# Do Americans really believe in God, or do they just say they do? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 29, 2015, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670 "2015-12-29T19:29:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Pai325](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Pai325](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pai325)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/41 "2015-12-30T03:01:38Z")
I believe in God, and I believe a large number of the 86% (but not all), believe also. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/42 "2015-12-30T03:02:35Z")
Folks who think most Americans are really atheists are so invested in their own world view that they can’t imagine anyone having a different view. This comes from people thinking they are a lot smarter than they actually are. ---
**Author:** ![Oddball\_92](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/b3f665/32.png) [@Oddball\_92](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oddball_92)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/43 "2015-12-30T03:06:28Z")
I believe in God and also His son Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/44 "2015-12-30T03:14:52Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Only atheists think that belivers don’t think about their beliefs. This is an arrogance born of the idea that “if they really thought about it they would agree with me because it is the only reasonable conclusion.” Easy there. Neckbeard internet atheists are their own special breed. The rest of us are nice. Not me, but others. 🙂 > [@John\_Mace](#): > > Folks who think most Americans are really atheists are so invested in their own world view that they can’t imagine anyone having a different view. This comes from people thinking they are a lot smarter than they actually are. Nah, I think it in part comes from inability to recognize that you might live in an enclave. I was in high school when I learned what the U.S. demographics were, and I just plain didn’t believe it. I had to comb through decades of Census data before I reluctantly conceded the article that brought these numbers to my attention wasn’t lying. And then I told my best friend in wide-eyed astonishment and she flatly didn’t believe me. I grew up in Los Angeles. Upon first reading I could not believe we were really (at the time) living in a country that was less than 10% Latino. What? \*Two \*percent Asian? Three percent Jewish? What the hell kind of nonsense survey was this?! One of the entire nation, that’s what, and not the little slice of life which is the only I’d ever known. In the neighborhood I grew up in, 86% theism seems low. If we were talking about circle of people these days, the inverse seems more to be true. But I (now) realize my circle is my circle. Some people never stop thinking theirs is the entire universe. I don’t think this is an issue of I-am-very-smart atheism. I think it’s very dumb my-world-is-_the_-world silliness. ---
**Author:** ![G0sp3l](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c68b51/32.png) [@G0sp3l](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/G0sp3l)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/45 "2015-12-30T04:11:14Z")
I don’t think I’m especially smart. I do think a great many theists don’t truly believe as much as they claim. It’s easy to claim allegiance to the supposed majority and not examine it any further. ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/46 "2015-12-30T04:35:42Z")
How would a ‘cultural (member of an Abrahamic religion)’ answer the question? They go to church every (pick a time), and especially on (name of High Holy Day(s)). They may even display some bit of hardware identifying their nominal belief. Think Nativity. The question is asked: “Do you believe in God?”. If their response is: I am a (member of religion). Of COURSE I believe in God. You have a different answer that the person who has daily conversations with God and takes comfort that their recently killed-in-a-horrible-way baby was actually “Called Home by God”. And yes - the “God” in the question heavily presupposes the Abrahamic “God” - the one and only deity. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/47 "2015-12-30T04:54:24Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > Only atheists think that belivers don’t think about their beliefs. This is an arrogance born of the idea that “if they really thought about it they would agree with me because it is the only reasonable conclusion.” I’m sorry I wasn’t specific. It’s not that they don’t think about it, it’s that they don’t think _critically_ about it. And you have to admit that a majority of people, regardless their religious persuasion, just aren’t very good at critical thinking, especially about core beliefs that they consider part of their identities. ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/48 "2015-12-30T06:20:27Z")
Can you be said to “lie” if you have never actively considered the question? How about an option: “I wonder how many of those 86% have ever seriously questioned their beliefs”? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 8:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/49 "2015-12-30T08:57:29Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Nah, I think it in part comes from inability to recognize that you might live in an enclave. I was in high school when I learned what the U.S. demographics were, and I just plain didn’t believe it. I had to comb through decades of Census data before I reluctantly conceded the article that brought these numbers to my attention wasn’t lying. And then I told my best friend in wide-eyed astonishment and she flatly didn’t believe me. I grew up in Los Angeles. Upon first reading I could not believe we were really (at the time) living in a country that was less than 10% Latino. What? \*Two \*percent Asian? Three percent Jewish? What the hell kind of nonsense survey was this?! One of the entire nation, that’s what, and not the little slice of life which is the only I’d ever known. > > In the neighborhood I grew up in, 86% theism seems low. If we were talking about circle of people these days, the inverse seems more to be true. But I (now) realize my circle is my circle. Some people never stop thinking theirs is the entire universe. > > I don’t think this is an issue of I-am-very-smart atheism. I think it’s very dumb my-world-is-_the_-world silliness. Except we’re not talking about people in High School, we’re your experiences are often limited. Look at the responses in this thread: “People say they believe in God, but they really don’t.” That’s not the expression of someone who doesn’t know people claim to be religious. It’s in the very title of this thread!! ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/50 "2015-12-30T10:38:51Z")
> [@leahcim](#): > > As for the capitalization, I have no problem with it any more than I have with the capitalization of anyone’s proper name. His name is “God”. His species is “god”. > > It is odd that he is named after his species. Maybe his parents just weren’t all that creative. I blame the KJV guys and the many translators who came before them, who decided to translate “_el_” as “god” and “_elohim_” as “God”. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/51 "2015-12-30T15:53:29Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Except we’re not talking about people in High School, we’re your experiences are often limited. Look at the responses in this thread: “People say they believe in God, but they really don’t.” That’s not the expression of someone who doesn’t know people claim to be religious. It’s in the very title of this thread!! Well right, I was saying I think these people have never left their bubbles and can’t conceive that outside of their tiny space, there are people who believe in God. This isn’t about me or high school. But okay, fine, you’re right. Anyone who can’t accept that 86% of people are theists in this country just think they’re smarter than everyone else. There’s no possible other reason. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/52 "2015-12-30T16:16:46Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Well right, I was saying I think these people have never left their bubbles and can’t conceive that outside of their tiny space, there are people who believe in God. I think it’s more that people are often quite hypocritical and inconsistent in their religious beliefs. So, from the outside, it looks like it’s either not a true belief or a shallowly held one. If someone claims to believe X but acts as if they believe Y, it’s not unfair or unreasonable or sheltered to think they truly believe Y. If we were talking political stances, we’d point and laugh at the hypocrites who say X and do Y. The problem I have with that when it comes to religion is that when outsiders (like me, an atheist) are trying to assign the appropriate action to reveal belief X I think we get it wrong. We want to say that those who say/believe X but do Y are hypocrite because Y does not follow X. But if everyone who says/believes X does Y maybe that means Y goes with X, or is at least not contradictory. After all, religious beliefs, by their very nature, are not some sort of mathematical formula where we can solve for X. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/53 "2015-12-30T16:24:54Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Well right, I was saying I think these people have never left their bubbles and can’t conceive that outside of their tiny space, there are people who believe in God. This isn’t about me or high school. > > But okay, fine, you’re right. Anyone who can’t accept that 86% of people are theists in this country just think they’re smarter than everyone else. There’s no possible other reason. So the possibility you are suggesting is that 86% are believers, but that they are very poor at following their professed religion? ---
**Author:** ![Blaster\_Master](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/cab0a1/32.png) [@Blaster\_Master](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blaster_Master)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/54 "2015-12-30T16:29:06Z")
I voted yes/yes, but that’s not completely accurate. I think it’s not all that unlike homosexuality, in that some people hide their atheism, particularly if they come from very theistic families, so I don’t think it’s actually 86%, but I don’t think a significant number of people are lying. I think most of them really do believe, or at least believe they believe. But of course, a lot of those people are pretty casual about it or might describe as “spiritual but not religious” which, I suppose, is debatable about whether or not that’s theistic or atheistic, depending on exactly what that means. I run into a fair number of atheists and agnostics in my life, more than that number would lead one to expect, but I also work in a technical field, which I’d expect has a higher percentage of atheists and agnostics, and I live in an area that is both more liberal and more materialistic, which I think would also tend toward those things, but it’s not all that far off, maybe 75-80%. So I suspect if one were to go to a more rural or conservative area, they’d probably be higher to the point that it balances out quite near that 86% number. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/55 "2015-12-30T16:32:45Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I think it’s more that people are often quite hypocritical and inconsistent in their religious beliefs. So, from the outside, it looks like it’s either not a true belief or a shallowly held one. If someone claims to believe X but acts as if they believe Y, it’s not unfair or unreasonable or sheltered to think they truly believe Y. If we were talking political stances, we’d point and laugh at the hypocrites who say X and do Y. Don’t we point and laugh at religious hypocrites all the time? Anyway, I voted in the poll that I don’t believe in God(s). but do believe others when they say that they do. There are loads of people who are theists, but aren’t particularly religious; I used to be one of them. Then are those who are theists and religious, but don’t seem to abide by their religions very well. I don’t believe it’s a shallow or falsely-professed belief. I reckon they’re some combination of lazy, hypocritical, or doing a bunch of mental gymnastics to justify their behaviors. Like a lot of people with a lot of stuff. Edit: > [@Czarcasm](#): > > So the possibility you are suggesting is that 86% are believers, but that they are very poor at following their professed religion? Lol, what? I suppose that is _a_ possibility, but that’s not what I’m suggesting is going on here. ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/56 "2015-12-30T16:36:27Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > Don’t we point and laugh at religious hypocrites all the time? Yes, but as I said, I think there are times when we are labeling it hypocrisy when it isn’t. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/57 "2015-12-30T16:41:33Z")
It could also be possible that people do not trust in the anonymity of polls and/or subconsciously give the answer they think they are expected to give. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/58 "2015-12-30T16:44:30Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > I think it’s more that people are often quite hypocritical and inconsistent in their religious beliefs. So, from the outside, it looks like it’s either not a true belief or a shallowly held one. If someone claims to believe X but acts as if they believe Y, it’s not unfair or unreasonable or sheltered to think they truly believe Y. If we were talking political stances, we’d point and laugh at the hypocrites who say X and do Y. > > The problem I have with that when it comes to religion is that when outsiders (like me, an atheist) are trying to assign the appropriate action to reveal belief X I think we get it wrong. We want to say that those who say/believe X but do Y are hypocrite because Y does not follow X. But if everyone who says/believes X does Y maybe that means Y goes with X, or is at least not contradictory. After all, religious beliefs, by their very nature, are not some sort of mathematical formula where we can solve for X. My father believes in hell, or so he tells me. He has also told me that he goes to bed worrying about me burning in hell for all eternity. Because he believes God sends those who reject him to hell. Yet he loves God with all his heart (or so he tells me). And he believes God loves me too (which is why he wishes I would return to him). I really don’t know how to reconcile these contradictory notions. I don’t want to believe that my father actually worships a monster like this, because what does that make my father? Either a spineless simpleton or a monster himself, right? So it’s easier for me to believe that while he believes in a concept of God, he doesn’t REALLY believe in hell or that God will send me there. He may think he does. He may say he does. But it’s not something that is real for him. Just like my “belief” in atoms isn’t real for me, since I’ve never seen one and I act as if they aren’t even there. If this means that I’m being an arrogant asshole of an atheist, **MeanOldLady** , I guess that’s what I am. And I’m happy to be one, too. I guess I’d rather be an arrogant asshole than a child of someone who can love and worship a god that has such vile plans for me in the afterlife. Me saying he’s just confused is a lot nicer than me saying he’s psychopathic idiot, which is what I really want to say when he starts talking that you’re-going-to-hell business. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/59 "2015-12-30T16:51:08Z")
I will also say that people are very capable of acting as if there is no authority even when they know there is. The majority of people demonstrate this behavior in adolescence. Criminals don’t break the law because they doubt the existence of the police. They break the law because they either don’t think they are doing anything wrong or they think they can get away with it. A lot of Christians pray for forgiveness right after they do something “bad”. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2015, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670/60 "2015-12-30T16:52:16Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > It could also be possible that people do not trust in the anonymity of polls and/or subconsciously give the answer they think they are expected to give. Could be. My guess is a lot of people who said yes to God believe there is one, but aren’t super religious (maybe the Church on Christmas or Jew-_ish_ type), or maybe not even religious at all but just believe there is a God. Like several people I know. But then again, there are a shitload of religious people, too. Haven’t you seen them? They’re all over the damn place. My mom sent my Christmas gift with an enclosed Bible tract. (Not one of those Chick ones, though. She’s not crazy.) **Monstro** , isn’t that something that needs to be reconciled with Christianity in general, though? I don’t know how this nice guy God can burn people in flames either, but I don’t have any problem believing others believe this. I used to believe it, despite not being able to wrap my head around it. Fucked with my mind a little, but I eventually stopped believing in God, so now I let other bullshit keep me up at night. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-americans-really-believe-in-god-or-do-they-just-say-they-do/741670.md?page=4)