# Do Christians feel that athiests are amoral or unprincipled? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 14, 2006, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629 "2006-09-14T01:46:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Beaucarnea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c0e974/32.png) [@Beaucarnea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beaucarnea)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/1 "2006-09-14T01:46:35Z")
If yes, why do you feel this way? ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/2 "2006-09-14T02:04:29Z")
As an atheist, I certainly feel that Christians feel this way, since I read it in some dumbass letter to the editor or offhandly mentioned in some OP Ed like, every other week. Also, the Pope believes it and basically said it again just a few days ago. ---
**Author:** ![newcrasher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b3f665/32.png) [@newcrasher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newcrasher)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/3 "2006-09-14T02:25:49Z")
[QUOTE=Apos] As an atheist, I certainly feel that Christians feel this way, since I read it in some dumbass letter to the editor or offhandly mentioned in some OP Ed like, every other week. Also, the Pope believes it and basically said it again just a few days ago. [/QUOTE] As a progressive Christian (see www.sojo.net to get a flavor of my principles), I believe the first thing Christians have to realize is that the world is full of beautiful, intelligent, good, moral people who are not Christians. We never had a corner on that market, and its time for us to stop pretending we ever did. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/4 "2006-09-14T02:26:56Z")
There are Christians who feel that way, but I don’t think you’ll find that many of them here. ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/5 "2006-09-14T02:31:21Z")
Yes, i’d say a good amount do. What’s interesting to me is that Christians seem more likely to trust members of other faiths over athiests in this regard; there seems to be a feeling that, even if Jews or Muslims (though of course opinions have changed the last few years) don’t believe the same things I do, at least they are spiritual. I’m not sure why this is. ---
**Author:** ![newcrasher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b3f665/32.png) [@newcrasher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newcrasher)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/6 "2006-09-14T02:33:49Z")
[QUOTE=Revenant Threshold] Yes, i’d say a good amount do. What’s interesting to me is that Christians seem more likely to trust members of other faiths over athiests in this regard; there seems to be a feeling that, even if Jews or Muslims (though of course opinions have changed the last few years) don’t believe the same things I do, at least they are spiritual. I’m not sure why this is. [/QUOTE] I think a large part of Christians are willfully ignorant of the teachings of Christ. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/7 "2006-09-14T02:34:10Z")
[QUOTE=newcrasher] (see www.sojo.net to get a flavor of my principles) [/QUOTE] Nice. Sadly, I believe most of the self-identified christians in my area would not consider someone who adhered to that flavour of principles to be an actual _christian_. And as a Unitarian, I’m really _out there_ as far as they are concerned. We’ve been called amoral and unprincipled (especially when we had a gay minister) by the local christian community. And we’re only about 20% atheist! ---
**Author:** ![dangermom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e274bd/32.png) [@dangermom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dangermom)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/8 "2006-09-14T02:41:32Z")
Depends on which Christians you ask, I guess. I don’t hear that kind of claim much, myself, and I certainly wouldn’t agree with it. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/9 "2006-09-14T02:49:54Z")
Where I’ve seen it the most is among Christians whose attitude towards Christianity itself is all about “OK, I’m doing my duty, I’m doing it right, I’m believing what I’m supposed to believe, which in and of itself counts for something in the Divine Scorebook”. In other words, it’s not that they think people who are atheists are immoral being, as atheists, they stray from the path of righteousness due to not heeding the word of God, it’s more like people who are atheists are doing something wicked and sinful merely by not believing in God (/Jesus/Bible/etc). Because believing is a duty, to not believe is already a sin. There’s just no room to be a moral principled atheist. You done already done bad and you goin’ to hell. ---
**Author:** ![badchad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b77776/32.png) [@badchad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/badchad)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/10 "2006-09-14T02:51:14Z")
[QUOTE=newcrasher] I think a large part of Christians are willfully ignorant of the teachings of Christ. [/QUOTE] Christ taught that unbelievers will, and apparently should, be damned to hell. It seems it is progressive Christians that are ignorant of that. Fundamentalists on the contrary have that part down pretty well. ---
**Author:** ![diggleblop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac91a4/32.png) [@diggleblop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/diggleblop)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/11 "2006-09-14T02:51:33Z")
I am a Christian, but hardly “practice” any longer. I feel that Atheists are a little too adamant about their beliefs. Most of the ones I’ve ever encountered have the “I’m right and everybody else is wrong, there is no God, that’s it and if anyone disagrees, they’re wrong” mentality. Granted, a lot of Christians are like that, but Atheists are more asshole-ish about it in my opinion. Everybody has their right to believe what they want, so more power to’em I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/12 "2006-09-14T02:54:29Z")
That’s some nice generalizing, **diggleblop** , but what’s it got to do with the thread topic? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/13 "2006-09-14T03:09:24Z")
America is dominated by Christians, and atheists are America’s least trusted minority. [Link](http://www.ur.umn.edu/FMPro?-db=releases&-lay=web&-format=umnnewsreleases/releasesdetail.html&ID=2816&-Find) > [@](#): > > From a telephone sampling of more than 2,000 households, university researchers found that Americans rate atheists below Muslims, recent immigrants, gays and lesbians and other minority groups in “sharing their vision of American society.” Atheists are also the minority group most Americans are least willing to allow their children to marry. > [@](#): > > Many of the study’s respondents associated atheism with an array of moral indiscretions ranging from criminal behavior to rampant materialism and cultural elitism. As for me, I’ve always operated on the assumption that the vast majority of Americans hate my guts for being atheist. They don’t know me and never will, but they hate me. ---
**Author:** ![yojimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yojimbo/32/232_2.png) [@yojimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yojimbo)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/14 "2006-09-14T03:14:11Z")
Why should you be moral when there isn’t a sky pixie telling you you’re going to hell if you’re not. There are millions of Christians that don’t think like that. Unfortunately there are millions who do as well. Some people seem to need a reason to feel empathy and civility. There are also many atheists who are uncaring immoral fucks. The lack of god doesn’t do it however. They’re just cunts like the religious ones. Basically a lot of people are cunts. A lot aren’t though, so it’s not all bad. > [@](#): > > I think a large part of Christians are willfully ignorant of the teachings of Christ. My sig used to be “If you Christians were more like your Christ the world would be a better place” - Mohandas K. Gandhi ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/15 "2006-09-14T03:15:05Z")
No, just that they have no absolute grounding for morals & principles outside of sheer pragmatic utilitarianism and personal preference. ---
**Author:** ![badchad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b77776/32.png) [@badchad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/badchad)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/16 "2006-09-14T03:17:26Z")
[QUOTE=yojimbo] My sig used to be “If you Christians were more like your Christ the world would be a better place” - Mohandas K. Gandhi [/QUOTE] Yeah, but Christ was a cunt too. ---
**Author:** ![Beaucarnea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/c0e974/32.png) [@Beaucarnea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beaucarnea)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/17 "2006-09-14T03:18:59Z")
For atheists: do you believe that as non-believers you are scapegoats- a perceived threat to deists and their faith? Or a lost or misguided soul? For **diggleblop** and other Christians: do you feel that atheists have an agenda to put doubt in the minds of Christians when arguments concerning science arise? ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/18 "2006-09-14T03:22:45Z")
[QUOTE=yojimbo] There are also many atheists who are uncaring immoral fucks. The lack of god doesn’t do it however. They’re just cunts like the religious ones. [/QUOTE] I think I have a idea where the skew is coming from. Imagine a serial killer who professes to be christian. What do other christians think? “Well, clearly he isn’t christian; his actions prove that”. So he isn’t counted in their personal ideas of “bad christians”. On the other hand, with an athiest serial killer, there’s nothing that makes him not athiest. So they _are_ counted in the ranks of the bad athiests. So while there are likely to be in reality many more christian people who are “bad” (given the population of the U.S., not because christians = bad) they aren’t counted, while all the athiests are. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/19 "2006-09-14T03:25:35Z")
[QUOTE=FriarTed] No, just that they have no absolute grounding for morals & principles outside of sheer pragmatic utilitarianism and personal preference. [/QUOTE] Neither do Christians. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [September 14, 2006, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629/20 "2006-09-14T03:26:39Z")
[QUOTE=FriarTed] No, just that they have no absolute grounding for morals & principles outside of sheer pragmatic utilitarianism and personal preference. [/QUOTE] I find that most mainstream Christians don’t actually do much better… [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-christians-feel-that-athiests-are-amoral-or-unprincipled/372629.md?page=2)