# Do professional authors really need editors? What does an editor bring to the table? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 19, 2004, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694 "2004-12-19T22:18:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/1 "2004-12-19T22:18:20Z")
What does an editor bring to the table for a successful professional author? If a writer knows what he’s doing does he even really need an editor? ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/2 "2004-12-19T22:20:25Z")
An objective opinion? I would guess that the higher up the food chain you get (Stephen King, for example) the more say you have over edits. His first version of _The Stand_, for example, was chopped off at the beginning and end. When he got bigger and richer and more successful, he was able to republish _The Stand_ as a “director’s cut”, if you will. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/3 "2004-12-19T22:23:51Z")
An author friend of mine put it this way: How many editors does it take to screw in a lightbulb? Three. Two to hold the author down, and one to screw in the bulb. If this stays thread stays active until tomorrow, I’m sure we’ll be hearing more details from **Eve** , but my experience reading about the publishing industry, working in it, and talking with authors and editors is that there are some specific things editors do, in no particular order: 1. Make sure the book that got written is the one they intended to print. Sometimes the author’s best intentions don’t work out the way the original idea seem to be going, and what gets written isn’t what’s supposed to be published. 2. Make sure the book is grammatically/factually/spellingly correct. 3. Make sure the book fits within the guidelines of acceptability set by the publisher. I don’t know how much this is still done today, but when Robert Heinlein was writing, several of his publishers had very strict guidelines as to what could and could not be printed in, say, _Boy’s Life._ They also enforce limits on how long it can be and what reader level it’s written for. ---
**Author:** ![racinchikki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@racinchikki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racinchikki)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/4 "2004-12-19T22:26:15Z")
You can be brilliant at coming up with stories and good at choosing words that flow nicely and paint a picture and yet have no idea how to punctuate a sentence properly. So that’s one minor point where an editor would step in. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/5 "2004-12-19T22:33:06Z")
Omigod, I _so_ need an editor. But working for a University press, I rarely get one. So I send my manuscript out to five or six amenable friends and ask them to look over it: "What can be cut? What comes off as too wise-ass? Are there any sentences that make the baby Jesus cry? Do I repeat myself, or is anything unclear? " The best _and_ the worst writers need a good editor like we need our _hands_. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/6 "2004-12-19T22:48:11Z")
> [@astro](#): > > What does an editor bring to the table for a successful professional author? If a writer knows what he’s doing does he even really need an editor? Restraint. Compare Stephen King’s early works, when he was still enough of an unknown that he had to listen to his editors if he wanted to see his books published, with the stuff he’s been writing since he became the 500 pound gorilla of the publishing industry. His early stuff was tight, fast paced, and scary as fuck. His later stuff is bloated, lumbering, and dull. Because now, when an editor tells him to cut out a passage, or rewrite something, he can just walk out the door and head down the street to a new publisher, who will soil their expensive silk underwear in their excitement to publish his book. There’s no one to reign in King’s excesses. Because he can do anything he wants to, he tends to do everything he wants to, and his books have lost all focus and most of their quality. He doesn’t have any perspective on his own works, and he’s put himself into a position where he’s isolated from any outside perspective. As a consequence, his talent has turned in on itself. He’s long since stopped growing as an artist, and has become stagnant. What’s worse is that King has become (or at least, he was when he strong-armed the release of his “unabridged” version of _The Stand_) openly contemptuous of his editors, without whom he was still be living in a trailer park in Maine while teaching high school English. Now, this isn’t necessarily a 100% truism. Terry Pratchett is every bit as popular (in England, at least) and prolific as King, and his books have steadily increased in quality as his reputation has grown. I don’t know if this is because he’s an innately superior writer to King, or if he’s simply got enough sense to still listen to his editors, even though he no longer _has_ to listen to them. Probably a combination of the two. ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/7 "2004-12-19T23:01:32Z")
I bring punctuation, spelling and all those boring things to the table. I work on plotting, characterisation and continuity – by the time my partner reaches the third book in the series, he’s not always seeing the big picture. I proofread books. Basically I try to work with the author to make the book as good as it can be. I do some freelance manuscript appraisal when I can and I am always trying to make sure the story works, the prose is clean and there are no avoidable mistakes. I bring an outside eye in as well and can point out where a book works and where it doesn’t and suggest how to fix it. ---
**Author:** ![Angel\_of\_the\_Lord](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/angel_of_the_lord/32/2949_2.png) [@Angel\_of\_the\_Lord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Angel_of_the_Lord)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/8 "2004-12-19T23:04:16Z")
Much of the time, authors will go over their own writing–God knows I do, though God also knows I’m no professional author. When I do this, I tend to change the way sentences are arranged, the order that I put them in, and so on. Unfortunately, after the (approximately) five-millionth time I’ve gone over everything, I know exactly what I’m trying to say. And if I miss a word or accidentally delete a sentence or repeat something, I honestly might not _notice_. When I get to that point, I can either put the writing aside for a few months until I can look at it with fresh eyes, or I can foist it off on another individual, who won’t have memorized the entire damn thing already, and who can tell me, “Um, \*_Angel_, there’s no character’s name here.” Additionally, they can say something like, “ **Angel** , why is X character acting this way,” and I’ll realize that, hey, I didn’t explain an event that happened when the character was 18 years old that has a MAJOR impact on the character’s life. Basically, editors offer an objective rating of sucktitude. If I say, “this is great,” I might be biased. If I say, “this sucks,” then I might just be so damn frustrated with the story that I want to burn it. An editor is better able to use reason. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/9 "2004-12-19T23:08:23Z")
I present to you…Robert. fucking. Jordan. The man needs a real editor like I need AIR! He’s currently working (or at least he’d better be!) on the 11th book in the Wheel of Time series. _Each_ of these books is from 600-1000 pages of the most minute detail about women’s gowns, idiosyncratic gestures, internal dialogues with people who might or might not exist…the man hasn’t answered pretty much a single one of the big questions he’s brought up in the course of 10 books. If I hadn’t already read them all, I’d discard the whole bunch and not finish the series. His editor? Is his wife. The man who pays the piper gets to pick the tune, and Jordan has made more money for TOR in the last 15 years than they’ve ever seen before. ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 11:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/10 "2004-12-19T23:08:25Z")
I bring punctuation, spelling and all those boring things to the table. I work on plotting, characterisation and continuity – by the time my partner reaches the third book in the series, he’s not always seeing the big picture. I proofread books. Basically I try to work with the author to make the book as good as it can be. I do some freelance manuscript appraisal when I can and I am always trying to make sure the story works, the prose is clean and there are no avoidable mistakes. I bring an outside eye in as well and can point out where a book works and where it doesn’t and suggest how to fix it. ---
**Author:** ![vibrotronica](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/a9a28c/32.png) [@vibrotronica](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vibrotronica)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2004, 11:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/11 "2004-12-19T23:41:50Z")
I once saw a copy of the manuscript of _The Waste Land_ before Ezra Pound got ahold of it. It sucked. If T. S. Eliot needs an editor, everybody needs an editor. ---
**Author:** ![MercyStreet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a9adbd/32.png) [@MercyStreet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MercyStreet)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/12 "2004-12-20T00:33:18Z")
A good editor is your first reader. A good editor will save you from yourself. ---
**Author:** ![Athena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/35a633/32.png) [@Athena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Athena)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/13 "2004-12-20T00:36:24Z")
I’m a very, very beginning writer, but I can very much see what an editor brings to the table. When you write something, you’re put in the position where you’ve read it so many fookin’ times that your eye just skims over some things, no matter how hard you try not to. It’s hard to judge, for instance, where it’s OK to use a pronoun as the subject of the sentence and where you need to use a proper noun - you’ve read it so many times that of course you know whose point of view every single sentence is written from. An editor helps with that. An editor can also help with the basics of puncuation and grammar, as others have pointed out. I know I tend to use commas oddly; Mr. Athena and the group of reviewers I’ve somehow managed to convince to review my stories point this out. ---
**Author:** ![pepperlandgirl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/f17d59/32.png) [@pepperlandgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pepperlandgirl)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/14 "2004-12-20T00:57:29Z")
Anne Rice is a great example of why everybody needs an editor. Really, that’s all you have to say. I’m completely beholden to my wonderful friends who agree to act as “beta” readers, or editors. Sometimes a writer is too close to the story to see the flaws, and a fresh pair of eyes brings a fresh and needed perspective. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/15 "2004-12-20T01:11:20Z")
If there are a million writers, then there are a million answers to the OP. More, since every book by the same author requires a different answer. I agree with what the others have said, and I’ll probably wind up saying some of it over again. Authors vary in every conceivable way. Some don’t bother to punctuate or spell. Some go on far too long. Some fall in love with their own words and can’t see how they look to others. Some skimp on details and need to be told to put them in. Authors of fiction vary from authors of non-fiction in how they write and the kinds of editing they require. Horror stories of various kinds abound in publishing, whether told by authors who complain of editors or editors who complain of authors. While the editing that Maxwell Perkins did to make him publishable is now thought to be exaggerated, Thomas Wolfe’s big posthumous novels _The Web and the Rock_ and _You Can’t Go Home Again_ were hewed out of a million words of manuscript by Edward C. Aswell. On the other side, editor Horace Gold of the seminal science fiction magazine Galaxy magazine routinely rewrote and retitled stories to the extent that their authors did not recognize them when published. Editors can do a lot but they can’t and shouldn’t do everything. I’ll workshop a story at my writer’s group to find out what’s working and what isn’t, but I don’t pay a lot of attention to their sentence by sentence suggestions: my words have to be my own. When I submit a story to a magazine today I expect to see it published exactly as is, unless I’ve missed an error or need to be copyedited to the publication’s specific standards. I use my wife as a nonfiction editor in the same way. So professionals do definitely require an outside and objective eye, and the lack of one can be disastrous. And some professionals are surprisingly bad at the basic mechanics of language. But there’s editing and then there’s editing, so to speak, and the level, purpose, type, quantity, kind, and sort of editing that a professional needs varies from little to lots. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/16 "2004-12-20T02:04:25Z")
Xap and I are both in publishing but from different ends. For me, as a publisher, I find that editors are desperately needed if I, A) want the manuscripts in on time and B) want them in a format my magazine can use. If I order or get offered 2000 words on subject X I want to make sure I get 2000 words on subject X by date Y or it won’t make the publishing date. Example (from real life). An editor I know signed a contract for 11 books on birds of the various mid-west states. Simple enough. He was given a deadline to have his part ready for proofing and layout. It was several months out. By the time the deadline came he’d done little and ended up bitching to me (it wasn’t my contract, thank God) that deadline are **always** built with some slippage in them! How could they _possibly_ ask for the material on the date them originally requested? Urgh. Remember, this is a man who’s been writing on this subject for 20 years. And he still fucked around and blew his deadline. That’s exactly where an editor would have come in handy. ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/17 "2004-12-20T02:12:24Z")
I don’t know if you’d call me a pro, but I have written a lot of short stories over the years, many of which have been published or won contests or turned up in anthologies. Also, one of my screenplays made it as far as the second round of the Austin Film Festival contest. But I never let a single one of these tales escape without having my friend T. edit and critique them first. After a while, I get too close to the stories and can’t be objective enough to see the problems. ---
**Author:** ![RobuSensei](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/919ad9/32.png) [@RobuSensei](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RobuSensei)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/18 "2004-12-20T02:29:26Z")
Well, I was gonna say exactly what Miller said, except my example was going to be Tom Clancy. From around _The Sum of All Fears_ onward, his novels have become increasingly bloated and clunky, plotwise. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 2:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/19 "2004-12-20T02:57:30Z")
Harry Turtledove is another example of an author who has apparently made the unfortunate decision that he no longer needs to have his work edited. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2004, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694/20 "2004-12-20T03:19:59Z")
The latest Harry Potter book is a great example of why authors need editors. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-professional-authors-really-need-editors-what-does-an-editor-bring-to-the-table/280694.md?page=2)