# Disturbed that Duck Dynasty Phil's \*racism\* is getting overlooked **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 20, 2013, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788 "2013-12-20T02:10:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/81 "2013-12-21T06:30:57Z")
There was an interesting post in the Business Insider blog: > [@](#): > > …The conservative politicians who are complaining that Phil Robertson’s firing flies in the face of “free speech” are generally smart enough to understand that Robertson doesn’t actually have a legal right to be on A&E. When Sarah Palin and her cohorts talk about the importance of “free speech,” they mean something much more specific: That the sorts of things that Robertson said are not the sorts of things a private employer should want to fire someone for saying. That they are, or ought to be, within the bounds of social acceptability. > > But they’re wrong. The other America — the America I live in — has this one right. Racist and anti-gay comments and comments disparaging of religious minorities are rude and unacceptable and might cost you your job. It’s not OK to say that gay people are “full of murder.”… > **[There Are Two Americas, And One Is Better Than The Other](https://www.businessinsider.com/phil-robertson-duck-dynasty-two-americas-2013-12?utm_source=slate&utm_medium=referral&utm_term=partner)** > > In one America, it's not O.K. to say gays are "full of murder" or that black people were happy under Jim Crow. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/82 "2013-12-21T10:53:38Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Are you happy now, Rufus? 🙂 **LHoD** ’s response speaks for me as well. I’ll just leave it at that. ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/83 "2013-12-21T12:19:16Z")
Jimmy Carter’s autobiography has some very interesting passages about growing up in the rural south and race relations. I’d post a few short quotes but I no longer have the book. One of his better stories was playing with black friends as a very young child. Some of the kids often beat him playing schoolyard games. At least until he got older and he started winning. One of his very best friends stopped coming by as often and avoided him at school. He finally confronted the kid and learned his parents had told him to be careful around whites. To watch his place. Don’t make them look bad by winning games. Which was sadly a common way blacks avoided trouble at that time in the divided South. Carter goes on to describe his changing perceptions of his childhood. The injustice of the separate seating at the movie theatres. He began questioning the status quo of the divided South and his own feelings about it. I highly recommend the book for anyone interested in learning what it was like growing up in rural 1930’s and 40’s Georgia. I wish Phil would have taken the time to think about his childhood and segregation before speaking. He did grow up twenty years later than Carter. But there were still remnants of the old South that he should have been aware of. I even remember old movie theaters with two entrances for blacks and whites. The black entance was locked and no longer had a sign. But it was purpose was obvious. I saw colored and whites only signs on old abandoned buildings in the late 60’s. It took a long time for the scars of Jim Crow to fully disappear. ---
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/84 "2013-12-21T12:51:47Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I wish Phil would have taken the time to think about his childhood and segregation before speaking. He did grow up twenty years later than Carter. But there were still remnants of the old South that he should have been aware of. I even remember old movie theaters with two entrances for blacks and whites. The black entance was locked and no longer had a sign. But it was purpose was obvious. I saw colored and whites only signs on old abandoned buildings in the late 60’s. It took a long time for the scars of Jim Crow to fully disappear. My mother told me about seeing a gas station with three bathrooms - Men’s, Women’s and Colored - when she was first married and living in eastern North Carolina in 1966. ---
**Author:** ![crowmanyclouds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crowmanyclouds/32/19884_2.png) [@crowmanyclouds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crowmanyclouds)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/85 "2013-12-21T13:21:29Z")
> [@Chimera](#): > > For a man as old as he is, he seems to be amazingly ignorant of the larger world. > > > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > > > He may be if he spends his time making duck calls, hunting and church going. > > 🙂 > [@](#): > > … After receiving his bachelor’s degree in physical education and a master’s in education …[RIGHT][CITE](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Robertson#Degrees_and_first_jobs)[/RIGHT] Lest anyone fall for the “I’m just po’ dum’ White trash” schtick. CMC ---
**Author:** ![Tethered\_Kite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a5b964/32.png) [@Tethered\_Kite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tethered_Kite)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/86 "2013-12-21T17:23:51Z")
> [@Tanaqui](#): > > Yeah! People should be allowed to voice all their opinions, at any time, without any repercussions whatsoever! I know I can’t wait til the pizza delivery boy favors me with his thoughts on Hitler’s policies. When I go to the grocery store, I love to hear about the dangers of fracking. And when I’m checking out a library book, there’s nothing I enjoy more than being told that Jews caused 9-11. That’s what makes America great. Please reread my post I said _experience - not opinion._ There are illegitimate opinions in cultural context but no one’s experience is illegitimate and all deserve respect. ---
**Author:** ![Vaevictis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f04885/32.png) [@Vaevictis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vaevictis)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/87 "2013-12-21T17:49:40Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Reasons like economics? That’s the reason for the vast majority of migration so why are you sure that in this case it was fear of lynchings? So did white southerners move to the north in percentages comparable to black southerners? ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/88 "2013-12-21T17:54:36Z")
> [@Terr](#): > > What Phil Robertson said was not on the job. If he said anything like that on the show and A&E edited it out, it would be A&E exercising editorial control over the show they own, and fully logical and legitimate. > > Censoring Phil’s opinions outside of the show by “hiatusing” him is much more problematic. I am glad he and his family are taking the stand they are. And the fact that A&E stands to lose tens if not hundreds of $millions (while Robertsons, with this publicity, are raking it in) is just icing on the cake. It was on the job. He was giving an interview to promote the show. ---
**Author:** ![Vaevictis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f04885/32.png) [@Vaevictis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Vaevictis)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/89 "2013-12-21T18:08:42Z")
> [@Vaevictis](#): > > So did white southerners move to the north in percentages comparable to black southerners? Also something to think about: Of both black and white southerners who moved north, who returned to the south in greater percentages? Apparently Gregory’s book Southern Diaspora says that white southerners returned in much higher percentages. Why would blacks and whites have a different pattern here if it is mostly driven by economics? N.B. I have not personally read Gregory’s book. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/90 "2013-12-21T18:40:13Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I believe you are confusing African Americans in the 20th century South with Jews in fifteenth century Spain. 🙂 What’s with the smilie face, **carnivorousplant**? You have heard of [Rosewood](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosewood_massacre), right? And [Tulsa](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_riot)? And [DC riot of 1919](http://atlantablackstar.com/2013/12/04/8-successful-aspiring-black-communities-destroyed-white-neighbors/3/)? I hope you have heard of these stories and that I am being severely whooshed. ---
**Author:** ![Belowjob2.0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/91 "2013-12-21T19:14:13Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I believe you are confusing African Americans in the 20th century South with Jews in fifteenth century Spain. 🙂 You’re confusing the facts of American history with this: [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/LcxYwwIL5zQ/hqdefault.jpg?sqp=-oaymwEmCOADEOgC8quKqQMa8AEB-AH-BIAC4AOKAgwIABABGEIgUShlMA8=&rs=AOn4CLAV4Bu0flMVGxQ1LkN3l4UNXVGszw "Zip-A-Dee-Doo-Dah") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LcxYwwIL5zQ) At any rate, the need to deny the facts of history points to either an underlying shame, or massive ignorance. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/92 "2013-12-21T19:19:22Z")
> [@Vaevictis](#): > > Also something to think about: Of both black and white southerners who moved north, who returned to the south in greater percentages? Apparently Gregory’s book Southern Diaspora says that white southerners returned in much higher percentages. Why would blacks and whites have a different pattern here if it is mostly driven by economics? > > N.B. I have not personally read Gregory’s book. I have no idea what the answers to your questions are. That being said, blacks and whites who did or didn’t move north may have been members of separate economic strata. I’m not sure that you can necessarily make very many inferences based on their respective migration patterns. ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/93 "2013-12-21T19:33:23Z")
> [@JohnT](#): > > It was on the job. He was giving an interview to promote the show. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/94 "2013-12-21T21:12:23Z")
What cite is needed? Why would GQ be interviewing the guy if he wasn’t a reality-show star? Does he seem like the typical subject covered by GQ? Maybe if the magazine were Guns & Ammo, or Duck Hunters Quarterly, I could see it, but not in the case of GQ. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/95 "2013-12-21T21:17:43Z")
Also, [here](http://www.gq.com/entertainment/television/201401/duck-dynasty-phil-robertson)’s the title and first paragraph/subhead: “What the Duck? How in the world did a family of squirrel-eating, Bible-thumping, catchphrase-spouting duck hunters become the biggest TV stars in America? And what will they do now that they have 14 million fervent disciples? Our Drew Magary toured the Louisiana backwater with Phil Robertson and the Duck Dynasty gang to find out.” There are photos of “The Men of Duck Dynasty.” Clearly, the article is not about Duck Commander, the duck call that led to all of this. ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/96 "2013-12-21T21:34:11Z")
> [@Doctor\_Jackson](#): > > What **Sahirrnee** said. > > Not in the United States, anyway. Even “hate” speech is protected. Especially since 100 random people would likely give you 98 different definitions of “hate speech” (the 2 that agree would be in the “I don’t know” bucket). > > There are a lot of TV shows, movies, songs, etc. that I don’t agree with, don’t like, or find offensive. I don’t watch/listen to them. If enough people don’t watch/listen, they eventually go away. IOW, consequences. > > It seems to me that it is the very people who preach tolerance the loudest that cannot abide views different from their own. Tolerance doesn’t apply to the intolerant, if we tolerate them then there simply wouldn’t be tolerance. ---
**Author:** ![Tethered\_Kite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a5b964/32.png) [@Tethered\_Kite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tethered_Kite)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/97 "2013-12-21T22:02:31Z")
> [@DigitalC](#): > > Tolerance doesn’t apply to the intolerant, if we tolerate them then there simply wouldn’t be tolerance. But you can’t help them change without tolerating them. Intolerance only breeds hatred and alienation. Quite a dilemma. You promote exclusivity while preaching inclusivity. Want them to change? Tolerate them enough that they can learn from you, not hate you. That’s how to make changes palatable. Or, um, silence them with new government rules. But that doesn’t change the thoughts behind the silence. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/98 "2013-12-21T22:19:41Z")
> [@Doctor\_Jackson](#): > > It seems to me that it is the very people who preach tolerance the loudest that cannot abide views different from their own. If we’re going to get into hypocrisy, I bet if I tried I could find some quotes from the same crowd now defending Phil who called for Martin Bashir to lose his job (and got their wish). > [@Terr](#): > > What Phil Robertson said was not on the job. If he said anything like that on the show and A&E edited it out, it would be A&E exercising editorial control over the show they own, and fully logical and legitimate. > > Censoring Phil’s opinions outside of the show by “hiatusing” him is much more problematic. So if Mel Gibson or Michael Richards have found themselves becoming essentially blacklisted in Hollywood because of things they said “off the clock”, is that wrong IYO? That just doesn’t square, for me, with the way entertainment works. If people say things anywhere that get them a toxic image, image is a lot of what the entertainment industry sells, so they are perfectly within their rights to reevaluate how that fits in with their “brand”. > [@kenobi\_65](#): > > I think, beyond that, there’s a tone-deafness (at best) in the “pre-entitlement, pre-welfare” part of the statement. He seems to be suggesting that, somehow, in his personal experience, things were better for blacks back then. Right. And I actually find this more pernicious than when people say the N-word or hurl other crude insults. This is of a piece with what Trent Lott got in trouble for: going back and making an argument that the mid-twentieth-century achievements in civil rights were in fact a mistake, that the senators filibustering civil rights bills were right after all. We saw the same kind of thing happen as regards the Civil War: revisionist historians made Radical Republicans like Thaddeus Stevens out to be out of control zealots, while the reason for Southern states’ secession was shifted from slavery, as it was clearly understood at the time, to “states’ rights” and undefined “economic factors”. Focus was shifted, as in GWTW, to the sad plight of white plantation owners who had their antebellum homes burned. This was so longstanding and successful an effort that I had to quit my College Bowl team because of bad blood that developed when I discovered that the entire rest of the team besides me firmly believed the lie that “the Civil War was not about slavery”. So while crudely bigoted comments just serve to dig racists deeper into their own hole, assertions like Phil’s need to be fiercely combated because of the effect this can have as fewer and fewer people were around to witness the era before civil rights. (There is a similar danger, btw, surrounding women’s plight in the “Feminine Mystique” days.) ---
**Author:** ![DigitalC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ebca7d/32.png) [@DigitalC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DigitalC)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2013, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/99 "2013-12-21T22:23:14Z")
> [@Tethered\_Kite](#): > > But you can’t help them change without tolerating them. Intolerance only breeds hatred and alienation. > > Quite a dilemma. > > You promote exclusivity while preaching inclusivity. > > Want them to change? Tolerate them enough that they can learn from you, not hate you. That’s how to make changes palatable. If you tolerate them all you are teaching them is that their views are acceptable. > [@](#): > > Or, um, silence them with new government rules. But that doesn’t change the thoughts behind the silence. Dafuq you talking about? ---
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2013, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788/100 "2013-12-22T02:26:06Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > What cite is needed? Why would GQ be interviewing the guy if he wasn’t a reality-show star? You didn’t say they interviewed him because he’s a star. You said the purpose of the interview was to promote the show. Cite? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/disturbed-that-duck-dynasty-phils-racism-is-getting-overlooked/676788.md?page=6)