# Disney's "Encanto" (OPEN SPOILERS after first post) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** disney-hulu\ **Created:** [December 24, 2021, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601 "2021-12-24T19:03:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/81 "2022-03-14T23:39:34Z")
As seen in this delightful piece of fan fiction: [![](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/899424374673780747/938589721087594546/Felix_Pepa_Making_You_Laugh_So_Hard_You_Cry_Complete.jpg) ](https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/899424374673780747/938589721087594546/Felix_Pepa_Making_You_Laugh_So_Hard_You_Cry_Complete.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/82 "2022-03-14T23:43:06Z")
Reminds me of this one > **[Stephen Hawking](https://xkcd.com/799/)** > > 'Guys? The Town is supposed to be good, and I thou--' 'PHYSICIST STEPHEN HAWKING DECLARES NEW FILM BEST IN ALL SPACE AND TIME' 'No, I just heard that--' 'SHOULD SCIENCE PLAY A ROLE IN JUDGING BEN AFFLECK?' 'I don't think--' 'WHAT ABOUT MATT DAMON?' and this one > **[Einstein](https://xkcd.com/1206/)** > > Einstein was WRONG when he said that provisional patent #39561 represented a novel gravel-sorting technique and should be approved by the Patent Office. Everything Einstein and Hawking say is not profound and everything Bruno says is not an official prophecy. ---
**Author:** ![psychobunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/54ee81/32.png) [@psychobunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychobunny)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2022, 11:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/83 "2022-05-15T11:42:27Z")
OK just watched this and I cannot get over the abuse of the donkeys. I love Luisa but she actually kicks one up in the air. She also throws them around a lot. Meanwhile they are being great back-up dancers. Look at them at the beginning of Surface Pressure. They see her get angry and they are all backing away. They know that they are about to be abused. I am surprised that nobody is sticking up for the poor donkeys. ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2022, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/84 "2022-05-15T22:20:24Z")
> [@psychobunny](#): > > OK just watched this and I cannot get over the abuse of the donkeys. #DonkeyLivesMatter ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2022, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/85 "2022-05-15T22:37:25Z")
So I guess you won’t be buying any merchandise featuring her, like a donkey ho tee. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/86 "2022-05-16T01:44:35Z")
Just got around to watching this a couple days ago (yay, depression). I feel like saying that the movie should have ended with the rest of the Madrigals not getting their gifts back rather misses the point. The gifts are _good_ (mostly¹). Two aspects of how people (mostly Abuela Alma²) people _treat_ being gifted are bad - putting pressure on the people who have the gifts (Luisa, Isabela, and Pepa feel it worst³), and dismissing the ability of people who don’t have them (primarily Mirabel) to contribute. And it’s also made clear that the magic came from love - it came to be in response to Abuelo Pedro sacrificing himself to protect his family and the rest of the village, and started going away when the unhealthy attitudes toward it start coming to a head, with Antonio’s ceremony and Isabela’s engagement. So having them not come back after those issues are resolved would be rather a kick in the balls of that theme. ¹ Bruno, Pepa, and Dolores seem to have gotten the short end of the stick…although, honestly, Dolores doesn’t seem to mind. I guess the fact that it makes it far easier for her to get gossip makes up for the annoyance from hearing **everything**. ² As mentioned by others, the only members of the family who treat Mirabel badly are Alma and Isabela, and the latter it’s mostly as a response to the pressure _she_ gets from their abuela. And, while it’s clear that the village depend on the Madrigals’ gifts - particularly Luisa’s strength and Julieta’s healing - it doesn’t seem to be unhealthily so. They’re clearly capable of doing things for themselves - the village existed for 40 years before Luisa got her gift, and they’re perfectly able to rebuild Casita while she’s depowered - and don’t seem to realize they’re putting such pressure on Luisa, who puts on a good face until Mirabel manages to get her to unload. (Accidentally, because Luisa doesn’t even let the mask slip with her family.) ³ Luisa gets a song about it, Isabela’s response drives a _big_ part of the plot, and Pepa gets a lot of scenes where she’s shown desperately trying to get things under control. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/87 "2022-05-16T02:29:23Z")
> [@Kamino\_Neko](#): > > And it’s also made clear that the magic came from love So the other people in the village just don’t love each another enough to have their own magic powers? ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 10:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/88 "2022-05-16T10:05:43Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > So I guess you won’t be buying any merchandise featuring her, like a donkey ho tee. \< grudging golf clap \> ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2022, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/89 "2022-05-16T20:55:20Z")
Regarding the subs and their service to the plot: the story is a mystery to be solved. The songs act as puzzle pieces. They’re presented as theatre-style showpieces, so I can understand some viewers being unfamiliar with such pacing. But the songs still service the story. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/90 "2022-05-17T00:58:07Z")
> [@garygnu](#): > > But the songs still service the story. Yep. It’s a stated goal of Disney that the songs advance the story. They’ve been doing it since _Tangled_, I think. Off the top of my head, including _Frozen_, _Frozen 2_, _Coco_, _Encanto_. The song and the script writers work together early in the production. If you don’t listen to the lyrics, you will miss out on some of the story. (Sorry, don’t have a handy cite, based on several “making” specials.) ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/91 "2022-05-17T01:12:35Z")
> [@Pleonast](#): > > If you don’t listen to the lyrics, you will miss out on some of the story. As I mentioned earlier, my problem with the lyrics was _I couldn’t understand them_. I had to back up, turn on the subs, and still occasionally pause it to catch up on reading. The problem with the lyrics wasthattheyweresanglikethis. ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/92 "2022-05-17T01:51:52Z")
They’ve had “songs service and advance the plot” as an explicit development principle since Howard Ashman and Alan Menkin came on board for _The Little Mermaid_. That’s not to say earlier Disney musicals didn’t have such songs, and neither did every song since then do so perfectly. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/93 "2022-05-17T16:46:35Z")
We’ve been babysitting our 2 yr old granddaughter more regularly recently, and when weather has been bad, my wife used it as an excuse for her to watch some of the Disney movies issues since our kids were young. Maybe I hit my limit with repeated viewing of Little Mermaid and Lion King, but I’ve not made it through all of Tangled, Frozen 2, or Encanto. But my one recollection was that Disney sure seems to be doubling down on the old=evil meme. Not sure if it leaps out at me now that I am more solidly in that demographic, but it just seems so constant - you see someone w/ grey hair and wrinkles, and you KNOW they are the bad guy. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/94 "2022-05-17T16:54:11Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > But my one recollection was that Disney sure seems to be doubling down on the old=evil meme. Not sure if it leaps out at me now that I am more solidly in that demographic, but it just seems so constant - you see someone w/ grey hair and wrinkles, and you KNOW they are the bad guy. Eh, when you have a movie about a kid/young adult, having an adult being the bad guy/foil is pretty easy to do. That being said, I wouldn’t say the most recent Disney movies follow that pattern. Frozen, Zootopia, Raya and the Last Dragon, etc., none of them have “an old person” as a bad guy. The only fits that is Tangled which is over 10 years old. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/95 "2022-05-17T16:56:52Z")
Fair enough. Like I said, I have FAR FROM an encyclopedic knowledge of recent Disney toons. The last 2 I recall were Encanto and Tangled, where it wasn’t just AN adult, but the ONLY OLDER adult. Next maybe we can discuss whether Disney still kills off enough moms? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/96 "2022-05-17T17:26:09Z")
Does Wreck-It Ralph not count? King Kandy/Turbo definitely seems like an older adult in that world. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/97 "2022-05-17T17:30:50Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > Frozen, Zootopia, Raya and the Last Dragon, etc., none of them have “an old person” as a bad guy. In _Frozen_, the Duke of Weselton is definitely a bad guy, if not the primary bad guy. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/98 "2022-05-17T17:50:49Z")
In _Frozen 2_, the bad guy (Elsa’s grandfather) is old as well. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/99 "2022-05-17T17:54:54Z")
Well, not in the sense of “this is a bad guy we have to defeat.” Really, the past few Disney have had no real antagonists in the traditional sense. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2022, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601/100 "2022-05-17T21:28:01Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > But my one recollection was that Disney sure seems to be doubling down on the old=evil meme. Not sure if it leaps out at me now that I am more solidly in that demographic, but it just seems so constant - you see someone w/ grey hair and wrinkles, and you KNOW they are the bad guy. _Encanto_ subverts this. Yes, Alma is the film’s antagonist, but she’s not villainous. The real “bad guy” is trauma: Alma was traumatized by her husband’s death, and all the subsequent conflicts – Pepa’s emotional dysregulation, Luisa’s fears of inadequacy, Isabela’s resentment at the expectations imposed on her – stem from Alma’s grief and trauma, and her inability to resolve them. Which is what sets Mirabel apart from the rest of her family – she _does_ face her trauma, she acknowledges her pain, she speaks the unspeakable. In her song she admits “I’m not fine” and says she “can’t keep down the unspoken invisible pain”. She sees the cracks in Casita, she goes behind the walls to face what’s hidden there, she talks about, and to, Bruno, the one “we don’t talk about”. She bares the wounds at the heart of the family, which is painful but necessary to heal. Bruno’s vision of her is exactly correct – she both reveals and repairs the family’s fractures; at the end, she’s the one who puts the house on a new foundation. That’s her gift, the courage to hurt and to heal. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disneys-encanto-open-spoilers-after-first-post/956601.md?page=6)