# Do prarie dogs injure horses? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 20, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789 "2009-09-20T02:42:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/1 "2009-09-20T02:42:36Z")
All my varmit sniping buds insist that they work for the good of poor farmers by killing off prarie dogs (and any other burrowing creatures) because galloping horses step in the holes and have to be killed. Believe me, I’ve looked high and low for any evidence that this happens. I’ve found none. I have found that they can spread bubonic plague. So I come here for a factual answer; Do prarie dogs’ holes cause horses to be injured and killed. Peace, mangeorge Prairie dogs ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/2 "2009-09-20T02:54:12Z")
[Learning To Live With Prairie Dogs.](http://www.nwf.org/nationalwildlife/article.cfm?articleid=327&issueid=34) > [@](#): > > Among the threats posed by the species, many ranchers claim, is that cows and horses break their legs in prairie dog holes. But that’s nonsense, says researcher Larry Rittenhouse of Colorado State University. “It would be almost impossible for a cow to break its leg on a prairie dog hole,” he says. “I study these animals’ behavior, and they are extremely adept at placing their feet. In my 50 years around cattle and horses, I don’t personally know of a single incident where a horse or a cow has been injured in a prairie dog hole.” ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/3 "2009-09-20T03:56:38Z")
That’s pretty much what I’ve heard/read from those who should know. Many ranchers and farmers agree, but don’t seem to want to stand up to the gun folks. Even the guys who do the shooting can’t cite any factual studies that back them up. Some even offer that their hobby is what keeps the numbers down. Trouble with that is that you can go out there yourself and see the creatures and their burrows. There is evidence that the animals actually have a positive effect on the land. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/4 "2009-09-20T04:08:15Z")
> [@mangeorge](#): > > There is evidence that the animals actually have a positive effect on the land. I’d be curious to know what that might be. In these parts it’s Richardson’s Ground Squirrels, but they’re much the same sort of thing. Since the populations of their natural predators are much lower than prior to the settling of the West, their populations boom wherever control efforts don’t exist. I would agree that livestock don’t have any issues with the holes, but the little guys get to be a huge nuisance when they become too numerous. ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/5 "2009-09-20T04:14:17Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > I’d be curious to know what that might be. In these parts it’s Richardson’s Ground Squirrels, but they’re much the same sort of thing. Since the populations of their natural predators are much lower than prior to the settling of the West, their populations boom wherever control efforts don’t exist. I would agree that livestock don’t have any issues with the holes, but the little guys get to be a huge nuisance when they become too numerous. What I remember is that they aerate the soil and allow more rainfall to go to ground water. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/6 "2009-09-20T04:24:09Z")
The issue may not be that cattle and horses break legs by stepping in prairie dog holes (which apparently is false), but rather that the … well, not urban… legend has grown up that they do. People will act on what they believe to be true, regardless of whether it is. Especially if it provides a useful justification for what people want to do, such as your friends who like to go “varmint hunting”. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/7 "2009-09-20T04:27:36Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > [Learning To Live With Prairie Dogs.](http://www.nwf.org/nationalwildlife/article.cfm?articleid=327&issueid=34) Come back when you have a citation from a source that isn’t blatantly in the pay of the prairie dog lobby. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/8 "2009-09-20T09:39:22Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > Come back when you have a citation from a source that isn’t blatantly in the pay of the prairie dog lobby. Come back when you have a citation that’s not blatantly in the pay of the ranchers’ or hunting lobby. And a cite that the National Wildlife Foundation is in the pay of the prairie dog lobby. [http://www.prairiedoghuntinginfo.com/prairie-dog-facts/](http://www.prairiedoghuntinginfo.com/prairie-dog-facts/) > **[Prairie Dog Facts](http://www.ultimateprairiedoghunting.com/info/prairie-dog-facts/)** Neither one mentions the danger to livestock as a fact. Other than a few anecdotes on hunting forums, I found no verified instances of livestock breaking legs. ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 10:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/9 "2009-09-20T10:04:09Z")
Please remember that the horse only need injure the leg so they can’t stand and they end up dying. Horses that can still stand but can’t get around anymore are of no use. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/10 "2009-09-20T17:13:50Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Come back when you have a citation that’s not blatantly in the pay of the ranchers’ or hunting lobby. > > And a cite that the National Wildlife Foundation is in the pay of the prairie dog lobby. > > [http://www.prairiedoghuntinginfo.com/prairie-dog-facts/](http://www.prairiedoghuntinginfo.com/prairie-dog-facts/) > [Prairie Dog Facts](http://www.ultimateprairiedoghunting.com/info/prairie-dog-facts/) > > Neither one mentions the danger to livestock as a fact. > > Other than a few anecdotes on hunting forums, I found no verified instances of livestock breaking legs. LOL, it was supposed to be a joke. There’s no “prairie dog lobby”! ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/11 "2009-09-20T17:21:20Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > LOL, it was supposed to be a joke. There’s no “prairie dog lobby”! _That’s_why we have smilies. 😉 Sorry about the irritated tone of my post, I took it seriously. In looking around I found quite a few prairie dog advocacy sites so there may be a prairie dog lobby.😃 ---
**Author:** ![ZenBeam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/3ab097/32.png) [@ZenBeam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZenBeam)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/12 "2009-09-20T17:22:21Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > LOL, it was supposed to be a joke. There’s no “prairie dog lobby”! _I_ thought it was funny. ---
**Author:** ![billfish678](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@billfish678](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billfish678)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/13 "2009-09-20T17:29:33Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > _That’s_why we have smilies. 😉 > > Sorry about the irritated tone of my post, I took it seriously. > In looking around I found quite a few prairie dog advocacy sites so there may be a prairie dog lobby.😃 You’ll never get the proof you need. By definition, its an underground organization. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/14 "2009-09-20T17:34:55Z")
> [@billfish678](#): > > You’ll never get the proof you need. By definition, its an underground organization. 😃 You just need to dig more. ---
**Author:** ![Tangent](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tangent/32/3098_2.png) [@Tangent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tangent)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/15 "2009-09-20T17:48:30Z")
I remember seeing a show on Discovery Channel or Animal Planet or something where they showed an alternative method of prairie dog control. Basically this guy had a modified pump truck–one of those that they use to pump out septic tanks and sewers–and he would stick the hose down into the prairie dog holes and suck the little critters right out of the ground! You could actually see them flying through the translucent hose and into the truck! Some of them might be relocated to “friendlier” places, but a lot of them wind up being killed later, and apparently some of them get injured pretty badly during the extraction, so it’s not necessarily a more humane method than shooting them. Maybe better than poison, though. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/16 "2009-09-20T17:59:16Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > _That’s_why we have smilies. 😉 > > Sorry about the irritated tone of my post, I took it seriously. > In looking around I found quite a few prairie dog advocacy sites so there may be a prairie dog lobby.😃 I attempted to expose the nefariousness of the prairie dog lobby once – but the hamsters ate the post. (I did get an echo of “Rodent Solidarity!” back though.) 😉 ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/17 "2009-09-20T18:16:19Z")
> [@Tangent](#): > > Maybe better than poison, though. Some guy on another board actually claimed he was saving the prairie dogs from poison! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![mnemosyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/18 "2009-09-20T22:21:04Z")
I have never heard of an injury to a horse and rider actually happening, but when I was younger and would ride horses through a field with friends, the concern was more that the _rider_ might guide the horse through an area with lots of holes, and then the horse might step into one and fall/throw the rider, etc. It sounds plausible, until you remember that horses balk at just about anything even mildly “not ok” in their minds, especially things near where they might put their feet. Of course, a rider could still be thrown and injured if the horse balks or spooks, so perhaps there is some validity to the claim when viewed from that point of view? ---
**Author:** ![mangeorge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d78d45/32.png) [@mangeorge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mangeorge)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/19 "2009-09-20T22:52:19Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#): > > Of course, a rider could still be thrown and injured if the horse balks or spooks, so perhaps there is some validity to the claim when viewed from that point of view? A horse wouldn’t spook at a burrow. He/she would simply avoid it, the same as if you weren’t riding. You don’t tell a horse where to put it’s feet, just what direction to go and how fast. Mostly. If you’re heading home, then all bets are off. ---
**Author:** ![Athena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@Athena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Athena)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2009, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789/20 "2009-09-20T23:12:56Z")
I have a friend who grew up on a cattle ranch in South Dakota. I asked him about prairie dogs and broken legs once, and he said he never once heard of a horse or cow who broke its leg in a prairie dog hole. I also asked him about cow tipping; he said he’d never seen a sleeping standing cow, and even if he had found one, a cow is a skittish beast; no way could a person, much less several drunken frat boys, sneak up on one without it waking up and simply walking away. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-prarie-dogs-injure-horses/510789.md?page=2)