# Do people really have to accept cash "for all debts public and private"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 28, 2009, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254 "2009-06-28T15:39:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/41 "2009-06-29T23:38:39Z")
> [@sailor](#): > > No. It is up to you to prove there is a federal law which forces businesses to accept dollars. There is no such law and I cannot prove a negative. > > Repeat: there is no such law. > > I hereby offer for sale a coffee mug with the inscription “I Love Jeff” for the price of 10 Euros, shipping included to anywhere in the contiguous states. I will only accept 10 Euros and nothing else. Please tell me what federal law I am breaking (and find a lawyer who agrees with you because, frankly, your opinion is worth nothing). > > I hereby also predict you will just disappear from the thread without admittiong your error, as you usually do. No, it’s perfectly legal for you to make said offer. As an individual, no one will do anything. But if you were a USA business, and advertised that the price was good only if paid in Euros, then there’d be an issue. You are making the extreme statement that foreign currency is legal tender in the uSA. You have to back it up. Got anything? ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/42 "2009-06-29T23:43:03Z")
Why is it ok for **sailor** to make such an offer and not ok for a business to make said offer? You’re the one who is claiming certain activity is illegal. You should be able to point to the law proscribing it. I don’t think anyone is claiming that foreign currency is official “legal tender” in the U.S. in the same way as U.S. dollars are. We just think you’re misinterpreting what official “legal tender” status implies. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/43 "2009-06-29T23:45:00Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > Why on earth would the IRS even administer this alleged law? They certainly don’t enforce other parts of commercial law. Why not the Comptroller of the Currency? Or the Federal Trade Commission? > > Of course, it’s because there is no such law. But if there were, the IRS wouldn’t be the agency charged with enforcement. I’m afraid I have to join some of the others on this thread doubting the veracity of this story. The IRS is charged with enforcing Title 31 and the Patriot act for certain types of businesses, such as MSBs (Money Service Businesses), for FinCEN. My Bro was in charge of auditing and enforcing the rules for such NBFI’s (non-banking financial institutions). Some of these are currency exchangers and dealers in Pesos, thus it does come up. THis shows that the IRS is indeed charged with enforcing Title 31. [http://www.irs.gov/govt/tribes/article/0,,id=139997,00.html](http://www.irs.gov/govt/tribes/article/0,,id=139997,00.html) [http://www.irstaxattorney.com/irs-audits/26/4262\_Program\_Structure.html](http://www.irstaxattorney.com/irs-audits/26/4262_Program_Structure.html) “The Department of the Treasury has primary responsibility for implementing and enforcing the Bank Secrecy Act (BSA). The authority of the Secretary of the Treasury to administer the BSA has been delegated to the Director, Financial Crimes Enforcement Network (FinCEN). Treasury has delegated responsibility for assuring civil compliance with the law to various Federal agencies, **including the Internal Revenue Service.** (Refer to Treasury Directive 15-41, dated December 1, 1992.)” Bolding mine. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/44 "2009-06-29T23:46:36Z")
Here, from the [Department of Treasury FAQ](http://www.treas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml): > [@DoT FAQ](#): > > The pertinent portion of law that applies to your question is the Coinage Act of 1965, specifically Section 31 U.S.C. 5103, entitled “Legal tender,” which states: "United States coins and currency (including Federal reserve notes and circulating notes of Federal reserve banks and national banks) are legal tender for all debts, public charges, taxes, and dues. > > This statute means that all United States money as identified above are a valid and legal offer of payment for debts when tendered to a creditor. **There is, however, no Federal statute mandating that a private business, a person or an organization must accept currency or coins as for payment for goods and/or services.** Bolding mine. I suppose you’ll say “There is, however, a statute mandating that if one accepts any currency, then one has to accept U.S. dollars”. Well, put up or shut up; find and cite us that statute. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/45 "2009-06-29T23:48:49Z")
> [@Indistinguishable](#): > > Why is it ok for **sailor** to make such an offer and not ok for a business to make said offer?. It’s not legal either way, it’s just not enforced in his case. It’s generally only enforced in the sort of businesses that the Treasury has regulatory control over- banks, NBFIs, Casinos, MSBs’, Credit Unions, and the like. It’s buried deep in the audit guides for those types of businesses. As has been said, the definitions of “legal tender” is rather sparse in the USA. I suppose that it could be only illegal for those types of businesses, those regulated by the Treasury. In any case, any enforcement authority is limited to those sorts of regulated businesses. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/46 "2009-06-29T23:51:29Z")
> [@Indistinguishable](#): > > Here, from the [Department of Treasury FAQ](http://www.treas.gov/education/faq/currency/legal-tender.shtml): > > Bolding mine. > > I suppose you’ll say “There is, however, a statute mandating that if one accepts any currency, then one has to accept U.S. dollars”. Well, put up or shut up; find and cite us that statute. Find us the statutes that sez that Foreign currency is legal tender. Like I said before “That’s exactly what Legal Tender refers to- dollars. Not cash, as the gov’t site points out, a business can reject cash in some cases. They can not reject dollars, however- they can simply request the form of said dollars.” I already stated that the Treasury does not force businesses to accept cash, in certain forms. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/47 "2009-06-29T23:53:27Z")
I can no more find you a statute explicitly saying that it is legal to make **sailor** ’s offer than I can find you one explicitly saying that it is legal to wear white after Labor Day. People generally don’t write down great big lists of all the things which are legal to do; they just write down the things which are made illegal. Since you’re the one arguing that something is illegal, you’re the one who should be able to point to specific codification of this. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 29, 2009, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/48 "2009-06-29T23:56:27Z")
Also if you search for casinos chips not legal tender, you’ll find plenty of cites that say that casino chips used to be accepted nearly anywhere in Vegas,etc as cash, but the gov’t cracked down, and now they are only supposed to be used in that casino. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/49 "2009-06-30T00:00:41Z")
Alright then; link us to such a cite that you think demonstrates your point. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/50 "2009-06-30T00:01:56Z")
_You_ find me a cite that sez foreign currency is legal tender in the USA. It’s not. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/51 "2009-06-30T00:03:25Z")
You just told us that if we carry out a certain search, we’ll find plenty of cites to support your point. I carried out the search, and saw nothing that seemed to me to support your point. Why don’t you show me where I went wrong? And I am not claiming that Euros are official legal tender in the U.S. in the same way as U.S. dollars are. I am claiming that what you understand the term “legal tender” to imply is incorrect; that it is perfectly _legal_ to make an offer in exchange for something other than items with official “legal tender” status and to refuse to make the same offer in exchange for items which do have official “legal tender” status. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/52 "2009-06-30T00:18:44Z")
(And that it remains just as legal when the “something other than items with official ‘legal tender’ status” is foreign currency as it does for heads of cabbage) ---
**Author:** ![Rumor\_Watkins](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/d9b06d/32.png) [@Rumor\_Watkins](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rumor_Watkins)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/53 "2009-06-30T00:25:25Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > But if you were a USA business, and advertised that the price was good only if paid in Euros, then there’d be an issue. You’ve never bought foreign equities from Lehman Brothers, have you? ---
**Author:** ![Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimmy_Gibbler)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/54 "2009-06-30T00:32:36Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > You’ve never bought foreign equities from Lehman Brothers, have you? Wait till he learns about [Eurodollars](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurodollar) (do they do those anymore? they were really big in the 80s, but you never hear about them anymore). It will blow his mind!! ---
**Author:** ![sailor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a587f6/32.png) [@sailor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sailor)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/55 "2009-06-30T02:08:10Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > No, it’s perfectly legal for you to make said offer. As an individual, no one will do anything. But if you were a USA business, and advertised that the price was good only if paid in Euros, then there’d be an issue. Please show me the law that says there is an issue and find a lawyer who agrees there is an issue. > [@](#): > > You are making the extreme statement that foreign currency is legal tender in the USA. You have to back it up. Got anything? No. I am not asserting that foreign currency is “legal tender”. I am asserting that you do not understand what is the legal meaning of “legal tender” and that nowhere in the law does it say that a business is required to accept dollars. Nowhere. And since what isn’t explicitly prohibited is allowed then it is clear that any business or individual can demand whatever they want in payment, be it in goods or in any kind of currency. And everybody here understands that except you. You are the lone one making an extraordinary claim without any form of proof. So, what law exactly would be broken and what are the penalties? I want chapter and verse. ---
**Author:** ![IAmNotSpartacus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/56 "2009-06-30T03:29:57Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > Hearsay and conjecture are _kinds_ of evidence. This is GQ, not GD. ---
**Author:** ![put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/da6949/32.png) [@put\_down\_the\_sabre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/put_down_the_sabre)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/57 "2009-06-30T04:01:14Z")
> [@IAmNotSpartacus](#): > > This is GQ, not GD. [ol] [li]You are missing a classic cultural reference.[/li][li]DrDeth is an idiot.[/li][/ol] pdts ---
**Author:** ![IAmNotSpartacus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@IAmNotSpartacus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IAmNotSpartacus)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/58 "2009-06-30T04:39:14Z")
Oh ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/59 "2009-06-30T07:38:56Z")
> [@Rumor\_Watkins](#): > > You’ve never bought foreign equities from Lehman Brothers, have you? You can’t buy them with US dollars?:dubious: ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 30, 2009, 7:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254/60 "2009-06-30T07:42:21Z")
> [@Kimmy\_Gibbler](#): > > Wait till he learns about [Eurodollars](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurodollar) (do they do those anymore? they were really big in the 80s, but you never hear about them anymore). It will blow his mind!! Again, EuroDollars do not show that a business can require payment in a foreign currency, they just allow one to invest. In fact, they _are_ dollars. “Eurodollars are deposits denominated \*in US dollars \*at banks outside the United States…” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-people-really-have-to-accept-cash-for-all-debts-public-and-private/501254.md?page=4)