Do NOT buy a Kia, you probably already know this

[Shirley_Ujest]

I loved my little Ford Festiva, made by Kia.

If I could have cloned that car so I had a new one every six or seven years, I would it until the end of my days.

Yeah, I loved it that much.

[Epimetheus]

@Mr2001

Hyundai actually owns Kia now.

Epimetheus, is the van you mentioned the Kia Optima? The Optima is “the first progeny of 1998’s Hyundai-Kia merger and shares its underpinnings with the Hyundai Sonata”, so that might be why it isn’t as shoddy as the other Kias.

Nah- Kia Sedona.

[CanvasShoes]

So the car has 48K on it now. Just when does your mom own the fucking car?

Did you not read where I explained all that to boyo jim??

Jesus Christ on a crutch, man. The lemon law was written for people who got a lemon from the factory. After 48K it is pretty safe to say that this is not a factory defect. You can argue that you are dealing with mechanics that don’t know their ass from 3rd base, and I would agree, but arguing that this sucker is a lemon is a weak rant at best.

First off, as I stated in my OP, I’m girl, NOT a man. Secondly, the car, at the time we discovered the problem was only 18 months old, the problem WAS a factory defect, the mechanics and repair department manager admitted it. AS I explained above several times, it’s the run channels in the door, NOT something that would be caused from having miles put on the car. Unless I’m mistaken, the car doesn’t use it’s windows for driving. The questions you are asking in your post have all been asked and answered above.

As far as the move to Texas goes, I went off the info in the OP 'K? :wally

Mmm hmm, and again, NOTE ABOVE where I DO admit not explaining it well enough in the OP.

Oh and your it would not cost them anything to take the car back is pure BS.First off if they take the car back, the tittle will be branded (most states not sure about TX) a car with a branded tittle is worth much less than a similar car with a clear tittle.

Why would it be “branded”? According to the dealerships THEMSELVES, no information on a car’s repairs is made public unless it’s repair work done due to an accident.

::: Checks blue book for a KIA with a branded tittle and high miles:::
Here it is, your mom’s car is worth $1.75.Even without a branded tittle, you can’t do simple math and complain that KIA is screwing your mom. ::: Pulls some numbers from my ass for illustration purposes:::Let’s say your mom’s car is worth $6,000. She owes $7,000 As you said in your post she is upside down. Now let me see if I get this right

So let’s do the math shall we?
Your mom returns KIA forgives loan (Note: it would have to be KIA since the repairing dealer was not the selling dealer) KIa is out (7,000)
Dealer does smog, safety, and minal recon (1,000)
Dealer sells car to someone 6,000
Comission to salesman ( 300) (guess)
Total (2,300)
If the dealer wholesaled the car the numbers would only get worse.
Since a dime != $2,300 dollars I guess you are right
If your mom is upside down the KIA would be upside down. What part of this isn’t clear? :wally

So glad I could be here for you to take out YOUR life frustrations on. It’s one thing to impart information, quite another to have a field day being snotty and uncivil.

[quoteTo answer your question Ethically yes, they are honoring the warranty aren’t they?Morally? Yes same answerGood faith? They have offered to replace the entire door. In all my years in the business I have never seen a car company replace a door. Parts in a door sure, but the entire door? Never. Sounds to me like they are trying to work with you.[/quote]

I don’t recall asking a question. I made a statement, and I still stand by my opinion of the car industry, especially Kia, and will tell everyone I know, NOT to buy one.

Oh yeah and one more thing if your dear sweet retired mom drives 33,000 miles a year, a trip to the dealership is a drop in the bucket. For your general fund of info, retired people generally as a group put a lot less miles on their car than the avergage person. From personal experience retire people usually put less than 7,500 miles, so 33K a year is way over the top for an retired person.

OH My mistake, I didn’t know you were with the Department of How Far a Year Retired Persons are allowed to drive.

If I were in your shoes, I would take KIA up on their offer to replace the door.

You don’t have very good reading skills do you? In at least two posts above, I explain that we’ve already DONE just that.

When the car is ready I would go to the dealership and run the window up and down about 25 times in a row with the service manager in attendence.

We did that, after the mechanics said THEY’D done it 40 times in a row. And it didn’t do it at the dealership, it didn’t fail until a few days later.

If the window fails, don’t take the car. If the window passes, you are good to go.Oh yeah one more thing, here have a nice steaming cup of STFU

Again, the window never fails when we test it, only once we get back out of town. Not that you care, you just want to rant at someone who had the audacity to come to the pit, and well Pit. Wow, shame on me, what a silly little girl I am!

Oh, I’m sorry that you didn’t go to college and get real job. Became a car salesman instead. Worse yet, a KIA salesman. Not that you sound bitter or anything.

[CanvasShoes]

@htns

Do what I did and get a Honda Accord. Mine is five years old, over 100,000 miles on the odometer and still runs like a charm with no problems since I first got it home eight months ago.

Actually, I once had an ancient beat to crap honda. It was hilarious looking. Fenders so rusted they flew out like wings when I drove (this was about 20 years ago or so), Great old car.

It was still running when I gave it away. It needed a main seal, someone had plowed up a huge snow berm behind it, and we, being silly inexperienced girls, yanked it out of the berm backward.

At any rate, since then I’ve owned nothing but old, BIG, American luxury cars. I love them. A person can fix almost anything themselves, and there is plenty of room in the engine compartment to fit your hands down into.

My favorite are Buicks…solid like tanks.

[Daisy_Mae]

@CanvasShoes

Oh, I’m sorry that you didn’t go to college and get real job. Became a car salesman instead. Worse yet, a KIA salesman. Not that you sound bitter or anything.

Canvas Shoes, how fucking arrogant and uppity can one person be? Do you have any idea how nasty and just plain shallow you appear right now? You’re looking down your nose at someone because of a presumed lack of college degree and their job title? It isn’t a “real job” as designated by Queen Canvas? Get off your high horse. Any job someone does right is a job worth doing, Your Highness. How would you like it if he ASSumed that your mother was uneducated and ignorant for not doing her homework or consulting with family before purchasing her vehicle? Wouldn’t be nice would it? That would make him as shallow as you’re behaving.

I worked as a receptionist at a car dealership while I was in college and I believe most people would be laughed out of the dealership if they wanted to turn in their car “even steven” and walk away after such a length of time/high amount of miles. Expecting Kia (or any other car company) to accept that they should do that is reallllllly reaching. You can find a lemon in any make and/or model. As someone said earlier, every car company has at least one website cursing its name about things just like this.

You’ve mentioned other people’s tone in this thread a couple times. Perhaps you should take a look at how YOU address others. You were nasty to me in a thread before and you’re being nasty to people here. In the OP you painted your mother as a poor, sweet, little tiny, retired mom. When one hears about a car owned by a woman such that you described, one generally thinks of a vehicle rarely used. You forgot to mention in the OP about the VERY high number of miles placed on the car in a short time. Only later, when questioned did this tidbit come up yet you got riled up at someone referring to your mother as Grandma. That’s the WAY you described her and yet when someone questioned why Grandma was driving as much as a traveling salesman, you all of a sudden don’t like the description. It almost made the OP’s description seem like a sympathy request.

Everybody else is to blame, the company is unethical for not letting your mother off the hook with the rest of the loan, the mechanic is too stupid to know what the problem was, other posters are uneducated and bitter for pointing out reasons why this isn’t entirely Kia’s fault. Seems like you’re angry with everyone except your mother. Simple fact is that she didn’t do her homework or check with people in the know before buying the car, and in one year’s time she drove the car damn near as many miles as someone else does in 3 years. Is she allowed to do that? You bet your ass she is but it does shorten the TIME that her car is under warranty and THAT is time she ran out of in getting it fixed.

I hate to hear of anyone having car troubles as much as we all depend on cars, but I can’t say that Kia has behaved any differently than any other car company would in this situation.

[Boyo_Jim]

Shall we talk a little more about “fishy”?

Select one for your next post, 'cause they ain’t all true:

So now, she has to have a new door, on an 18 month old car, on which the paint has been aging. But, they’re not going to paint the WHOLE car. Oh no. They’re going to “blend” the paint on the front fender and back door, so that the new paint from replacing the door sort of matches the older paint.

You are just trying your best to make more of it than there is. And I DID say what they were doing, they’ve currently got it in the shop replacing the door. I said that three or so posts ago.

When Rick says:

If I were in your shoes, I would take KIA up on their offer to replace the door.

You respond:

You don’t have very good reading skills do you? In at least two posts above, I explain that we’ve already DONE just that.

Select one for your next post:

She has had the car 18 months, it has 48,000 miles on it.

So now, she has to have a new door, on an 18 month old car…

And as I said, the window worked in intervals, just for a little bit, and the car just NOW reached 48k, thanks in part to driving to dallas several times to get it fixed.

actually when we first started dealing with the problems it was 18 months, that was 5 months ago, and fewer miles, so it IS actually more now, thanks to all the trips to Dallas. My mistake, it actually wasn’t at 18 months.

When Risk asks:

So the car has 48K on it now. Just when does your mom own the fucking car?

You say:

Did you not read where I explained all that to boyo jim??

You didn’t answer this for me, or anyone else since. If you did, show me where.

You said:

…of which she’s already paid a HUGE amount of interest, like 5000 and only 500 to principle, they could definitely sell it for what she owes…

Well, that’s bullshit if she’s been paying on the car for two years.

By the way, here is the Texas Lemon Law. Your Mom was WAY out of range of it’s protection… the problem needed to be reported and repairs attempted in the first 12 months or 12K miles. With all this whining, you’d think that YOU would have some clue as to what law they were failing to keep in spirit, or “morally” or whatever the fuck you want to call it.

So do we have a clearer picture of “fishy”?

[jjimm]

You guys are lucky to have a lemon law of any description. Over here it’s caveat emptor all the way apart from a 12-month warranty that only guarantees to repair defects when they occur (and sometimes grudgingly - when I went to complain to Ford that my brand-new Focus’s alternator was failing, I was told to come back next week. It died a half a mile from the garage and I had to scream at them to come and get me, and scream at them again to get a replacement car while mine was being repaired, neither of which services were they obliged to fulfil).

Anyway, this is just a driveby (DYSWIDT?) to say that the worst car I’ve ever, ever, ever, ever driven - and bear in mind I’ve driven a lot of 1970s British cars, so there’s some seriously tough competition - was the new Kia Pride I was unlucky enough to rent a few years ago.

Total. Piece. Of. Shit. It had no saving graces whatsoever. Tinny build, bad steering, bad brakes, seriously underpowered engine, looked awful, shoddy interior, fucked up window mechanism, and the slightest gust of wind blew it all over the road. Simply awful to drive. An all-round piece of shit on wheels.

[Bambi_Hassenpfeffer]

@jjimm

Anyway, this is just a driveby (DYSWIDT?) to say that the worst car I’ve ever, ever, ever, ever driven - and bear in mind I’ve driven a lot of 1970s British cars, so there’s some seriously tough competition - was the new Kia Pride I was unlucky enough to rent a few years ago.

Total. Piece. Of. Shit. It had no saving graces whatsoever. Tinny build, bad steering, bad brakes, seriously underpowered engine, looked awful, shoddy interior, fucked up window mechanism, and the slightest gust of wind blew it all over the road. Simply awful to drive. An all-round piece of shit on wheels.

psst, Shirley – jjimm’s badmouthing your Festiva! That car was sold as a Mazda 121 for some time in Europe, and as the Ford Festiva in the US.

[Scopata_Fuori]

@wmulax93

Eh, it’s no worse than the recalls on my old Ranger. I’m not even sure it’s the transmission or just some loose plastic rattling.

We had an '89 Ranger extended cab, and I can still remember the very distinctive rattling when my husband pulled into (or out of) the driveway. Part of it was the exhaust system was loose. But eventually the 5-speed tranny crapped out, and $1600 later the thing shifted just fine, and the rattle was gone.

Couldn’t get a rebuild for it; it was not a Ford transmission…it was actually a Mazda transmission they used (I think). Anyway, it was one of the Japanese makes that manufactured the transmission.

Not a bad truck, average all around. Wish I still had it, for hauling stuff. The Durango we replaced it with, just cost me $50 even to fill the gas tank…and the “FEED ME” light/bing on the dash is annoyingly frequent.

The $6,800 tranny for my Dodge Stealth, was another matter. Now the output spline is stripped, where it goes into the transfer case…which was recalled. Parts have to be machined especially for it, and I have been without my favorite car for going on six months now. But it should be under $2000 to fix this time. :rolleyes:

I took my daughter car shopping, we looked at (used) KIA’s…her comment was, “I don’t think I want to drive a car whose initials are Killed In Action, or Killed In Automobile”…we ended up buying her a nice 4 door Olds Ciera.

After reading this, I’m glad we passed on the KIA’s.

[Rick]

What. a. fucking. bitch.

@CanvasShoes

Why would it be “branded”? According to the dealerships THEMSELVES, no information on a car’s repairs is made public unless it’s repair work done due to an accident.

In many if not most states if a car is repurchased by a car company the title must be “branded” as a lemon law repurchase. If you were looking for a used car, a car with a branded title is probably not what would float your boat, therefore a car with a branded title is worth a LOT less. I notice that you did not try to argue with my numbers. Sorry I burned your strawman down.

So glad I could be here for you to take out YOUR life frustrations on. It’s one thing to impart information, quite another to have a field day being snotty and uncivil.

I’m being uncivil? I think Daisy Mae covered your attitude in her post excellently. When you make silly unsupported arguments, you will get called on them. All I did was point out where your claims were full of holes. My last post was not uncivil, if you want to see uncivil, I will be happy to show you, you arrogant snively bitch.

OH My mistake, I didn’t know you were with the Department of How Far a Year Retired Persons are allowed to drive.

I don’t believe I ever said I was in charge of how much people can drive in a year, I was trying to point out why most retired people don’t drive many miles, since they don’t drive to work every day. Drive as much as you want, but when the clock hits 48K the warranty is up.

Wow, shame on me, what a silly little girl I am!

Why, yes you are, it is about time you noticed.

Oh, I’m sorry that you didn’t go to college and get real job. Became a car salesman instead. Worse yet, a KIA salesman. Not that you sound bitter or anything.

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEHHHHHHHHHHHH!
Wrong and thank you for playing.
I did go to college. For no particular reason, let me tell you what I do for a living. I am a technical expert for a car company (Not KIA) I don’t sell cars, never have, probably never will. Selling cars is an honorable way to make a living, maybe you should try it and see that is not as easy you think it is. I’m not bitter, far from it. I live a great life, I get to travel meet new people and my company pays for it all. I have a great job. The only fly in the ointment is that I have to deal with people from time to time that think A) the world revolves around them, and B) the rules don’t apply to them.

We have lots of freedoms in this country, besides life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. While not listed in the constitution we also have the following rights
[ul]
[li]The right to fuck up your credit[/li][li]The right to make dumb buying decisions[/li][li]The right to enter into a legally binding contract without consulting someone knowledgeable first[/li][li]The right to whine about perceived injustices on a message board, regardless of the facts in the case.[/li][/ul]
If I have read your incoherent posts correctly it seems that between your mother and yourself, you have hit all of these freedoms. :wally

Oh one more thing, when you take the car in for the door to be replaced, ask the technician to replace the whiner valve, yours is stuck.

[CanvasShoes]

What. a. fucking. bitch.

For replying to your snotty post in kind?

Quote:
So glad I could be here for you to take out YOUR life frustrations on. It’s one thing to impart information, quite another to have a field day being snotty and uncivil.

I’m being uncivil? I think Daisy Mae covered your attitude in her post excellently. When you make silly unsupported arguments, you will get called on them. All I did was point out where your claims were full of holes. My last post was not uncivil, if you want to see uncivil, I will be happy to show you, you arrogant snively bitch.

I didn’t say anything against boyo at all, in fact I provided him with the info he asked for, and apologized for not filling it in correctly in the first place. I didn’t say anything untoward against anyone in this thread until YOU came in all snotty and insulting in tone.

Quote:
OH My mistake, I didn’t know you were with the Department of How Far a Year Retired Persons are allowed to drive.

I don’t believe I ever said I was in charge of how much people can drive in a year, I was trying to point out why most retired people don’t drive many miles, since they don’t drive to work every day. Drive as much as you want, but when the clock hits 48K the warranty is up.

No, just a very snotty attitude about how much retired citizens “normally” drive.

We have lots of freedoms in this country, besides life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. While not listed in the constitution we also have the following rights
The right to fuck up your credit
The right to make dumb buying decisions
The right to enter into a legally binding contract without consulting someone knowledgeable first
The right to whine about perceived injustices on a message board, regardless of the facts in the case.
If I have read your incoherent posts correctly it seems that between your mother and yourself, you have hit all of these freedoms.

And the freedom to tell one’s own side of the story to as many potential buyers of the product in question as possible. Your opinion about whether this is right or wrong is just that. An opinion, and my lack of knowledge of every lemon or car dealership policy in the country and your VAST knowledge of car dealerships, don’t change the fact that BOTH of our viewpoints on its ethical, moral right, are just that, opinions.

Oh one more thing, when you take the car in for the door to be replaced, ask the technician to replace the whiner valve, yours is stuck.

Not surprising, more snottiness. If you had come in and stated flat out facts,and facts alone, about the parts of this i ADMITTED I knew little about, that would have been one thing, as always, you j;ust couldn’t stand it, you had to act all superior and snotty about things.

[Boyo_Jim]

@Rick

…Oh one more thing, when you take the car in for the door to be replaced, ask the technician to replace the whiner valve, yours is stuck.

I think it’s already done, or not done yet, or being done now. Whatever. See my last post.

Thanks for your indirect support, by the way. I had hoped I wouldn’t be the only one questioning this story, and I’m glad I wasn’t, but apparently it just makes not difference. I suppose this was all about skewing things to make her mother appear more of a victim.

[Boyo_Jim]

@CanvasShoes

…I didn’t say anything against boyo at all, in fact I provided him with the info he asked for, and apologized for not filling it in correctly in the first place. I didn’t say anything untoward against anyone in this thread until YOU came in all snotty and insulting in tone.
…

Actually, you did. This was addressed to me:

Jeez, you’re certainly snotty for not apparant reason

This was addressed to me:

It’s beginning to sound as if you are a car salesman, or dealership franchisee

Not being in the car industry like Rick, and knowing your impressions of car dealers/makers, I certainly took it as a hostile comment.

And all before Rick got critical.

You seem to have no memory of your previous posts. Things keep changing. And despite repeated requests you wouldn’t answer questions like, “Is it fixed yet?”

Hence the word “fishy”.

[CanvasShoes]

Quote:
Originally Posted by CanvasShoes

…I didn’t say anything against boyo at all, in fact I provided him with the info he asked for, and apologized for not filling it in correctly in the first place. I didn’t say anything untoward against anyone in this thread until YOU came in all snotty and insulting in tone.
…

[quote]
Actually, you did. This was addressed to me:
Quote:
Jeez, you’re certainly snotty for not apparant reason
[/quote
Yes, in response to your snippy “grandma” comment. Which you apologized for, and in which I THEN stated “yes, I didn’t write the OP completely enough”.

This was addressed to me:
Quote:
It’s beginning to sound as if you are a car salesman, or dealership franchisee

Meaning you sound as if you are defending them due to personal reasons. I AM sorry if it sounded otherwise.

You seem to have no memory of your previous posts. Things keep changing. And despite repeated requests you wouldn’t answer questions like, “Is it fixed yet?”

I believe I DID say that she had to have the door replaced. Meaning present tense. And then when it was asked again, in case “has to have it replaced” wasn’t clear. I answered that it WAS being done, currently.

[Rick]

::: shakes head :::

[quote=CanvasShoes]

[quoteTo answer your question Ethically yes, they are honoring the warranty aren’t they?Morally? Yes same answerGood faith? They have offered to replace the entire door. In all my years in the business I have never seen a car company replace a door. Parts in a door sure, but the entire door? Never. Sounds to me like they are trying to work with you.[/quote]
I don’t recall asking a question. I made a statement, and I still stand by my opinion of the car industry, especially Kia, and will tell everyone I know, NOT to buy one.

Here let me help you with the coding

@CanvasShoes

@Rick

To answer your question Ethically yes, they are honoring the warranty aren’t they? Morally? Yes same answer Good faith? They have offered to replace the entire door. In all my years in the business I have never seen a car company replace a door. Parts in a door sure, but the entire door? Never. Sounds to me like they are trying to work with you.

I don’t recall asking a question. I made a statement, and I still stand by my opinion of the car industry, especially Kia, and will tell everyone I know, NOT to buy one.

OK lets go back and review the tape shall we?

Legally they’ve got an out. Ethically and morally**?** They’re dishonest and pushing the car industry to a whole new low.

(bolding mine)
CanvasShoes let me introduce you to a thing called a question mark. Despite it rather misleading name, it is the symbol used at the end of a sentence when one is asking a question. It looks like this ? You can find it on most keyboards just above the / and next to the . You will note that you used one of these symbols signifying a question in your post. I answered your question. You did not like my answer (probably because it contained facts) and whined that you had not asked a question. If fact you had asked a question, just one you did not want answered. We already knew that you weren’t a math major in college, due to you inability to add and subtract. I’m now guessing that you were not an English major either.

A few other gems

She does plan on filing a complaint with the BBB, and, as some of the other disgruntled Kia owners have said, sending a letter to the shows that do exposes.

Boy oh boy, stop the presses here is a story. Car company honors warranty! Somebody get Mike Wallace on the phone! I can’t wait for this one.
Or perhaps

They lucked out to get off with a technicality

and

The lemon law is that if you have the same exact problem 3 or more times in a row, that the dealer has to buy it back.

Not to mention this:

This from the official posting from the state of TX lemon law statutes. K?

First off saying that the dealer got off on a technicality is about on par with calling World War Two a minor misunderstanding between good friends.
Thanks to Boyo Jim we have the straight dope on Texas Lemon law.
Lets see, if I am reading the link correctly, the following must occur for a car to be considered a lemon in the great state of Texas:
[ol]
[li]Car must have undergone 4 or more repair attempts [/li][li]Problem must have surfaced within the first twelve months of ownership[/li][li]Problem must have surfaced within the first 12,000 miles of ownership[/li][li]The 2nd and 3rd attempts must have occurred within 24 months of retail delivery[/li][li]The second and third attempts must have occurred with in the first 24,000 miles.[/li][/ol]
Let’s see how you scored

1. You should get a point here for the six repair attempts, but I am going to have to back out 1/2 point due to your misquoting of the Texas lemon law. So you get 1/2 point
2. zero points
3. zero points
4. zero points
5. You guessed it, zero points.
   So out of a possible 5 points you scored a measly 0.5 points. This is NOT a technicality. You missed the lemon law by a country mile. Does the term not even fucking close mean anything to you?

And then there is

Your opinion about whether this is right or wrong is just that. An opinion, and my lack of knowledge of every lemon or car dealership policy in the country and your VAST knowledge of car dealerships, don’t change the fact that BOTH of our viewpoints on its ethical, moral right, are just that, opinions.

Just a friendly suggestion, on a message board dedicated to fighting ignorance, I would suggest that you stick to opinions, since you don’t seem to do so well when facts are offered up. I would also suggest that you stay out of GQ. Them boys will eat you up, if you offer up these half baked ideas as “facts”

I don’t know about anyone else here, but I am beginning to have my doubts about the validly of the “she never used the window until I moved down” line.

See Canvas Shoes, the problem I have with you is that every time somebody tries to bend the laws to fit them on a lemon law case it makes it that much harder for someone with a legit claim. As I pointed out above your case is not even close to being a lemon under Texas law, yet you keep screaming lemon at the top of your lungs.

[doomraisin]

@Bambi Hassenpfeffer

psst, Shirley – jjimm’s badmouthing your Festiva! That car was sold as a Mazda 121 for some time in Europe, and as the Ford Festiva in the US.

Okay, I can’t stand by and not challenge an attack on a Festiva.

Yeah, if a person rented one, they might be taken aback by the apparent cheapness of the thing, but hey, it was a cheap car. You want a real evaluation of it, ask someone who drove one for awhile. Like me - I drove one for 8 years. Gave me a healthy respect for Kia. This was the most reliable car I have ever owned. Sure, it was no luxury car, but it didn’t drive badly at all. Had nice peppy acceleration, awesome gas mileage, tiny tires (12"!), a hatchback… Oh, and Consumer Reports will testify that the Festiva was a good value as a used car.

So slam Kias all you want, but make exceptions for the Festiva, or the Pride, because they didn’t suck.

[little_bit]

Great. Now I feel a great compulsion to buy a Kia.
Maybe a sporty Sorento. It does well on edmunds.com