# Do Car Dealers Own The Cars??? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 7, 2010, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582 "2010-05-07T02:17:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![zwede](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/ac91a4/32.png) [@zwede](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zwede)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/41 "2017-11-22T17:23:11Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > You may remember that Saturn also had a relaxed, friendly, no haggle policy. They failed because Saturn was just another GM brand. > > Tesla is unique, in more ways than one. There’s no other vehicle like a Tesla. Someone who wants a Tesla is not only not going to be satisfied with anything else, they’ll be willing to wait until Tesla is ready to serve them. > > If you go to a fancy bridal shop to get a custom-made gown that takes four months to deliver, they treat you better than the clerk at Macy’s with a rack full of white dresses. You don’t have to wait for a special order Tesla. They keep cars around for test drives and as service loaners, and these cars are also for sale (at a discount based on age and mileage). So when you put in an order for a car they give you the option to either wait for it to be built or the inventory cars that match your order. The one I bought was an ex-service loaner and I saved quite a lot by taking a car that was 6 months old and had 6K miles on it. Nice thing is that the warranty started over, I got 4 years from when I bought it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2017, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/42 "2017-11-22T17:35:13Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > Saturn ceased to exist because they stopped being Saturn. At the end all of their cars were just lightly-restyled versions of stuff you could find in the Chevy showroom. Yes, the new cars werent as good as the old. I see plenty of the SC and SL models still on the road. ---
**Author:** ![actualliberalnotoneofthose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e79b87/32.png) [@actualliberalnotoneofthose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/actualliberalnotoneofthose)\ **Post date:** [November 24, 2017, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/43 "2017-11-24T17:21:21Z")
> [@Mdcastle](#): > > My stepfather has a small used lot. If a customer doesn’t find what s/he wants, he’ll offer to get a car like they want within a week, but they never take him up on the offer and go to his competition. > > As far as who owns the cars, in his case he owns most of them, but he’ll take the occasional lot on consignment from people that buy and sell cars for a living but don’t have a physical lot. I have a family friend who owned used car lots. I’m pretty sure he got all of his inventory from auctions and trades and fixing them up himself. He liked restoring cars more than selling them and still has all kinds of old rare cars and pieces of them, but for his used car lot it was mostly boring family sedans and the like. My brother works for a dealership and his job entails flying all over the country to find cars (auctions, private sales) for customers and then driving them back. He is paid very well. I still don’t understand how this works. Well, I understand the business model. I’m just surprised so many customers buy cars this way (and there is enough markup), which is the opposite of the impatient would-be customers of your stepfather. Though I guess it’s a different economic bracket, too. ---
**Author:** ![pullin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@pullin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pullin)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2017, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/44 "2017-11-25T12:05:50Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > This is correct. I used to sell GMC trucks and had a handful of customers that had to have something on their trucks that wasn’t a popular option or set of options (usually something like a long-box 2500 diesel in a particular color) that we didn’t have on our lot, we couldn’t locate one and/or negotiate a dealer trade for it, so then the customer’s only other option is to have one built. This takes awhile, and what happens is that since the vehicle isn’t “born” yet (ie, no VIN #), whatever rebates and discount programs that apply today will not necessarily be the same as when delivery on the truck is taken. > > The MSRP is the starting point. The ordered truck is built and priced to the customer the day they order it, and everyone just crosses their fingers that GM won’t take away the Farm Bureau, USAA, etc discounts in the interim…or slash the rebates. I’m currently trying to buy a new truck, and this is what I’m running into. The increasing use of pickups as suburban fashion statements has led to a bifurcation in the types on most lots. They’re either short bed, low-ratio luxury models without tow packages, or ginormous dually diesels set up to haul 12-ton horse trailers. Finding a long bed 3/4 ton with a usable rear axle (4.something) set up for towing 6-7 tons is apparently impossible. One dealer searched the entire national inventory for a 3/4, large gas engine, 4.X ratio long bed, tow-package and came up empty. Not one in the entire country (according to him). I’m going to have to order the truck I need, and cross my fingers regarding incentives. I suspect there won’t be many for me since the incentives are to move current stock. I’m also getting low-ball trade-in offers on my current ride for the same reason (it’s set up for actual towing, rather than as a chassis to affix chrome knickknacks for preening owners). ---
**Author:** ![FoieGrasIsEvil](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foiegrasisevil/32/16638_2.png) [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)\ **Post date:** [November 25, 2017, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/45 "2017-11-25T23:53:50Z")
> [@pullin](#): > > I’m currently trying to buy a new truck, and this is what I’m running into. The increasing use of pickups as suburban fashion statements has led to a bifurcation in the types on most lots. They’re either short bed, low-ratio luxury models without tow packages, or ginormous dually diesels set up to haul 12-ton horse trailers. > > Finding a long bed 3/4 ton with a usable rear axle (4.something) set up for towing 6-7 tons is apparently impossible. One dealer searched the entire national inventory for a 3/4, large gas engine, 4.X ratio long bed, tow-package and came up empty. Not one in the entire country (according to him). I’m going to have to order the truck I need, and cross my fingers regarding incentives. I suspect there won’t be many for me since the incentives are to move current stock. > > I’m also getting low-ball trade-in offers on my current ride for the same reason (it’s set up for actual towing, rather than as a chassis to affix chrome knickknacks for preening owners). You have no idea how accurate your statements are regarding the state of trucks in America. They are cars with a bed for wanna be cowboys. I ran into this situation a lot: “Sir, you say you need a truck to tow x, and that you need more bed space for your mulch/gravel/etc, and you already own a Suburban for the family. Why not go with this double cab instead of the crew cab and save some money?” “Where am I going to put the car seats?” :smack: That truck you are describing was actually one of the first ones I ever ordered for someone. GMC 2500 SLT, gas motor, long box, crew cab. You just don’t see many of them and as you said, the market is by and large bearing out that people want cars that look like trucks (1500 crew cab, short box, all the bells and whistles, etc) so they can pack the kiddies in the back while they tow their little boat. The irony is that a super durable 2500 long box that can actually be used as a truck, and is HUGE, is cheaper than their smaller bretheren by a lot. A Denali crew cab 1500 GMC truck now stickers for about $65,000. For a 1500! Good luck on your quest. I can certainly help in in many ways. You mentioned being lowballed on your trade…it’s kinda par for the course. The revenue streams for dealers have gotten really tight and one of the ways to make more money for the salesperson and the dealer is to “hold on the trade”. But, there’s a flip side to that as well. A lot of people WAY overvalue their trade, or rely too heavily on websites like KBB, etc. Many folks I ran into would gloss over the fact that their trade needed tires, brakes, has a check engine light on, whatever. The dealer HAS to fix those things by law if they intend to re-sell it. So that costs them money. A piece of shit trade will go straight to the auction. A lot of customers want retail for their trade and wholesale on the dealer’s car. That’s not how it works. I would do something like this “Look guys, NADA says my trade is worth between x and z. If you give me y for it (middle of the range), and let me buy your truck for invoice plus $1000, we can do business.” Or something like that. Be prepared to walk. It does sound like you’re going to have to order your truck though. It’s always a risk with incentives, etc. If you wait too long, then you risk running into a really long wait for the next model year version as they retool the assembly lines for the next year, especially if the vehicle is undergoing a significant refresh or remodel. Let me know what’s going on, either here or in a PM. I will help you as best as I can. If you give me details on the makes of the vehicles being purchased and traded, mileage, condition, etc, all the gory details I can see what I might be able to do. I am no longer in the car business, by the way, so this is just a fellow Doper helping another. I am not trying to sell anyone anything. ---
**Author:** ![bob\_2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bob_2/32/3341_2.png) [@bob\_2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bob_2)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2017, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/46 "2017-11-26T17:11:25Z")
In Europe, and probably America too, car production - ie. cars going down the line - is moving ever closer to the customer’s order. I have toured many car plants and worked in the supply chain. It’s all about Just-In-Time these days, and that applies to the inventory of parts at the plant as well as the stock of cars at the dealer. They do not want a warehouse full of parts, and they certainly do not want fields full of unsold cars. They do have a way to go yet - an acquaintance has ordered a new Mondeo (Fusion to you) and has to wait six weeks for them to build it. On the upside, the old days of taking delivery of your “new” car, only to find that it was built 12 months earlier, are mostly gone. At the extreme, niche builders like Morgan, have a two year lead time and write to you with an invitation to spend a day at the factory watching them build it. [https://www.morgan-motor.co.uk/](https://www.morgan-motor.co.uk/) ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [November 26, 2017, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/47 "2017-11-26T17:28:48Z")
> [@zwede](#): > > In the past I’ve bought some new cars from dealerships and I have also bought a Tesla. Having experienced both sales models, the Tesla experience is vastly superior (at least for the consumer). I hope to newer having to set foot at a dealership again. > > With Tesla there was zero sales pressure. No up-sell. No ‘you need to buy the extended warranty TODAY’. Just friendly employees that seemed genuinely interested in making me happy. None of that is unique to Tesla. I’m looking at getting a new Honda Civic before the end of the year. On Friday I went to the local lot and had the exact same experience. I told them that I was going to buy in early December. I wasn’t pressured at all. I was actually told that I shouldn’t upgrade to the turbo engine because of the type of driver that I am. I got a test drive and we exchanged business cards. The next morning I called another dealership which is an hour’s drive away. I bought my current car there eleven years ago. I didn’t even have to go there. He sent me the asking price via text message which included what I would get for the trade in on the current car. ---
**Author:** ![pullin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@pullin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pullin)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 11:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/48 "2017-11-27T11:24:32Z")
> [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > Many folks I ran into would gloss over the fact that their trade needed tires, brakes, has a check engine light on, whatever. The dealer HAS to fix those things by law if they intend to re-sell it. So that costs them money. A piece of shit trade will go straight to the auction. I realize they have to clean up previous owner’s messes prior to resale, but it really isn’t the case with mine. Mine is spotless, no dents, no tears, fairly new tires (hi dollar E-range Michelins), custom aftermarket airbag suspension (automatic leveling, not lifting teenager stuff), and documented proof of all maintenance including oddly scheduled stuff like transfer case, tranny oil, diff, belts, 100K tuneup, etc. etc. In the past, my trade-ins rarely leave the dealership (someone, usually a mechanic, buys it). That’s why I was taken aback by the low-ball offer. > [@FoieGrasIsEvil](#): > > Let me know what’s going on, either here or in a PM. I will help you as best as I can. If you give me details on the makes of the vehicles being purchased and traded, mileage, condition, etc, all the gory details I can see what I might be able to do. I am no longer in the car business, by the way, so this is just a fellow Doper helping another. I appreciate your offer of help, and may take you up on it in the future. But for now I’ve suspended the search. We’re going to re-evaluate and try some out-of-the-box thinking about what we really want to do. Our goal is preparing for retirement RV travel by upgrading to a larger truck and larger camper (prob 5th wheel again). When I add the new fiver and the new truck together, I’m easily in the range of 2-4 year old motorhomes. We’re wondering if it’s a better choice to get a nice Class-A and drag the Camry behind it. We’re not in the pusher class, but there are some nice coaches with forward engines out there. First-world problems, I guess. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2017, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/49 "2017-11-27T12:03:42Z")
> [@pullin](#): > > I’m currently trying to buy a new truck, and this is what I’m running into. The increasing use of pickups as suburban fashion statements has led to a bifurcation in the types on most lots. They’re either short bed, low-ratio luxury models without tow packages, or ginormous dually diesels set up to haul 12-ton horse trailers. > > Finding a long bed 3/4 ton with a usable rear axle (4.something) set up for towing 6-7 tons is apparently impossible. One dealer searched the entire national inventory for a 3/4, large gas engine, 4.X ratio long bed, tow-package and came up empty. Not one in the entire country (according to him). I’m going to have to order the truck I need, and cross my fingers regarding incentives. I suspect there won’t be many for me since the incentives are to move current stock. > > I’m also getting low-ball trade-in offers on my current ride for the same reason (it’s set up for actual towing, rather than as a chassis to affix chrome knickknacks for preening owners). What do you consider “low ball?” ---
**Author:** ![Khendrask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3e96dc/32.png) [@Khendrask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khendrask)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2017, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582/50 "2017-11-28T15:43:01Z")
This made me think of a [“This American Life Episode - 129 Cars”](https://www.thisamericanlife.org/radio-archives/episode/513/transcript). Good show actually. Anyway, I just bought a new SUV last month. I decided I needed one to tow the boat around, so I started looking at used (online). I did email one dealership about two of their used listings, but strangely, they never got back to me. Oh, automated emails, yes, even a “Customized Video” for me on youtube. Odd. Then decided I really wanted some of the current safety features, and looked around again new. Found one I liked online, sent an email, and they sent me back a very good price. Later that day I went to the dealership, and picked it up. No hassle, no issues. Total in to out time at the dealer was probably about an hour. That was Toyota by the way, I will not “Buy American” ever again after being screwed over so many times with junk. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-car-dealers-own-the-cars/538582.md?page=2)