# Do convicts really make license plates? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 23, 2011, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897 "2011-05-23T14:06:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/1 "2011-05-23T14:06:50Z")
Do convicts really make license plates? Did they ever? ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/2 "2011-05-23T14:33:51Z")
Yes they do… in numerous states. Here is just one example: [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/oklKAMEOT7I/hqdefault.jpg "Making license plates (Florida State Prison)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oklKAMEOT7I) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/3 "2011-05-23T16:55:58Z")
The way I heard it explained, the federal minimum wage laws apply to prisoners, too. But the authority behind the federal minimum wage laws is based on the commerce clause, which means that the states can work around it by having the prisoners only make things that aren’t relevant to interstate commerce. License plates are one of the few examples of such a product. Another, apparently, is the furniture in the dorms of a state university, though there the argument doesn’t seem as strong (the state _could_ buy furniture from somewhere out of state). ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/4 "2011-05-23T17:01:22Z")
They do in my state (Wisconsin). Many of my patients have made license plates. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/5 "2011-05-23T17:04:30Z")
Federal prisoners make many things through the [Unicor program](http://www.unicor.gov/). ---
**Author:** ![thelabdude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dc4da7/32.png) [@thelabdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelabdude)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/6 "2011-05-23T17:05:11Z")
Years ago when I worked for Rinshed Mason, they sold license plate paint to the Michigan State Prisons ---
**Author:** ![Jormungandr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@Jormungandr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jormungandr)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/7 "2011-05-23T18:14:46Z")
In California, they do. It said so on the envelope my plates came in. ---
**Author:** ![AuntiePam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/f19dbf/32.png) [@AuntiePam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AuntiePam)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2011, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/8 "2011-05-23T20:14:57Z")
License plates and road signs. We get our road signs from Prison Industries. They’re very reasonably priced. ---
**Author:** ![caveman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/caveman/32/7242_2.png) [@caveman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/caveman)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2011, 1:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/9 "2011-05-24T01:19:21Z")
TXDMV has an awesome caveat at the bottom of their custom plate order confirmation email due to this reality: “Please note: all plates are manufactured at a state prison facility. Unexpected lockdowns may delay your order.” ---
**Author:** ![jamie6](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/49beb7/32.png) [@jamie6](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jamie6)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2011, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/10 "2011-05-24T23:48:24Z")
So the minimum wage laws are probably why all the tables at my school were made by Kentucky prisoners. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/11 "2011-05-25T01:06:54Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The way I heard it explained, the federal minimum wage laws apply to prisoners, too. But the authority behind the federal minimum wage laws is based on the commerce clause, which means that the states can work around it by having the prisoners only make things that aren’t relevant to interstate commerce. License plates are one of the few examples of such a product. Another, apparently, is the furniture in the dorms of a state university, though there the argument doesn’t seem as strong (the state _could_ buy furniture from somewhere out of state). This is close, actually. A federal law requires that if prisoners make goods that travel in interstate commerce, they must be paid in parity with non-incarcerated workers who make the same products, whatever that wage is, and even if it is a LOT more than minimum wage. A program, called the [Prison Industries Enhancement Certification Program](http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/BJA/grant/piecp.html), certifies and monitors those prison industries that may sell in interstate commerce. If the products never move in interstate commerce, or the prisoners provide services, or the prisoners work in agricultural labor, the law does not apply, and the prisoners can be paid almost nothing. As a result, outside of PIECP industries, the prisoners generally return their work to the state. In the example of dorm room furniture, it isn’t a question of where the university can _buy_ (they can buy it anywhere) it’s a question of where the prison can _sell_ it (only to a state agency). ---
**Author:** ![Zsofia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/7bcc69/32.png) [@Zsofia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zsofia)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/12 "2011-05-25T01:12:23Z")
When I was in school, prisoners rebound our textbooks. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/13 "2011-05-25T02:08:00Z")
Thanks for the clarification, **Hello Again**. Although it does seem odd that the federal government would have such concern for prisoners, and yet so many states have no problem with prisoners making license plates (and other state goods) on the cheap. ---
**Author:** ![thelabdude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dc4da7/32.png) [@thelabdude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelabdude)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 2:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/14 "2011-05-25T02:30:55Z")
That is interesting. The prison my wife used to work at had a large book Brailing program. It was mostly automated. The inmates would cut the pages out of the books and feed them into an OCR system. It would then produce the Braile version. I wonder where the Braile versions go. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/15 "2011-05-25T02:48:04Z")
New York state law prohibits manufacturing prison-made products for sale to any commercial or private entity. The only organizations which can buy products made in NY prisons are government and non-profit organizations. ---
**Author:** ![coremelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@coremelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/coremelt)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/16 "2011-05-25T03:44:07Z")
Wait, are you seriously telling me every US state manufactures it’s own license plates internally in that state? I would expect license plate manufacture to be privatized and for some companies to bid for manufacturing for other states. Eg the same way that many small countries actually get their currency printed by Delarue in the UK (who also make the UK pounds) [http://www.delarue.com/ProductsSolutions/BanknoteProduction/IndustryExpertise/](http://www.delarue.com/ProductsSolutions/BanknoteProduction/IndustryExpertise/) ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/17 "2011-05-25T03:47:14Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Thanks for the clarification, **Hello Again**. Although it does seem odd that the federal government would have such concern for prisoners, and yet so many states have no problem with prisoners making license plates (and other state goods) on the cheap. The law (the [Ashurst-Sumners Act](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ashurst%E2%80%93Sumners_Act)) came about in 1935. It’s a worker-protection law, not a prisoner-protection law. Manufacturers felt it was unfair competition that would put non-prisoners out of work, and at a time when unemployment and job creation were major political issues, that had legs. On the other hand, the idea that prison should be self-sustaining, and the idea that productive work is beneficial in reformation of character, are two ideas that arose together with the American prison system, and are deeply entwined with it. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/18 "2011-05-25T04:07:33Z")
> [@thelabdude](#): > > That is interesting. The prison my wife used to work at had a large book Brailing program. It was mostly automated. The inmates would cut the pages out of the books and feed them into an OCR system. It would then produce the Braile version. I wonder where the Braile versions go. Probably to public libraries. > [@coremelt](#): > > Wait, are you seriously telling me every US state manufactures it’s own license plates internally in that state? > > I would expect license plate manufacture to be privatized and for some companies to bid for manufacturing for other states. Eg the same way that many small countries actually get their currency printed by Delarue in the UK (who also make the UK pounds) Prison labor pays something like $1.20 an hour in most states. I doubt you could do it cheaper in the private sector. And state governments are loath to buy products manufactured overseas, if they can avoid it. ---
**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/19 "2011-05-25T04:25:13Z")
> [@friedo](#): > > Probably to public libraries. > Prison labor pays something like $1.20 an hour in most states. I doubt you could do it cheaper in the private sector. And state governments are loath to buy products manufactured overseas, if they can avoid it. Federal Prison Industries (the work-producing arm of the Federal prison system)has a customer service/helpdesk service that they advertise as “domestic outsourcing at offshore prices.” [For reals.](http://www.unicor.gov/services/contact_helpdesk/) Able-bodied Federal prisoners can be required to work for _no_ pay. The actual pay range is [.23 cents per hour to 1.15/hr](http://www.bop.gov/inmate_programs/work_prgms.jsp). To receive above the minimum rate, the prisoner must have a high school diploma or GED. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2011, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897/20 "2011-05-25T05:06:42Z")
> [@](#): > > The actual pay range is .23 cents… Sorry, that math error is a pet peeve of mine. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-convicts-really-make-license-plates/582897.md?page=2)