# Do evil people have friends? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 17, 2003, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564 "2003-02-17T03:40:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/1 "2003-02-17T03:40:40Z")
I was listening to a program about Al Capone, _The Saint Valentine’s Day Massacre_, on tv the other night and they mentioned his croniies. That, of course, got me to thinking. Did Hitler, Amin, Capone, mob bosses, and other murderous souls have friends? I mean real friends, with a mutual love for each other. Aren’t most (all?) of them sociopaths? I tried, but couldn’t find any facts. Peace, mangeorge ---
**Author:** ![Trigonal\_Planar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/0ea827/32.png) [@Trigonal\_Planar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trigonal_Planar)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/2 "2003-02-17T03:47:47Z")
Wow, I can’t believe someone else has been pondering over this besides me. I always see footage of say, Hitler, and wonder, does this guy have any friends? Like, does he have people over for dinner and guys he hangs out with on the weekend? Surly he had friends from highschool…did he just alienate (or kill…) them all? ---
**Author:** ![Ringo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/779978/32.png) [@Ringo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ringo)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/3 "2003-02-17T04:00:05Z")
Just this evening I watched some home movies Eva Braun made of Adolph Hitler. He certainly seemed to have a mutually affectionate relationship with her. Whether or not he was buds with Goering, Hesse and the rest is unknown to me. I’d guess they had a few laughs together. I work with a guy who can be alternately charming, witty and friendly, or a deadly raging bull. At times when he perceives the most profit to be in promoting my talents, he’s friendly, sociable, etc., but if perceives an opportunity to inch ahead by stabbing me in the back, well, it’s just business. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/4 "2003-02-17T04:00:56Z")
For a time at least, Hitler and Albert Speer were friends. In general I’d say that evil people are not evil 100% of the time, and in their off hours may form friendships. So long as their friends aren’t exposed to their evil side, they remain friends. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Calculus\_of\_Logic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/aeb1de/32.png) [@The\_Calculus\_of\_Logic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Calculus_of_Logic)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/5 "2003-02-17T04:04:44Z")
Yes. read The Young Hitler I Knew by August. Kubizek. He was childhood friends with the future dictator. However, hitler basically blew him off w/o concern, so its hard to say. ---
**Author:** ![TBone2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@TBone2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBone2)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/6 "2003-02-17T04:09:07Z")
**Do evil people have friends?** I do. ---
**Author:** ![Squink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5e925/32.png) [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/7 "2003-02-17T04:09:58Z")
> [@](#): > > I have spent the best years of my life giving people the lighter pleasures, helping them have a good time, and all I get is abuse, the existence of a hunted man. -Al Capone [sub](If Dale Carnegie can be believed.)[/sub] Capone didn’t regard himself as evil. His friends probably didn’t either. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/8 "2003-02-17T04:25:57Z")
Well, Hitler had girlfriends, one of which he married just before his death, so you could say they were his friends. Rudolf Hess seems to have been a friend, until Hess sort of went crazy and parachuted into Scotland. Hitler was also friends with the Goebbels until near the end of his life, and he was cordial with his secretaries, even though it wasn’t a real friendship (He remembered their birthdays and gave them Christmas gifts) Capone was friends with “Lucky” Luciano He was married also, and all accounts seem to show that he and his wife loved each other, and also that he was close to his brother. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/9 "2003-02-17T04:28:22Z")
Here are some pictures of Capone with friends and family, and everybody seems happy. [http://www.gambino.com/bio/caponepics.htm#C](http://www.gambino.com/bio/caponepics.htm#C) ---
**Author:** ![Trigonal\_Planar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/0ea827/32.png) [@Trigonal\_Planar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trigonal_Planar)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/10 "2003-02-17T04:30:51Z")
The thing is though these guys were probably all friends due to their mutal evilness. ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/11 "2003-02-17T04:40:32Z")
If you’re rich and poweful people will want to be your friend, even if you’re a jerk. I agree with **Boyo Jim** - people who do evil things can be nice to people they care about? How about those women who fall in love with serial killers? ---
**Author:** ![kniz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c37758/32.png) [@kniz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kniz)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/12 "2003-02-17T04:41:27Z")
**Birds of a feather flock together.** ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/13 "2003-02-17T04:44:22Z")
I forgot about Capone’s soup kitchens. Honest, no strings charity. At least no strings to the people who ate there. PR to the world, I guess. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/14 "2003-02-17T05:15:32Z")
Is this really a brain teaser. True “evilness” as defined in a historical context is generally ascribed to the evildoer well _after_ the fact, and typically in a completely different social and historical context than when the “evil” acts were perpetrated. This is true of almost any example of historical “evil” you can think of. While some person may seem obviously “evil” in retrospect the complicated context they operated in may have afforded them lots of personal support by friends and followers which shared their perspectives and supported their actions, regardless of how obviously misguided or evil they may seem in hindsight. Slavery, National Socialism, Facism, Communism, all may seem quite obviously “evil” to various degrees in hindsight, but at one time these beliefs were the apple of their adherent’s eye and many otherwise honorable people would have died (and did) to protect and defend these beliefs. As an example think about some stupidity we might be perpertrating through action or inaction right now that future generations will judge us on. Global warming, nuclear proliferation, species extinction - take your pick. Will we be “evil” in some form or fashion to out great grandkids for these screwups? ---
**Author:** ![SC\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eb9ed0/32.png) [@SC\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SC_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/15 "2003-02-17T20:08:02Z")
I always thought evil people had minions. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/16 "2003-02-17T21:56:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by astro \* > \*\*Is this really a brain teaser. True “evilness” as defined in a historical context is generally ascribed to the evildoer well _after_ the fact, and typically in a completely different social and historical context than when the “evil” acts were perpetrated. > > This is true of almost any example of historical “evil” you can think of. While some person may seem obviously “evil” in retrospect the complicated context they operated in may have afforded them lots of personal support by friends and followers which shared their perspectives and supported their actions, regardless of how obviously misguided or evil they may seem in hindsight. > > Slavery, National Socialism, Facism, Communism, all may seem quite obviously “evil” to various degrees in hindsight, but at one time these beliefs were the apple of their adherent’s eye and many otherwise honorable people would have died (and did) to protect and defend these beliefs. > > As an example think about some stupidity we might be perpertrating through action or inaction right now that future generations will judge us on. Global warming, nuclear proliferation, species extinction - take your pick. Will we be “evil” in some form or fashion to out great grandkids for these screwups? \*\* I disagree. While evil “as defined in a historical context” is ascribed well after the fact, so are ALL historical labels. I think there were plenty of contemporaries of Hitler, Stalin, Mao, etc., who judged them evil at the time. History may or may not validate this judgement, but it rarely creates it. ---
**Author:** ![Trigonal\_Planar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/0ea827/32.png) [@Trigonal\_Planar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trigonal_Planar)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2003, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/17 "2003-02-17T22:04:55Z")
The question on the relativity of evilness is somewhat irrelevent to this question: Hitler still ordered millions dead and hated Jews: I wonder, did he have any Jewish friends? ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2003, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/18 "2003-02-18T00:15:17Z")
If you’re interested in getting some insight into Hitler’s interpersonal interactions, I recommend you check the schedule for your local repertory film house to see if they’re going to be playing _Blind Spot_ any time soon. It’s a feature-length documentary interview with one of Hitler’s personal secretaries, and is packed with interesting little tidbits about what he was like in his day-to-day life. (He loved his dog, for example.) Yeah, it’s 90 minutes of nothing but a talking head (with subtitles, no less), but it’s fascinating all the same. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2003, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/19 "2003-02-18T01:26:52Z")
To my surprise I found that sunday’s _Parade_ magazine ran an article, with pictures ;), of the “10 Worst Living Dictators”. I must be sidekick. I tried to link to it, but for some reason the article isn’t on their website. So here they are, sans details and pictures; [list=1] [1]Kim Jong Il, North Korea. [2]King Fahd and Crown Prince Abdullah, Saudi Arabia. [3]Saddam Hussein, Iraq. [4]Charles Taylor, Liberia. [5]Than Shwe, Burma. [6]Teodoro Obiang Nguema, Equatorial Guinea. [7]Saparmurad Niyazov, Turkmenistan. [8]Muammar Al-Qaddafi, Libya. [9]Fidel Castro, Cuba. and [10]Alexander Lukashenko, Belarus [/list=1] Not _all_ of these guys are evil, I’m sure. And there are people in the world who are even more evil. Wow! they’re ALL men! [www.parade.com](http://www.parade.com) does link to other sites that give details about these lovelies. So, how about some of the sweethearts we’ve got right here in the USA and in prison? And those who haven’t been caught? The killer of that pregnant woman in Stockton, CA? These are actual, real people, aren’t they. Sometimes I forget that. _Charles freakin’ Taylor_, fer crissakes? I think I hitch-hiked with that guy once, back in the 60’s. We got high in his old vw bus. BTW; thanks, **Cervaise**. ---
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2003, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564/20 "2003-02-18T01:33:57Z")
Maybe the OP would also like to ask: What about the average evil person on the streets? They are opportunists! You are conned into believing they are your friend, but they are simply fair weather-type friends. They will be more than glad to stab you in the back or sell you up the river in the blink of an eye…if there’s some advantage or personal gain in it for them. Beware, there are many chameleons amongst us! - Jinx [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-evil-people-have-friends/155564.md?page=2)