# Do incandescent bulb hoarders now feel like idiots with the new $2.50 LED bulbs available? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 31, 2015, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265 "2015-05-31T17:23:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/21 "2015-05-31T22:40:35Z")
Make the CFL, NOT LED. A dimmable LED would be a nightmare - how do you do a power supply for 3 LEDs (dimest), 7 LEDs, 12, LEDs (however many for full bright? Keep it at 1.5v DC (whatever) ---
**Author:** ![Mdcastle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/958977/32.png) [@Mdcastle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mdcastle)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2015, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/22 "2015-05-31T22:51:02Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Make the CFL, NOT LED. > > A dimmable LED would be a nightmare - how do you do a power supply for 3 LEDs (dimest), 7 LEDs, 12, LEDs (however many for full bright? Keep it at 1.5v DC (whatever) There is a clever design that adds red leds at the lowest dim level (to emulate the reddish look of incandescent), but LED bulbs dim just like incandescents, using pulse width modulation to cut out part of the AC cycle, rather than disabling individual LED emitters. The problem is the implementation has so far been rather suboptimal. LED’s (and not just the cheap China junk) tend to flicker when dimmed, and the “range” is nowhere linear or close to the range of an incandescent, and they have a minimum brightness to turn on which is too bright for home theater or bedroom nightlight applications. ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2015, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/23 "2015-05-31T23:26:28Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Make the CFL, NOT LED. > > A dimmable LED would be a nightmare - how do you do a power supply for 3 LEDs (dimest), 7 LEDs, 12, LEDs (however many for full bright? Keep it at 1.5v DC (whatever) You seriously underestimate the cleverness (and complexity) of LED drivers… [Here’s](http://www.nxp.com/documents/data_sheet/SSL5231BT.pdf) an example. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2015, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/24 "2015-05-31T23:28:55Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Make the CFL, NOT LED. > > A dimmable LED would be a nightmare - how do you do a power supply for 3 LEDs (dimest), 7 LEDs, 12, LEDs (however many for full bright? Keep it at 1.5v DC (whatever) If they’re a “nightmare,” they’ve managed to work fine for me. They’re obviously not the same as incandescents since they don’t change color temperature as they dim (save for the ones **Mdcastle** mentions which I’ve not encountered) but they’ve worked fine in my experience. ---
**Author:** ![May\_20](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ce7236/32.png) [@May\_20](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/May_20)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2015, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/25 "2015-05-31T23:46:33Z")
I chose to stockpile incandescent bulbs because CFLs can trigger or worsen a migraine attack for me. I haven’t experimented with LEDs yet, so I don’t know how they will or won’t affect me. I will, though. So, no, I don’t feel like an idiot. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Marion\_Wormer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d07c76/32.png) [@Marion\_Wormer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marion_Wormer)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/26 "2015-06-01T00:13:58Z")
> [@May\_20](#): > > I chose to stockpile incandescent bulbs because CFLs can trigger or worsen a migraine attack for me. I haven’t experimented with LEDs yet, so I don’t know how they will or won’t affect me. I will, though. > > So, no, I don’t feel like an idiot. 😛 I stockpiled the incandescent true color bulbs because I need them when I put on make up. It’s a special need the the LEDs can’t support. LED’s in my bathrooms make the white tiles and fixtures look like different shades of yellow. So no, I don’t feel like an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/27 "2015-06-01T00:14:34Z")
There seems to much more money pursuing “not incandescent” lighting than I expected. So, are CFL’s now about to be banned in favor of LED’s? Until I can buy a $10 (2015 price) dimmer and know it will work on any bulb with a mating connector, I will keep my incandescents. ---
**Author:** ![HeXen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@HeXen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HeXen)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/28 "2015-06-01T00:18:54Z")
I have yet to buy a modern lightbulb that I like over the old incandescents. It might exist but probably costs a lot more. Too many different kinds of bulbs out there for me. ---
**Author:** ![zweisamkeit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zweisamkeit/32/4360_2.png) [@zweisamkeit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zweisamkeit)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/29 "2015-06-01T00:33:28Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > There is no barrier to small production of standard bulbs in every shape, size and configuration back to Edison, any more than there is a barrier to making classic tires. (You can buy concours-grade tires for anything back to a Model T or earlier, by the way.) Which is why I said they were concerned but not freaking out. I’m speaking about several years ago. It’s not an issue now. ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/30 "2015-06-01T01:08:58Z")
Ya know, yeah, LED bulbs are much more efficient and last 10 times longer, but who really cares? The govt should not ‘outlaw’ incandescent bulbs. They could give incentives to the manufacture and sale of LEDs, but ultimately the market will decide. And years from now if and when LEDs have replaced incandescents the world is not going to be any different. I moved into a new apartment ten years ago and specifically replaced all the bulbs with CFs. My electric bill wasn’t any noticeably lower. Only difference was when I moved out five years later all the CF bulbs were still working (I took them with me!) And the fact that the OP choose to use the words ‘hoarders’ and even more ‘idiots’ in the title to refer to those who don’t want to adopt LEDs shows a real smarmy, condescending, environmentalist bent. Similar to anti-smoking zealots who want to retcon the idea that ‘everybody used to smoke and nobody gave a shit’ from history. Or that sales of hybrids only shot up because gas almost tripled in price, not because people suddenly wanted to save the world. And now that gas has gone back down hybrid sales have as well. Incandescent light bulbs are not evil. They were in fact, one of the single greatest inventions in the history of the world. And LEDs are a worthy, incremental improvement. But we can do without the emotional rhetoric, m’kay? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/31 "2015-06-01T01:26:55Z")
> [@Hail\_Ants](#): > > Ya know, yeah, LED bulbs are much more efficient and last 10 times longer, but who really cares? The govt should not ‘outlaw’ incandescent bulbs. They could give incentives to the manufacture and sale of LEDs, but ultimately the market will decide. And years from now if and when LEDs have replaced incandescents the world is not going to be any different. I moved into a new apartment ten years ago and specifically replaced all the bulbs with CFs. My electric bill wasn’t any noticeably lower. Only difference was when I moved out five years later all the CF bulbs were still working (I took them with me!) > > And the fact that the OP choose to use the words ‘hoarders’ and even more ‘idiots’ in the title to refer to those who don’t want to adopt LEDs shows a real smarmy, condescending, environmentalist bent. Similar to anti-smoking zealots who want to retcon the idea that ‘everybody used to smoke and nobody gave a shit’ from history. Or that sales of hybrids only shot up because gas almost tripled in price, not because people suddenly wanted to save the world. And now that gas has gone back down hybrid sales have as well. > > Incandescent light bulbs are not evil. They were in fact, one of the single greatest inventions in the history of the world. And LEDs are a worthy, incremental improvement. But we can do without the emotional rhetoric, m’kay? 😃 sorry, no. Incandescent lamps are like 1 to 2% efficient at doing their intended jobs. 98-99% of the energy they consume is wasted. that’s horrible at best. the only way “the market” could correct for that is if utility companies jacked up the rates they charge for power, at which point people like you would rail against “government-backed monopolies trying to force the issue.” ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/32 "2015-06-01T01:40:49Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > But they’re safer for brake lights. > > An incandescent bulb can take up to 0.25 seconds to come to full intensity. So when you hit your brakes, the driver behind you gets your signal 0.25 seconds later. > > A quarter second doesn’t sound like much. But at 65 MPH, you’ll cover 24 feet during that quarter second. Which _is_ significant. LED’s don’t consume enough electricity to trigger older turn signal modules. As to the op, that’s a promotional price. I was thinking about buying a couple of 100w equivalent for my garage but they’re still too expensive for my needs. I’ve got 60 watt equivalents in my high-use rooms and am pleased with them but I’m surprised how hot the bulb bases get. Has me wondering how much more efficient they are than the CFL’s. My local power company sponsors CFL’s so they’re practically free. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/33 "2015-06-01T01:46:15Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > sorry, no. Incandescent lamps are like 1 to 2% efficient at doing their intended jobs. 98-99% of the energy they consume is wasted. that’s horrible at best. the only way “the market” could correct for that is if utility companies jacked up the rates they charge for power, at which point people like you would rail against “government-backed monopolies trying to force the issue.” That’s ridiculous. When incandescent bulbs were banned, CFLs were the only reasonable economical alternative. Hey we’re saving the environment! Let’s not worry about the mercury! Everyone will totally start bringing those CFLs back to the always convenient hazardous waste disposal dropoff! And lighting doesn’t make up a large part of energy usage. Jacking up the price on electricity to make up for incandescent bulbs is silly. They could have placed special tax on them or subsidized LEDs (more than they did). Who cares if they were inefficient. They worked and they were cheap. Addressing energy production is what should be done to make any real difference. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/34 "2015-06-01T01:57:23Z")
incandescent bulbs HAVE NOT BEEN BANNED!!!~!!! ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/35 "2015-06-01T02:01:41Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Are these LEDs dimmable? > > Anyways, unless they stocked a warehouse I doubt now that “several” years later LEDs have become reasonably priced is going to make many people regret it. It’s not like they can’t still use them or cost them all that much money. The electricity bills are much higher, and changing those incandescents is a pain in the ass. ---
**Author:** ![rsa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/839c29/32.png) [@rsa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rsa)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/36 "2015-06-01T02:04:55Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > There’s no simple answer, because many states have rebate or subsidy programs for which some bulbs qualify and some don’t. There is also a fairly large quality gradient, depending on light quality (CRI), dimmability and incoming fancy features like “dim-to-red” which more closely emulates the way incandescent bulbs work. (Many people, myself included, hate a very low light level of “white” light. It just looks wrong even though it’s technically superior to the way incandescent bulbs generate light.) > > So you can get a middlin’-quality, mostly-dimmable, subsidized 100W-equivalent bulb for $5 or so, or a current SOTA bulb (better color, fully dimmable, no subsidy) for as much as $25. The curve is flattening fast, though, and in a year it will generally be only good-quality bulbs with good color and good dimming in that under-$10 range. There will likely be a remaining curve for “premium” bulbs for a few years. Don’t forget that you’ll want to be able to control each of your [bulbs](http://www.homedepot.com/p/Philips-Hue-60W-Equivalent-A19-Single-LED-Light-Bulb-456012/205543848?N=5yc1vZbm79Z15bZ12l2) from a smartphone while you’re anywhere in the world. Only $69.97 each ($59.97 online). ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/37 "2015-06-01T02:06:00Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > That’s ridiculous. When incandescent bulbs were banned, CFLs were the only reasonable economical alternative. Hey we’re saving the environment! Let’s not worry about the mercury! Everyone will totally start bringing those CFLs back to the always convenient hazardous waste disposal dropoff! And lighting doesn’t make up a large part of energy usage. Jacking up the price on electricity to make up for incandescent bulbs is silly. They could have placed special tax on them or subsidized LEDs (more than they did). > > Who cares if they were inefficient. They worked and they were cheap. Addressing energy production is what should be done to make any real difference. Re “And lighting doesn’t make up a large part of energy usage” I would beg to disagree. 14% of an average US household’s total electrical bill is hardly a minor amount of electricity. Utilities heavily subsidize residential and commercial lighting switchover precisely because of those huge savings. It saves them from having to invest in new, extremely expensive production capacity. > **[How Much Do Lights Affect an Electric Bill?](https://budgeting.thenest.com/much-lights-affect-electric-bill-27123.html)** > > Everyone wants to save money on electricity bills, and we've all heard that turning the lights off when we leave a room can help us save. But what portion of an electricity bill is comprised of light bulb use? An easy calculation will help you... > [@](#): > > According to the U.S. Energy Information Service, lights represented roughly 14 percent of the average household electric bill in 2010 ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/38 "2015-06-01T02:12:16Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > The electricity bills are much higher, and changing those incandescents is a pain in the ass. The electric bills are not “much higher.” Or at any rate, when I replaced a bunch of incandescents with the other things there was no notable reduction in my electric bill. In fact, no reduction at all. Possibly because my heating bill went up. ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/39 "2015-06-01T02:17:42Z")
In my house in Michigan I have a small horde of 100W incandescent. I use them with SCR-driven dimmers. In my company housing I have all CLF’s (none of them dimmable) except for the heat lamps in a couple of the bathrooms. The problem with CFL’s is that color temperature never matches when I buy new bulbs. I like the 2700K bulbs, and when I put a new one into the lamp set, it’s noticeably much cooler than the other bulbs. Some of my lamps have 10 bulbs, and I don’t want to change nine that are unnecessary. Another bothersome thing is that there’s not mechanical standard for the bulbs. For the same given power rating, there may be two or more bases, and the big-based bulbs don’t fit all of my fixtures. And then of course even for the same rating I have to make sure that the bulb is spiral (if the others are spiral) or a straight tube (if the others are tubes.) Finally, some of them turn on faster than others. It’s annoying to turn on my overhead dining room light and see them come on at different speeds. It used to _easy_ to buy bulbs. ---
**Author:** ![urban1a](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e47c2d/32.png) [@urban1a](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/urban1a)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2015, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265/40 "2015-06-01T02:21:02Z")
I had no objection to moving on from the non-BANNED incandescent bulbs since I had been using halogens for a long time anyway because they outlast incandescents. Halogens now are becoming more energy efficient and cheaper and looking more like the old style bulbs but I do not have to adjust the infrastructure of my house to use them. I don’t plan on going with the LEDs at all because the ones I have seen have more of a moonlight quality than a sunlight quality and all the ambient colors are, simply, wrong. The same with CFL bulbs and those have an added problem of containing an amount of mercury which is extremely dangerous; and I doubt many of these were/are disposed safely like the instructions say. Bob [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-incandescent-bulb-hoarders-now-feel-like-idiots-with-the-new-2-50-led-bulbs-available/721265.md?page=3)