# Do politicians have the ability to give orders to law enforcement, what is the relationship **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 23, 2015, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679 "2015-05-23T23:39:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2015, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/21 "2015-05-24T17:07:14Z")
Oh. And, even if they FBI only finds something vaguely suspicious, from the books I have read on it, Federal indictments are absurdly easy to get. Even if they can’t make the charges stick, it looks real bad to have the papers trumpeting “chief of police and 4 deputies indicted”. The FBI can of course make sure the booking is done in front of media, and they win at trial 95% of time so they can probably get at least one of the indicted people to take a plea… ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2015, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/22 "2015-05-24T19:01:09Z")
> [@Habeed](#): > > I’m not sure it’s quite so clear cut as that. What if the police department has done something shady? (taken bribes, shot an unarmed black man and failed to investigate, sent racist emails to one another, fudged the evidence on an investigation by dry-labbing it…) > > When the FBI shows at the doorstep of that police department and asks for something, sure, they have the right to refuse. And the FBI has a right to seize all their records and go through them looking for the above. I don’t think a major metropolitan police department exists where the FBI couldn’t find something that looks bad. In many cases, it’s more likely to be either the local Sheriff’s office or else the state equivalent of the FBI doing the investigating. ---
**Author:** ![Hail\_Ants](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/dc4da7/32.png) [@Hail\_Ants](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hail_Ants)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/23 "2015-05-25T01:29:31Z")
[Here’s a relevant column of Cecil’s regarding law enforcement chain-of-command…](http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/135/whos-the-boss-city-cops-state-cops-or-the-feds) ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 6:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/24 "2015-05-25T06:54:00Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > More accurately, the president’s authority is over federal executive department employees. He is also the Commander in Chief. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/25 "2015-05-25T06:58:18Z")
> [@Marion\_Wormer](#): > > In the LA riots after the Rodney King beating, this is what happened. Once the soldiers were federalized they could do zip because of the Posse Commitatus Act. Not true in this case: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse\_Comitatus\_ActExclusions](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_ActExclusions) and limitations[edit] \*There are a number of situations in which the Act does not apply. These include: National Guard units and state defense forces while under the authority of the governor of a state; Federal military personnel used in accordance to the Insurrection Act, as was the case during the 1992 Los Angeles Riots.\* ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/26 "2015-05-25T11:19:29Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > Whether he does or not isn’t the issue. The issue is whether the mayor can or will give the order to let him go _directly to the officer who caught him_ , not whether the mayor will give such an order to the police commissioner or chief and not whether someone in the police department will decide to let the husband go without the mayor’s involvement. And she won’t ,even if she can, because of how it will look. Doesn’t mean that the cop won’t be told to let the husband go, but he won’t be hearing directly from the mayor (at least not in most places) Direct order? Probably not because they can’t give a direct order (not legally anyway and the cop can ignore it). It would more likely take the form of, “Do you know who I am? You must not like your job very much! What’s your name? Wait till Chief Jones hears about this!” ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/848f3c/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_Dunlop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_Dunlop)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/27 "2015-05-25T12:44:11Z")
There was recently a bizarre and embarrassing battle in tiny [Macungie, PA](http://www.lehighvalleylive.com/lehigh-county/index.ssf/2013/01/macungie_mayor_wins_bulk_of_la.html) between the mayor and chief of police over the mayor’s power. It was very long and convoluted and I could easily be misremembering a few details but the fight was that mayor Rick Hoffman wanted access to confidential police record like scheduling details and the chief tried to refuse. Evidently: > [@](#): > > A seven-member panel of Commonwealth Court judges concluded Hoffman has the “ultimate executive authority” over how Macungie’s police force operates. My linked article is from January 2013 and there’s a more recent July 2013 article saying that the court refused to hear an appeal and that the mayor had quit and moved to Virginia anyway. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/28 "2015-05-25T14:08:03Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > The federal government can take control of state national guard units, and they can enforce federal laws that states do not recognize (medical marijuana for example) so the lines of demarcation are not always clear. Not seeing where that is any different from what I said. > [@](#): > > Unsure if the ‘are you an American’ comment was sarcastic or not. I’m as american as obesity and reality TV. Not sarcastic. See below. The answer I’d give would be different if I knew you were from another country. > [@filmstar-en](#): > > From a UK perspective, the tension between politicians and the police in US dramas is quite puzzling. > > ‘Hey the DA is on my back, there is an election coming up, we have to solve this case now!’ > > Few UK observers would know what that means because the official title does not exist and the political tension is puzzling. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2015, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/29 "2015-05-25T14:17:16Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Either way, I am unsure what the relationship between politicians and the police is. Does the chief of police answer to and take orders from the mayor? Does that power extend downwards (can the mayor give orders to the chief, but also to a patrolman on the street?) It depends on the state law and constitution and the specific structure of the municipal government in question. In some cities, the mayor has ultimate executive authority. In some cities, the city council/commission has ultimate executive authority. In some cities, ultimate executive authority is given to a city manager, who is appointed by the mayor/council/commission. In some cities, the chief of police is chosen through an administrative process and the mayor or city council/commission have very limited powers to remove or replace the chief (there must be a finding of cause, in other words). In some cases, the power is given to a commissioner or law director or city manager who has authority independent of the mayor or council/commission. The elected officials might have more or less authority to remove that person if he or she fails to fire a police chief that displeases them. It all depends. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/30 "2015-05-26T15:16:51Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > OK, so here you’re making a huge mistake. Are you an American? I’m thinking not. > > In the US, the states are not subordinate to the Feds except as outlined in the constitution. Obama can’t tell governors what to do, and he can’t tell State employees what to do. His authority is over federal employees. If the states aren’t obeying some federal law or some constitutional provision that applies to the states, then the feds can step in and the states can bring the issue up with the federal court system… Right. That’s part of the Federalism inherent to the US. The Feds _can_ come in and tell state governors to stop violating the Constitution by arbitrarily arresting civilians without charges, coining “California Bux” money, or issuing letters of marque and reprisal. They can’t come in and tell a state that they can’t require cha-cha lessons in order to graduate from high school. Education is a state-level prerogative. In reality, if a state wanted to require cha-cha lessons for high school students and the Feds got pissed, what would actually happen would be that the Feds would threaten to stop providing federal funding to state schools (which is not guaranteed by the Constitution and can be withdrawn at the will of Congress). That usually convinces the state to get with the program. However, that’s effectively all they can do - if the state is so into cha-cha that they are willing to give up millions of dollars in Federal funding for it, then they have a right to it. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/31 "2015-05-26T17:25:58Z")
In some jurisdictions, (Larger cities? I think this is the case in Canada too) the police chief is appointed and reports to a board - which usually consists of the mayor, some councillors, some other members (public?). The idea being that you don’t have the simple 1-to-1 reporting, so things are more open, the chief of police is less easily bullied, and it’s harder to have undue influence on the police command structure. Short answer - 50 states, a lot of different options. > **[Chicago Police Board](https://www.chicago.gov/city/en/depts/cpb.html)** > > The Chicago Police Board is an independent civilian body that oversees certain activities of the Chicago Police Department. The Board's powers and responsibilities include deciding disciplinary matters involving police officers and nominating... ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/32 "2015-05-26T17:44:57Z")
> [@robert\_columbia](#): > > In reality, if a state wanted to require cha-cha lessons for high school students and the Feds got pissed, what would actually happen would be that the Feds would threaten to stop providing federal funding to state schools (which is not guaranteed by the Constitution and can be withdrawn at the will of Congress). It’s not quite as simple as that. Even Congress can’t act coercively when it exercises the power of the purse strings. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2015, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679/33 "2015-05-26T17:53:42Z")
I pissed off a politician and was yanked off patrol and reassigned to work in the county jail for almost 2 years. Of course, that politician was the sheriff and therefore my boss. Still a pol though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-politicians-have-the-ability-to-give-orders-to-law-enforcement-what-is-the-relationship/720679.md?page=1)