# Do I sound angry to you too (probably mild)? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 10, 2006, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169 "2006-08-10T16:08:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/57b2e6/32.png) [@Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Random)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/41 "2006-08-11T05:06:52Z")
[QUOTE=monstro] I think I reacted so defensively because just recently, there was a thread (I think it was the “tarbaby” thread) where the OP ranted against the “outrage” of the black community. [/QUOTE] Ranted? In this OP? > **["Tar Baby" - offensive slur?](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=382011)** > > From here: http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/07/31/romney.racialremark.ap/index.html Massachusetts governor Mitt Romney refers to Big Dig mess as a “tar baby” – Black leaders outraged. I’ve heard Iraq referred to as a tar baby, and was somewhat... (For those who can’t be bothered to look, my OP there noted a CNN/AP article that reported that blacks were “outraged” (yes, that’s a quote) about a politician’s use of the phrase “tar baby” and asked if that phrase was universally regarded as a slur. That’s all. In fact, the entire thread was calm. Your sister even thanked me at one point. (At least mostly calm. You seemed a little peeved at one point, but even that wasn’t a rant.) Trust me, if I want to “rant” about something here, I’ll do it, and people will know that I’m attacking someone or something. (Cites provided on request.) A link in a later post noted that BET (hardly an anti-black source) had reported the reaction to this comment in the black community, again using the word “outrage”: > [@BET](#): > > **Black Folks Rip Governor For “Tar Baby” Remark** > > Massachusetts Gov. Mitt Romney has outraged some Black folks for using the term 'tar baby"… So if you’re angry about people who you think “throw about” this term in a manner that you conclude is somehow anti-black, maybe you should write a letter to BET? I don’t appreciate your statement that I’m using “loaded” terms in some sort of anti-black fashion. Nowhere in that thread did I in any way say anything even remotely negative about this alleged reaction of the black community. I noted the reports, and asked a somewhat related question. Calm discussion ensued. Calm, even by GD standards. I even acknowledged the possibility that the news reports might have been inaccurate. So you have mischaracterized what I said there. You lied. Kind of stupid, for someone who, in this thread, is trying to convince people that she is calm and rational. And this is a pattern for you. You often mischaracterize posts, in an obvious way. (I can provide a cite or two for that point, as well.) Mischaracterizing posts in a way that’s obvious is another way that you tend to show that you are both dishonest and lack intelligence. See, **this** might be called a rant. At a minimum, it’s clear that I’m expressing annoyance. The great debates post that you lied about is not a rant. Not even close. If the truth is that you’re not dishonest, just stupid, try reading that OP again, and return to this one. See the difference? No, I don’t expect an apology. Because you’re obsessive, too. In my experience, stupid, dishonest, obsessive people seldom apologize. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 5:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/42 "2006-08-11T05:20:48Z")
FWIW, I’ve seen your posts around here for a long time and you don’t strike me even remotely as being an angry or irritable or hostile person. Quite the contrary, actually. ---
**Author:** ![Scissorjack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c67d28/32.png) [@Scissorjack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scissorjack)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/43 "2006-08-11T05:22:18Z")
[QUOTE=Oy!] But the punk-rocker phase with your sister saying Oy! is just weird. I associate the word with nice middle-aged Jewish women from Long Island (pronounced Lawn Giland, mind you), not punk rockers! [/QUOTE] [A brief history of Oi!](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oi!). It’s a skinhead rather than a punk thing, and often in itself racist, or at least with racist connotations. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/44 "2006-08-11T05:46:52Z")
[QUOTE=Case Sensitive] [A brief history of Oi!](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oi!). It’s a skinhead rather than a punk thing, and often in itself racist, or at least with racist connotations. [/QUOTE] I was going to disagree about the racist connotations of “Oi,” but your link beat me to it. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/45 "2006-08-11T05:49:06Z")
Oh, and good lord, **Random** , she said she _thought_ it was the tar baby thread. Calm down, already. ---
**Author:** ![Random](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/57b2e6/32.png) [@Random](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Random)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/46 "2006-08-11T06:03:24Z")
[QUOTE=Miller] Oh, and good lord, **Random** , she said she _thought_ it was the tar baby thread. Calm down, already. [/QUOTE] It’s clear what thread she was referring to. If she was mistaken about the thread she had in mind, as you seem to be saying, I look forward to her retraction, which undoubtedly will have a link to the thread that she meant to refer to. Good night. You can all now return to your MPSIMS-style group hug. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/47 "2006-08-11T06:04:37Z")
[QUOTE=Cheesesteak] I saw you as being a bit peeved or at least disappointed in the decision. I didn’t hear outrage, though. Argent Towers was outraged. I’ve noticed that people will take in the tone of one post, and apply it to others who have a similar position, even if they haven’t expressed that tone themselves. [/QUOTE] I’m not really outraged - outraged is how I feel about Daniel Craig being cast as James Bond, or even worse, Vin Diesel being cast as 47. I’m disappointed that dark-skinned ethnic women don’t get more starring roles. I’m upset that Lucy Liu is the only Asian actress that anyone knows off the top of their head, and that Halle Berry is the only black actress that anyone knows off the top of their head. There are a plethora of popular black MEN in Hollywood, but the women seem to be getting the shaft. More than anything, I think Angelina Jolie does not look anything like Marianne Pearl. I’m sure they could have found an actress that looked more like her. Instead they opted for the star power route and chose someone with a high recognition factor who did not look like the real life woman. ---
**Author:** ![Scissorjack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c67d28/32.png) [@Scissorjack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scissorjack)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/48 "2006-08-11T08:44:08Z")
[QUOTE=Miller] I was going to disagree about the racist connotations of “Oi,” but your link beat me to it. [/QUOTE] Yeah, that was badly phrased: I should have said it’s often _stigmatised_ for its supposedly racist overtones. ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/49 "2006-08-11T09:48:55Z")
Well, the OP in the other thread certainly didn’t seem angry to me. This sort of reminds me of a poll Sky television (I think) did in the UK about David Blaine’s daft “living in a box” stunt. It asked viewers what they thought about the “feat”, giving them two options; are you: a) angry, or b) amazed? Hmm. It’s a poser, all right. Hey, how about the recent “Memoirs of a Geisha” movie, in which half the major geisha parts were played by … um, Chinese actresses. That was fucking dumb. What, there wasn’t a _single_ decent Japanese actress around that they had to get Zhang Ziyi in instead? Cobblers. Hey, but western audiences won’t know the difference, right? Augh! ---
**Author:** ![Idlewild](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/8491ac/32.png) [@Idlewild](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Idlewild)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 11:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/50 "2006-08-11T11:10:16Z")
[QUOTE=Dead Badger] Hey, how about the recent “Memoirs of a Geisha” movie, in which half the major geisha parts were played by … um, Chinese actresses. That was fucking dumb. What, there wasn’t a _single_ decent Japanese actress around that they had to get Zhang Ziyi in instead? Cobblers. Hey, but western audiences won’t know the difference, right? Augh! [/QUOTE] This, plus a self-congratulatory statement I read about how happy the producers were to have an Asian cast, made me so mad I won’t see the damn film. Not even if it is terribly pretty. My husband pointed out that Zhang Ziyi was presumably cast on the basis of having at least some box-office draw in the US but I’m still annoyed. ---
**Author:** ![look\_ninjas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/b2d939/32.png) [@look\_ninjas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/look_ninjas)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/51 "2006-08-11T12:27:13Z")
Count me in as another person who didn’t see any anger in that OP. At all. You were a bit puzzled, and you were asking for people to bring up moments that puzzled or maybe even angered them in movies. Instead we get the big “Is Halle Berry black?” debate. I really don’t get it. ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/52 "2006-08-11T13:10:25Z")
What anger? What outrage? What “angry young black woman” shtick?? The only thing I see is someone becoming agitated at having to defend themselves over something that looks like they took extreme care with in the first place. Geesh. And for what it’s worth **monstro** , I read a lot of your posts because they’re well thought-out, informative, interesting and intelligent. I can always count on them to make me reconsider how I look at things I might know nothing about. So, in my humble opinion, I wouldn’t worry. It appears that the folks who were offended brought more of their own issues to the table than you supplied any. Lastly, I certainly wouldn’t ever call someone else to task for how _I_ read a tone into another’s use of the word interesting. You’d think just typing it out alone on how that was done would be clue enough. Keep up the good work. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Badger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/848f3c/32.png) [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/53 "2006-08-11T13:34:03Z")
[QUOTE=Idlewild] This, plus a self-congratulatory statement I read about how happy the producers were to have an Asian cast, made me so mad I won’t see the damn film. Not even if it is terribly pretty. [/QUOTE] It got fairly lousy reviews as I recall, and the overriding impression I got was that it was pretty dull regardless of the casting. So, no great loss I guess. Zhang Ziyi really isn’t all that great an actress IMO, although she obviously is very attractive. Not quite the same thing, but it was also reassuring to know that the Last Samurai turned out to be an American. Tom Cruise, no less! Awesome. Y’know, I’m not sure this “Japan” place really exists at all. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/54 "2006-08-11T13:36:13Z")
[QUOTE=Zoe] BTW, a certain FRPC (female red Persian cat) named Pumpkin is impressed with Monstro-the-cat and sends this greeting: mmmnb [/quote] Monstro sez: “I already got a girlfriend, but that don’t mean we can’t have a little fun!” > [@Excalibre](#): > > Me neither, for what it’s worth. I think of you as “that hot chick who I discussed hair with that one time.” That’s funny, because I think of you for the same reason! (Not the hot chick thing, but the hair discussion.) **Random** , you can puff and blow all you want, but I’m not rehashing that thread. ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/55 "2006-08-11T13:48:21Z")
[QUOTE=Dead Badger] Not quite the same thing, but it was also reassuring to know that the Last Samurai turned out to be an American. Tom Cruise, no less! Awesome. [/QUOTE] An _alcoholic_ American, no less. Who just stumbled upon the samurai culture at the last minute and was able to become this kickass, sword-slinging warrior in less than a few years. I hated that movie. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/56 "2006-08-11T13:54:59Z")
[QUOTE=monstro] I hope Jada Pinkett Smith plays me in the StraightDope made-for-TV movie [/QUOTE] Does Jada Pinkett look anything like you? I think we need a Miami Dopefest. I can swing by Brahman and get my car maintenanced, so it wouldn’t be a totally frivolous trip. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/57 "2006-08-11T14:05:36Z")
[QUOTE=ShibbOleth] Does Jada Pinkett look anything like you? [/QUOTE] I wish! ---
**Author:** ![stretch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a6a055/32.png) [@stretch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stretch)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 2:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/58 "2006-08-11T14:27:44Z")
There was no outrage in the linked thread’s OP. People read what they want to read. Both you and **ywtf** may very well have been tarred (heh) with the “angry black woman” brush due to the icky rape/stats/race threads\*, which would be unfortunate. Generally, I find both of you to be even-headed and I enjoy your posts. Of course you can be riled up…you wouldn’t be human if you couldn’t. And I find nothing wrong in getting upset after someone starts picking at you. Some people just don’t have anything better to do than try to start fights and right now you are an easy target because of the other threads. This too shall pass–those kind of people get bored easy. \*no links, if you don’t know what I’m talking about, consider yourselves lucky ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/59 "2006-08-11T15:43:27Z")
[QUOTE=monstro] Why can’t we generalize about Hollywood? People generalize about all kinds of institutions, from the federal government to the corporate world to various minority “communities”. Is it wrong to say that Hollywood is profit-driven? That it selects for people who are both talented and good-looking? That it produces movies that often draw big box offices? People draw generalizations all the time. As long as they don’t do it too often and they are based on truth, I don’t see a problem with it. I disagree with everything you’ve said here. I wasn’t complaining about “improper” anything. I don’t think I was being “unfair”, particularly since I made mention of roles taken by blacks that were not written for black characters. I wasn’t making a point on anything…since I wasn’t presenting an argument (for a change). I was just asking some questions and trying to start a conversation. Your _tone_ in this thread is combative and overly argumentative. It would be appropriate if I were whining or throwing a fit, but I wasn’t. If I had wanted a major debate, I would have gone to GD. [/QUOTE] You can make generalzations about Hollywood. I never said you couldn’t. All I said was that they induce painful eye rolls. Maybe I should have clairified and said that they induce painful eye rolls in me. I think it is kind of strange that you wanted to start a conversation but also want to claim that you basically have no position in that conversation. Because reading your OP, it does come across that you did not approve the casting of Angelina Jolie to play ‘a black woman’. Saying that black people sometimes get roles that may have been intended for white actors does not mean anything. You also didn’t address your use of a film from 1937 as an example of bad Hollywood race casting and how I feel it is unfair to use that. I don’t see the combative and overly argumentative tone in saying that actresses want roles. The lines you quoted for this part were, to me at least, obviously a joke. You come off to me that way in your response. BTW I had no idea you were a black woman, nor do I care. Here, to me, you are just **monstro**. I generally don’t think about race or gender or sexual orientation or religion when reading the dope, except for the dopers I’ve met in real life. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [August 11, 2006, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169/60 "2006-08-11T17:46:57Z")
[QUOTE=Zebra] You can make generalzations about Hollywood. I never said you couldn’t. All I said was that they induce painful eye rolls. Maybe I should have clairified and said that they induce painful eye rolls in me. I think it is kind of strange that you wanted to start a conversation but also want to claim that you basically have no position in that conversation. **Because reading your OP, it does come across that you did not approve the casting of Angelina Jolie to play ‘a black woman’.** Saying that black people sometimes get roles that may have been intended for white actors does not mean anything. You also didn’t address your use of a film from 1937 as an example of bad Hollywood race casting and how I feel it is unfair to use that. [/quote] bolding mine Multiple times I expressed praise for Jolie. I remember saying that I had no beef with her taking this role, and I also remember saying I did not disagree with the casting director’s choice. Only selective reading would allow someone to think I disapproved of Jolie. And even if I had, so what? Is this such a crime? Would you have attacked me if I had expressed disappointment about a white actor playing a white character? And you haven’t explained why it’s not fair for me to cite _The Good Earth_. I also cited _Imitation of Life_, a movie that preceded it. Do you have a problem with that movie too? When does “Hollywood” start for you? In the 80s? Ha! I don’t even know why I’m arguing with you. It’s obvious to me that you’re picking a fight over absolutely nothing…perhaps as a way of saving face. So I’m going to step away and hope that you at least consider the possibility that you misjudged the nature of my OP. If you don’t, well, it’s no skin off my nose. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-i-sound-angry-to-you-too-probably-mild/368169.md?page=4)