Do dog breeds have predispositions toward certain behavior?

Factual Questions
41

TWDuke, I think you may have hit the nail on the head in terms of practical effect, at least regarding aggression.

I used to have a terrier/poodle cross. She was about 10 lbs. She hated every single living thing that was not a member of our family, and she was determined to kill them.

NB: human babies were excepted from this, for reasons I never understood.

When I took her out for a walk she’d be all happy, tail up, ears forward, the canine equivalent of a big smile, until another person was within lunging distance, at which point she’d try to kill them.

She got into our neighbour’s yard and tried to kill his dogs. Two Shepherd/Wolf crosses. I was not happy to find myself standing there (I’d gone over the fence and grabbed her and thrown her back into our yard) looking at those two.

She was, for all of her 14 years, a completely bloodthirsty would-be killer. She also weighed about 10 lbs.

The sweetest tempered Pit, or Rottie, or Doberman, or God forbid Neapolitan Mastiff just has to have one bad day and go after somebody and all of a sudden there’s cops and ambulances and major trauma surgery and big headlines.

It may not be that some dogs are more likely to bite than others, it could just be that some of them are better at it and it tends to get the attention.

42

I’m by no means an expert, but I have had relationships with several “Pit Bulls” and they’re owners, and this is what I know.

The origins of the breed (though in actuality there is no AKC recognized breed know as a Pit Bull, American Staffordshire Terrier is the breed most commonly referred to as Pit Bulls) is in dog fighting. Thus the "pit’ terminology. The breed came about through cross breeding betweend various terrier, and bulldogs strains in England. The intent was to ‘design’ (engineer) a tough, quick, smart, aggressive dog that would win fights with other dogs, but since had to be handled by their owners were also naturaly tolerant of humans.

Thus the breed, if it contains any inherant predisposition is to be “dog-aggressive” yet docile towards humans. The instances of “pit bull” attacks however, I believe are a matter of self-fulfilling media prophecy.

I don’t specifically recall the first headline grabbing story, but once one hit nationally others followed soon after, regardless of whether most instances of dog attacks were actually being perpetrated by pit bulls they were the ones being reported. This led to individuals interested in tough/vicious dogs choosing so called pit culls as their breed of choice, and thus the prophesy becomes self-fullfilled. Had those deviant humans chosen Rotweilers, German Shepards, or Beagles, and trained (abused) them towards viciousness then those dogs would in fact have grown vicious.

43

If you read some of those media reports closely, you’ll find that the “pit bulls” may actually be Rottweilers, or some other breed.

I think “Pit bull” has come to be used as a phrase for any dangerous, aggressive dog, regardless of breed.

44

It depends on what you’re doing with the collar and how you use it.

The Gentle Leader/Halti type is good for dogs who try to charge or run away while you are walking them. The design of the collar pulls them away from where they want to go, and back toward you. They aren’t necessarily a long term solution, but can be helpful in training. Some dogs find the pressure againt the muzzle calming, some go ballistic. Always take the time to condition the dog to the collar according to the directions, don’t just stick it on them and head out the door.

The choke collar can be useful in training, if you know how to use it and have good timing. It can be used to apply a precise correction, which is at least as much sound as tug if it is done properly. If your timing is bad, it won’t teach the dog anything. If you tug on it strongly enough to move he dogs head sideways, you can damage the neck and spine. If you use it to walk the dog, most dogs will pull against it without slowing down, and do permanent damage to their tracheas.

The prong collar is useful for dogs that pull on lead. The prongs don’t actually go into the dog (as someone said above, try it on yourself, it isn’t painful). However, most dogs won’t pull against it, and it can help to establish some control. It can also be used for applying corrections in training, again, if you have excellent timing.

In my opinion and experience, if you have a dog who is pulling on lead, a gentle leader or prong collar will get the dog’s attention long enough for you to train loose lead walking. You can do this with lots of reinforcement for doing what you want.

If you are using a choke collar for training, and your timing is good, it can be quite effective. Note that what it does is tell the dog when he/she has done something wrong. It seems only fair to also tell the dog when he/she has done something right, however you choose to do that. It gives the dog twice as much information and speeds up the learning process.

I will also note that different trainers have different methods and preferences. No one method works for all dogs. A good trainer can make almost any method work. Beware the trainer who insists that his/her method is the only right one for all dogs!

45

This is interesting for me to read, as I have a mixed breed dog about a year old, and we are unsure of what exactly she is. We are having fun guessing, and she does exhibit strong herding traits that make me think she has to be part shepherd. She loves bigger dogs and is amazingly patient with children, but does herd smaller dogs especially. It’s fun to see her instincts come out as she gets older, and provide us with clues to her background.

Her face has the markings of a doberman or rottie, but we are stumped by her size. She has a slight build, and only weighs about 35 -40 pounds. Picture a little rottie with a shepherd coat and ears (one stands up, the other flops down).

46

That’s actually not true at all. American Pit Bull Terriers make absolutely miserable guard dogs because, historically, they have been bred pretty severely against human aggression. Oh, they love a good roll with another dog, but even dog fighters will usually keep another more human-aggressive and protective breed loose in their kennels to protect their APBTs–the Pits will just go along with anyone, tail wagging, and get stolen right and left.

Peace,
~mixie

47

I should qualify that by emphasizing historically. The old dog fighters who developed and actively persued the breed culled extremely hard against any signs of human aggression–however, the tough reputation and appearance of these dogs has led to that lovely faction of gang members, drug dealers etc who “train” and breed for human aggression. These street bred dogs, like any other badly bred dog, can be extremely unpredictable. The same can be said though for any dog of any breed. Well bred APBTs are truly wonderful family dogs due to their goofy nature and absolute adoration of people. The dog-aggression though, is an entirely different story. Pretty much no way to get around that aspect.

Peace,
~Mixie

48

WAG, but have you ever seen an English Shepherd?

Peace,
~mixie

49

Bah. Every televised dog show skips Portuguese Water Dogs whenever they go through the Working breeds.

I’ve got two Porties. Both are terrified of water. Go figure.

50

[nitpick]

There’s no AKC recognized breed known as the Dogo Argentino, the Slovensky Cuvac, the Black Mouth Cur, Treeing Walker Hound, American Bulldog, Bracco Italiano, Dogue De Bordeaux, Sloughi, Thai Ridgeback, Fila Brasileiro, Cane Corso, New Guinea Singing Dog, Black Russian Terrier, Jindo, or hundreds of other breeds… This doesn’t mean they don’t exist. The American Staffordshire Terrier, along with the Staffordshire Bull Terrier and the American Pit Bull Terrier (and sometimes the Bull Terrier for the love o’ god) are all commonly called “Pit Bull” (“Pitbull” “Pitt Bull” “Pittbull”) by the general public due to their similar background and appearance–but as someone who has quite a bit of experience working with these dogs, they actually do have quite a distinct difference in appearance and personalities. It’s not difficult to tell them appart if you’re familiar with them.

[/nitpick]

The rest of your post was spot on though. Thanks :slight_smile:

Peace,
~mixie

51

Sorry for the late reply, I don’t usually read SD on the weekends. That could be where her markings come from! She has that same face, but her hair is shorter and more like a German Shepherd’s. She also has a white belly and chest, but the face is very similar.

Thanks for the picture!

52

This is a wonderfully informative thread (man, I just love the SDMB), and I’d like to just add that when I was a kid, we had a dog that was probably mostly English Sheepdog. A wonderful dog that put up with more from me than she should have. She exhibited what my parents called maternal instincts (having been spayed at a young age, she never whelped any of her own), and she used to gather up any spare pairs of socks - rolled in a little ball as my mom used to do it - and lie with her paws around them. I’m now thinking that may also have been a version of a herding instinct.

53

Well, turn on USA network tonight! There is always a Porty in the working group, and it is first up at Westminster. It starts at 8:00 pm Pacific, don’t know what time in other zones.

54

I think that all breeds are predisposed to sticking their nose out the car window, though ;).

As for leash training, I’ve found a remarkably simple method which seems to work well. When I’m walking a dog and the dog starts to pull, I just stop in place. Period. And I don’t start again until the dog stops pulling. So whatever it is over there that the dog is interested in, he doesn’t get to go sniff at until he behaves. I can’t speak for universality, of course, but it actually worked for the hellhound my mom used to have (and nothing ever worked for that dog).

55

This is sometimes referred to as the “Be a Tree” method. It does work, quite well. The drawback is that you need to do it every single time. That includes the time when you have five minutes to get the dog out and pottied, when it’s pouring down rain, when you’re late for an appointment, etc. Also, some dogs will pull and bark for a long time, if they are excited enough. A dog who needs a lot of exercise might not get it for a while.

A variation that also works, and for some dogs works faster, is “Penalty Yards.” When the dog pulls, you go backwards. You don’t turn around, you walk backwards, so that you are still facing the desired object, but getting farther away. When the dog turns around to see if you have lost your mind, the leash will slacken, you can call the dog to you and try again.

56

There’s another method, popularized by a certain trainer who’s name I can’t recall offhand where you immediately do an about-face and walk in the other direction. You’re also supposed to change directions fairly abruptly while walking (i.e. sharp right turn, etc) so the dog learns to pay close attention to what you’re doing… I guess the idea is that the dog learns that by not paying attention and staying closely to heel, he punishes himself by getting pulled, so it’s a self-correcting behavior. I’m sure that doesn’t make nearly as much sense as it did when I was reading up on it, and I’ve never tried it myself so I can’t vouch, heh.

Peace,
~mixie