage, so it’s not like we have our own version of English. Really. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/13 "2001-02-02T16:29:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Ice Wolf \* > \*\*No. “De” here is also an intensifier. You are “thoroughly” calling something “bunkum” or “bunk” \*\* I think, but I’m not going to bother to look it up, that “bunk” is a noun and “debunk” is a verb. Intensity is immaterial. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/14 "2001-02-02T17:19:27Z")
More stirring for the stew. Take a gander at _ravel_ and _unravel_ the next time you open your dictionary. Ah, the hell with that. I’ll just post what mine says. **rav•el** _verb_ _verb, transitive_ [list=1] [li]To separate the fibers or threads of (cloth, for example); unravel.[/li][li]To clarify by separating the aspects of.[/li][li]To tangle or complicate.[/li][/list=1] _verb, intransitive_ [list=1] [li]To become separated into its component threads; unravel or fray.[/li][li]To become tangled or confused.[/li][/list=1] _noun_ [list=1] [li]A raveling.[/li][li]A broken or discarded thread.[/li][li]A tangle.[/li][/list=1] **un•rav•el** _verb_ _verb, transitive_ [list=1] [li] **a.** To undo or ravel the knitted fabric of. **b.** To separate (entangled threads).[/li][li]To separate and clarify the elements of (something mysterious or baffling); solve.[/li][/list=1] _verb, intransitive_ To become unraveled. So, you tell me. Is ravel not both a synonym _and_ an antonym for unravel? ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/15 "2001-02-02T17:39:40Z")
For “ravel,” the roots refer to “fraying” or “tangling.” “Unravel” would thus (originally) have meant “untangling” or “defraying.” But OED says in as many words that now “In ordinary English use _ravel_ is synonymous with _unravel_.” ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/16 "2001-02-02T20:42:21Z")
From _Chambers Dictionary of Etymology:_ “Curiously ravel and unravel have long been synonyms in the sense of disentangle, unwind, and antonyma in that ravel also carried the meaning of entangle, confuse. The apparent reason for this is that as threads (either literal or figurative) become unwoven, their ends become tangled. However today, the prevailing use is that of fray out, seperate into threads.” ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/17 "2001-02-02T20:52:36Z")
I know, I know, I’ve got at least two typos in my last post. Mea culpa. Hey, **Javaman** – what about “aluminum”/“aluminium”? That’s gotta mean a difference, right? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Pjen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Pjen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pjen)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/18 "2001-02-02T21:02:31Z")
Are we in danger of starting a new thread, although I’m sure it’s been covered before- differences between US and British English. Alunminum is an aberration- look at Titanium etc. However, in many ways American English is more regular and Britspeak is the aberration. ---
**Author:** ![Pjen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Pjen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pjen)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/19 "2001-02-02T21:05:23Z")
Alunminum is certainly an aberration and a TYPO. Read Aluminum! ---
**Author:** ![barbitu8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/839c29/32.png) [@barbitu8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/barbitu8)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2001, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813/20 "2001-02-02T23:57:48Z")
While we’re on the subject of apparent negatory prefixes, look at flammable and inflammable. They mean the same. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disgruntled-vs-gruntled/52813.md?page=2)