# Do navies patrol lakes? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 19, 2022, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079 "2022-04-19T20:22:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Hatchie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hatchie/32/3983_2.png) [@Hatchie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hatchie)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/1 "2022-04-19T20:22:12Z")
After reading about the sinking of the Russian ship Moskva in the Caspian Sea, a lake by any other name, I had to wonder how many countries have a military presence on inland bodies of water. I can’t imagine the US Navy patrols Lake Superior, but maybe I’m wrong. It’s pretty big; and of course there’s need to keep tabs on the comings and goings between the US and Canada, but I can’t see battleships as part of it. I’m sure Customs agencies have boats- is the Coast Guard involved? What about the Black Sea, Lake Victoria, Lake Titicaca, maybe other freshwater lakes that have shores in different countries? What kind of boats and firepower do they pack? Also, do some landlocked countries have navies? I can imagine some don’t actually nav and exist for reasons of national pride, because everyone likes snappy uniforms. I could look this stuff up but it’s more fun to ask here. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/2 "2022-04-19T20:23:26Z")
It wasn’t the Caspian Sea, it was the Black Sea, which is connected to the Mediterranean (and thus the Atlantic Ocean). As for the rest of the question, the US Coast Guard patrols large inland bodies of water, including the Great Lakes. Other countries’ navies and auxiliaries are responsible for their own inland waterways, and may be called Coast Guard, Navy, Naval Police, or many other names depending on the country. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/3 "2022-04-19T20:24:05Z")
> [@Hatchie](#): > > After reading about the sinking of the Russian ship Moskva in the Caspian Sea … The Moskva was struck in the Black Sea, which is open to the Mediterranean and Atlantic via the [Turkish Straits](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turkish_Straits). ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/4 "2022-04-19T20:27:33Z")
The US Navy does operate on the Great Lakes to some degree and in the past to a major degree. Our largest training base is actually called [Great Lakes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Station_Great_Lakes). The US Navy ended non-training operations about 100 years ago when the Navy turned it over the Coast Guard. If a large lake was a border between two nations less friendly then the US & Canada, I would expect Naval units. * * * * * * For what it is worth, in the African Queen the Germans had a few navy ships on a fictional lake. But I believe C.S. Forester based this on the fact the Germans did have some small Navy Ships on large lakes in Africa in WWI. Here we go: > **[MV Liemba](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MV_Liemba)** > > Pages for logged out editors learn more > > MV Liemba, formerly Graf Goetzen or Graf von Goetzen,\[a\] is a passenger and cargo ferry that runs along the eastern shore of Lake Tanganyika. The Marine Services Company Limited of Tanzania sails her, with numerous stops to pick up and set down passengers, between the ports of Kigoma, Tanzania and Mpulungu, Zambia. > Graf von Goetzen was built in 1913 in Germany, and was one of three vessels the German Empire used to control Lake Tanganyika during ... ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/5 "2022-04-19T20:33:39Z")
The US Coast Guard has the standard maritime border enforcement role, which relieves the Navy of that function in peacetime. Apparently, one major remaining US Navy nautical operation in the Great Lakes is the acceptance trials of _Freedom_-class Littoral Combat Ships, which are built in and launched from the Fincantieri Marinette shipyard at Marinette, Wisconsin. > **[12th Wisconsin-built Littoral Combat Ship completes acceptance trials in Lake...](https://www.cbs58.com/news/12th-wisconsin-built-littoral-combat-ship-completes-acceptance-trials-in-lake-michigan)** > > MARINETTE, Wis. (CBS 58) --- Littoral Combat Ship, 23, the future USS Cooptertown, completed acceptance trails in Lake Michigan Monday, Dec. 14.Lockheed Martin Corporation officials say it is the 12th ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/6 "2022-04-19T20:35:21Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > The US Navy does operate on the Great Lakes to some degree and in the past to a major degree. Our largest training base is actually called [Great Lakes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Naval_Station_Great_Lakes). The US Navy ended non-training operations about 100 years ago when the Navy turned it over the Coast Guard. And Chicago’s Navy Pier was used for [MOS](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_military_occupation_code) training in WWII. > **[Chicago history, Chicago Flashback: Navy Pier](https://web.archive.org/web/20130615114632/http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2012-01-08/site/ct-per-flash-navypier-0108-20120109-24_1_navy-pier-municipal-pier-naval-base)** > > As Chicago waits for the latest renovation plans for Navy Pier, it is safe to say that whatever is unveiled, it won't be any wackier than what the pier already has seen in its 95 years. Navy Pier... ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/7 "2022-04-19T20:36:31Z")
Dammit ninja’d by What\_Exit re: Liemba ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/8 "2022-04-19T20:38:47Z")
The Swiss army has a “lakes flotilla”. The Hungarian army has a “river fleet”. [Paraguayan Navy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paraguayan_Navy) [Bolivian Navy](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bolivian_Navy) ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/9 "2022-04-19T21:09:42Z")
The USN closed the [Corn belt fleet](http://www.connectingthewindycity.com/2020/05/may-8-1970-corn-belt-fleet-ends-as-last.html?m=1) almost 52 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![motu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/motu/32/259_2.png) [@motu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/motu)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/10 "2022-04-19T21:32:23Z")
There is a lake in Idaho that the U.S. Navy has been using for their Acoustic Research Detachment for decades. [Lake Pend Oreille](https://jalopnik.com/the-navys-most-vital-and-secretive-submarine-base-is-in-1590794426) ---
**Author:** ![Hatchie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hatchie/32/3983_2.png) [@Hatchie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hatchie)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/11 "2022-04-19T22:34:28Z")
I like that - a submarine base in Idaho, for “testing purposes”. _The Navy’s Acoustic Research Detachment (ARD) at Bayview, Idaho, which is some 375 miles from the ocean, is where new submarine and surface ship shapes and subsystems are tested in a sub-scale environment that closely mimics the ocean._ What about submarine sandwiches? Does the Navy test those too? The Bolivian Navy: Because look out Chile, we just might take back our coastline that you took from us in 1887. (We kid, but they do look pretty badass.) [https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/b97227d209061bbd66f712c5ecb066f2](https://content.api.news/v3/images/bin/b97227d209061bbd66f712c5ecb066f2) ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/12 "2022-04-19T22:44:54Z")
> [@Hatchie](#): > > I like that - a submarine base in Idaho, for “testing purposes”. How about the [USS Desert Ship (LLS-1)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Desert_Ship_(LLS-1)) ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/13 "2022-04-19T22:45:41Z")
“I have not yet begun to fight” is a catchy enough slogan, I suppose, but not at all as badass as Bolivia’s [“Surrender? Your Grandmother Should Surrender, You Bastard!”](https://bolivianthoughts.com/2012/06/16/grandma-the-war-a-bolivian-hero-and-a-chilean-invasion/amp/) ---
**Author:** ![Hatchie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hatchie/32/3983_2.png) [@Hatchie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hatchie)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/14 "2022-04-19T22:47:21Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > It wasn’t the Caspian Sea, it was the Black Sea, which is connected to the Mediterranean (and thus the Atlantic Ocean). You are right, but despite its connection to the Atlantic I still say it’s a lake - but it’s huge, and Russia being Russia I certainly understand why they want to maintain an intimidating presence there. We in the US never had to worry much about the friendly folks to our north, even if Tim Hortons is reportedly looking to invade (don’t try it, Tim! We have Popeyes!) ---
**Author:** ![Kropotkin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kropotkin/32/18045_2.png) [@Kropotkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kropotkin)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/15 "2022-04-19T22:59:20Z")
The American empire often relies on economic force, and so has rendered the threat from Canada harmless by having Burger King purchase Tim’s. ---
**Author:** ![Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freddy_the_Pig)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/16 "2022-04-19T23:00:23Z")
The first shots of World War I were fired from an inland waterway, by Austro-Hungarian gunboats lobbing shells into Belgrade from the Sava River. ---
**Author:** ![Hatchie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hatchie/32/3983_2.png) [@Hatchie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hatchie)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/17 "2022-04-19T23:02:33Z")
Does the Navy know this? It seems like a sneaky way to reinstall the Monarchy. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/18 "2022-04-19T23:11:27Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > “I have not yet begun to fight” is a catchy enough slogan, I suppose, but not at all as badass as Bolivia’s [“Surrender? Your Grandmother Should Surrender, You Bastard!”](https://bolivianthoughts.com/2012/06/16/grandma-the-war-a-bolivian-hero-and-a-chilean-invasion/amp/) How about “Don’t Give Up the Ship”? A slogan that was proudly borne by… American warships in the Great Lakes. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2022, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/19 "2022-04-19T23:56:27Z")
> [@Hatchie](#): > > We in the US never had to worry much about the friendly folks to our north, even if Tim Hortons is reportedly looking to invade (don’t try it, Tim! We have Popeyes!) I hate to break this to you, but there already are Tim Horton’s in the US. > [@Chronos](#): > > How about “Don’t Give Up the Ship”? A slogan that was proudly borne by… American warships in the Great Lakes. But it was originally said to people who, shortly thereafter, surrendered the ship. ---
**Author:** ![brossa](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/brossa/32/3040_2.png) [@brossa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brossa)\ **Post date:** [April 20, 2022, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079/20 "2022-04-20T00:46:55Z")
The Rush-Bagot Treaty of 1817 reduced the number of US and British naval vessels on the Great Lakes and Lake Champlain to one or two vessels per country per lake following the conclusion of the War of 1812. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-navies-patrol-lakes/963079.md?page=2)