# Do all Star Trek ships go through the same thing? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 14, 2004, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149 "2004-02-14T02:48:17Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/61 "2004-02-15T16:13:00Z")
> [@The Long Road](#): > > you shouldn’t have started throwing all the nerdy BS into the discussion. The last think I do is go out of my way to have anything to do with you and people like you. Um, **Long Road**? If you don’t want anything to do with “people like” **Aesiron** , I suggest you stop opening Star Trek-related threads. In any case, please stop POSTING in Star Trek-related threads. People enjoy these things, and don’t need to be called “nerds” whilst they do so. – Ukulele Ike, Cafe Society moderator. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/62 "2004-02-15T17:02:06Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > Hey! gimmie back my hat! > > The _first line_ of the episode is “Now manuvering to come alongside cargo vessel _Antares_” Is that what you think Constitution class ships are? Cargo vessels? Maybe a garbage scow? Maybe you think it should be hauled away as garbage, huh? > > Seriously, I just watched it and that’s the first line of the episode. > > [This](http://www.trekships.org/antares.htm) site bears me out in a lot more detail. Sigh [Removes WD’s hat once again] In my post I said “A heavy toll, especially when all the **named** vessels are Constitution class.” I never named the Antares, so therefore I didn’t say in any way it _was_ Constitution class. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/63 "2004-02-15T17:22:14Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > Sigh > > [Removes WD’s hat once again] > > In my post I said “A heavy toll, especially when all the **named** vessels are Constitution class.” I never named the Antares, so therefore I didn’t say in any way it _was_ Constitution class. Wait, either I’m confused, or you’re weaseling in a brilliant manner. Which is it? ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/64 "2004-02-15T17:47:51Z")
For Trek Dopers, the proper term would be “Wesleying.” According to _The Star Trek Encyclopedia_ (page 14), the _U.S.S. Antares_ was a Federation science vessel comanded by Captain Ramart, destroyed in 2266 by the enhanced human Robert Walker, Jr. I mean, Charlie Evans, playing himself. Yeah, that’s it. In TNG’s _Ensign Ro_, Bajoran cargo ships are called Antares class, simply a TNG geek tip of the hat to TOS, nothing more. On page 322, a discussion of Oberth class starships suggests there was an un-episoded\* _U.S.S. Oberth_ from which the _Grissom_, _Vico_, and _Tsiolkovsky_ got their class name. That is all. \*verbing ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/65 "2004-02-15T18:50:25Z")
Verbing weirds the language. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/66 "2004-02-15T20:09:34Z")
Oh, yeah. I have that book too. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/67 "2004-02-15T22:10:36Z")
But **Aesiron** , you still haven’t told us which **edition** of the _Star Trek Encyclopedia_ you have. It was updated and expanded in 1999, you know. And you haven’t even **mentioned** the _Star Trek Chronology_ yet! ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 15, 2004, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/68 "2004-02-15T22:15:26Z")
I’ve owned both but sold the original when the revised edition was released. No \*Chronology \* for me either. I beleive I own “The Captain’s Logs” for TNG, DS9, and VOY unless I sold them to move here though… I can’t remember. Whenever I get a job and a place of my own, getting my books here and buidling it back up will be one of my top priorities. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/69 "2004-02-16T11:32:41Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > Wait, either I’m confused, or you’re weaseling in a brilliant manner. Which is it? Well I _am_ brilliant 🆒 but not a weasel. I said that the ships who’s names I gave were all Constitution class, I either got this from watching eps on my VHS collection, or the Trek Encyclopedia. I didn’t give the name of the ship Charlie destroyed, so therefore I was not indicating that it was a Connie class. Ok? 🙂 And I looked into this only because someone on a Trek board suggested that there was mention somewhere of the Connie class having only 6 ships. Since I found 4 ships destroyed at least, three others were seen in the war games alongside the Excalibur, there’s the Enterprise herself and in Trek fashion there must be at least a ship named after the class itself USS Constitution, there must be more than 6 Connie class vessels in the Federation. Still, a lot of frontline vessels to lose outside of wartime. And you can keep the hat on your head, suits you sir 😃 > [@tracer](#): > > (The U.S.S. Grissom, which investigated the Genesis Planet under the command of Captain Cover-Your-Ass, was I believe the first Oberth-class vessel to appear in any Star Trek movie or show. How the class came to be known as the Oberth class and not the Grissom class, I have no idea. Although I’m sure that some fanboy/fangirl/fanJ’naii will come along any time now to fill in that particular blank.) Trek lore has it that the first ship of any class takes the name of that class like the first Excelsior class vessel NXX whatever was called the Excelsior. So presumably there exists, somewhere else, a U.S.S. Oberth. We can assume that the first showing of this ship is not necessarily because it is the first of its kind 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/70 "2004-02-16T19:21:20Z")
There wer 12 Constitution class starships. And the NX rule has been invalidated by the first warp 5 cpable starship, the NX Class Enterprise. ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/71 "2004-02-16T20:52:36Z")
Yeah, but an Imperial Star Destroyer could so totally waste a Connie. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/72 "2004-02-16T21:06:14Z")
An SW Courier ship crewed by Pakleds could probably destroy a Constitution Class starship unless Kirk happened to tear his shirt sometime during the battle. Then it’s gonna be on like neckbone.\* \*I don’t actually speak like that. It’s just a reference to another fandom of mine. A decanter of Romulan Ale to the first person to tell me where it’s from. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/73 "2004-02-16T21:07:43Z")
> [@Aesiron](#): > > And the NX rule has been invalidated by the first warp 5 cpable starship, the NX Class Enterprise. You know so well that if you posted that on a Trek board there would be screams of **“NOT CANON”** and much blood letting between fans of the old and new before the Mods step in. Lets just say that Enterprise did not invalidate that view, merely that Star Trek III created it, preserving Canon for all eternity 🆒 > [@Ino](#): > > Yeah, but an Imperial Star Destroyer could so totally waste a Connie. For the sake of dignity I will not go there, excpet to say that a Connie using touch and go downwarping would fool the non-lightspeed sensor array of the ISD, destroying its _very_ exposed shield generators, leaving the bridge and engines at the mercy of a volley of torpedoes. Face it, they’re toast 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/74 "2004-02-16T21:16:56Z")
True, I forgot to take into consideration that the Excelsior example changes the practice since it occurs at a later date. It’s just a glaring example that not everything follows formula and one I hate as much as any Trekkie BBSer. I just don’t get _quite as_ caught up in my fandom as they do… I like being able to laugh at it as much as I praise it. 🙂 Besides, everyone knows the Prometheus and Defiant class ships are the true badasses of the fleet. Especially the former. Three warp cabable battleships in one? Ha! The Empire wouldn’t know what hit them. ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/75 "2004-02-16T21:26:02Z")
Oh, but Darth Vader would be all, like, “You are my son, Kirk” and he’d scream “KHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN” and the whole throat-clutching Force thing with the pain and the hurting and the glaiven! No, seriously. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![elf6c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/c57346/32.png) [@elf6c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elf6c)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/76 "2004-02-16T21:28:42Z")
I guess _somebody_ has to haul ore around and such. Although those episodes might not be as popular. . . Stardate 5235.7 Hauling ore to the Trebleth system. One of the crew received a painful charley horse, due to the poor Starfleet railing design. Oh, and a random EPS conduit exploded when someone sneezed on it. Other then that, nothing happened during our two weeks trip from Nepenthe 6. Probably not good TV- be like watching C-Span in Space. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/77 "2004-02-16T21:46:53Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > a Connie using touch and go downwarping would fool the non-lightspeed sensor array of the ISD, destroying its _very_ exposed shield generators, leaving the bridge and engines at the mercy of a volley of torpedoes. Face it, they’re toast 😃 I have no idea what “touch and go downwarping” is, but whatever it is, the Constitution class heavy cruiser would not need it. The ISD has no weapons that move faster than light. Nor can the ISD fight while moving faster than light. All the Connie has to do is back up at warp 1.1 and lob photon torpedoes (which also travel at warp speed) at the ISD until it blows up. Sure, the ISD might be able to execute a few well-timed “hyperspace microjumps” to appear in the path of the Connie and put its slower-than-light weapons fire right where the Connie will be – assuming the ISD’s sensors can even **detect** a starship travelling faster-than-light – but the Connie could overcome that with continuous small, random changes to its course. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/78 "2004-02-16T21:53:43Z")
This is making me nostalgic for the old SW vs ST threads. When was the last time we had one? I think it’s time for another. ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/79 "2004-02-16T23:00:26Z")
Naw, let’s not. If we did, **SPOOFE** would just wander in and say “If they never showed Captain Picard doing it, then the Enterprise can’t do it” – while conveniently ignoring this same admonition for the Star Destroyer’s captain. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [February 16, 2004, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149/80 "2004-02-16T23:02:23Z")
Too late. It already has about seven posts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-all-star-trek-ships-go-through-the-same-thing/229149.md?page=5)