# Do progressives believe that all religions are liberal at their true core? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 23, 2026, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297 "2026-09-23T00:54:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 9:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/141 "2026-10-02T09:27:03Z")
\< This might be a slight hijack but we’re 140 posts in \> There’s a talking point on the right that liberals are in some sense “pro muslim”, and that this is hypocritical given that liberals are also pro LGBT. There’s even this recent action film made by The Daily Wire based on a premise of clueless progressives teaming up with islamist terrorists: [https://www.imdb.com/title/tt40231163/](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt40231163/) The reality of course is just that liberals are largely just trying to advocate for personal freedoms and against bigotry. Can’t say I’ve ever met a non-Muslim trying to push or support Islam, rather than just speaking out about injustices committed against them. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/142 "2026-10-02T13:10:39Z")
Yep. The Right / Left dichotomy is really _almost_ as as simple as > Everyone must be the same (IOW like me) > versus > Everyone can be different Binary black / white thinkers have a very hard time with transitive relationships between multiple different things. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/143 "2026-10-02T13:15:54Z")
And it’s not as if every Muslim is anti-lgbt, either. There are liberal and conservative Muslims, same as any other giant religion. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/144 "2026-10-02T14:24:22Z")
Yep. This will also vary a lot based on where you are and how the question is worded - in 2017, 52% of U.S. Muslims said homosexuality should be accepted by society in 2017: [Cite](https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2017/07/26/political-and-social-views) Whereas in 2016 in Britain, only 16% said homosexuality should be legal [Cite](https://www.brin.ac.uk/counting-religion-in-britain-april-2016/). But 28% there said it was OK for a schoolteacher to be gay. Not sure what serves as a better analogue of the other survey’s “accepted by society”, but either number says there’s a not ignorable percentage of Muslims who are just fine with the lg part of lgbqta+, at least. And the American survey shows it’s better with Millennials and better than 10 years before the survey. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/145 "2026-10-02T14:36:09Z")
In the months after 9/11, it was a standard talking point on the Right that they had no problem with progressive, open-minded Muslims - it was the fundamentalist, traditionalist ones they were afraid of. Fast-forward 25 years, and now the Right has no problem with fundamentalist, traditionalist Jews - it’s the progressive, open-minded ones they’re afraid of! ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/146 "2026-10-02T16:08:49Z")
If I may gently steer the thread a bit as the OP, the thread isn’t about “is Islam good or bad, or does Islam get preferential treatment” (we have many other threads about that) but rather, “Do progressives think Islam (or any other religion) is inherently _liberal_?” That’s somewhat different. For instance, has there ever been a time when people did something bad in the name of a religion, and progressives said, “That’s because their religion _tells_ them to do bad things,” or is it more of, “That religion is liberal, and they warped it by doing an illiberal thing in the name of that religion?” ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/147 "2026-10-02T16:42:29Z")
“Liberal”, like “Muslim” or “Christian” covers a lot of ground. There are liberal Christians who think that Christians who do bad things in the name of Christianity are warping Christianity. There are also liberal atheists who believe that all religion is bad and prompts people to do bad things by its nature. And there are liberals in between, too. No, i don’t think there has ever been a time when all [fill in the blank] agreed on anything, unless [fill in the blank] is an extremely small group that has well defined beliefs. Even when a group has a set of tenets they are all supposed to believe, if it’s a large group, not everyone will agree. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/148 "2026-10-02T17:46:58Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > For instance, has there ever been a time when people did something bad in the name of a religion, and progressives said, “That’s because their religion _tells_ them to do bad things,” or is it more of, “That religion is liberal, and they warped it by doing an illiberal thing in the name of that religion?” I’ve certainly seen people saying that the tenets of a particular sect do damage; whether to their own children, or to society in general. Extending that from a particular sect to the entirety of a world wide religion would not, IMO, be a very liberal or progressive thing to (although @puzzlegal is entirely correct that progressives, like Christians etc., are a very large group unlikely to all agree about much of anything.) I have however run into some conservatives who do it. (Again, not all. Conservatives are also a very large group, etc.) ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/149 "2026-10-02T17:56:04Z")
I mean to the extent any progressive does this it must be in defense of their chosen religion, so it’s weird to frame it as “progressives do this.” When religious people do bad things in the name of some religion, my response is not to defend a religion I don’t belong to. My response is to think, “Well, that’s religion for you.” Although based on my past experience as a Christian I feel fairly confident at times that Jesus, as depicted in the Bible, would not do the kinds of hateful things some Christians do. I can conceive of some instance I would point that out. But I wouldn’t say “Jesus is liberal actually.” His historical political context doesn’t really map on to ours. ---
**Author:** ![Thing.Fish](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thing.fish/32/9168_2.png) [@Thing.Fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thing.Fish)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/150 "2026-10-02T18:33:19Z")
One instance that comes to mind is the ancient Hindu tradition of suttee, burning widows alive. It was banned by the British in 1827, and liberal British opinion seems to have been solidly against the practice; it was conservatives who were talking about “religious freedom” and “respect for tradition”.However, there was in fact a significant movement of religious Hindus opposed to suttee; liberals pointed that out to rebut “religious freedom” arguments, but it wasn’t really why they opposed it. ---
**Author:** ![steronz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steronz/32/11765_2.png) [@steronz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steronz)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/151 "2026-10-02T18:38:02Z")
Right, so let’s take polygamous LDS sects in Northern Mexico or something. IMHO, adherents of those particular sects are doing bad things because their religion _tells_ them to do bad things. I’m not going to say that all of Christianity is evil because of this, nor am I going to say that Christianity is great and the Warren Jeffs of the world have twisted it. I don’t know why would have to stake a claim to either of those positions. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [October 2, 2026, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/152 "2026-10-02T18:47:09Z")
Most religions are tools, and what you do with that tool determines the worth of that tool. Unfortunately, far too many people think that their tool is the only one available and is suitable for every occasion, and thus truly believe that what that tool does must automatically be the right thing to do. ---
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [October 3, 2026, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/153 "2026-10-03T08:04:44Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > But, is it a belief of many progressives that any religion, when practiced in its “true” form, will consist of peace, tolerance and nonviolence? It seems like, in the eyes of many liberals, that any time someone does violence or bigotry in the name of his religion, that he must be acting on a warped and distorted version of it, and that it’s not possible that his bad deeds may actually be a true, genuine practice of his religion. Obviously I can’t speak for all progressives, and there may be some that believe this. To the extent I’ve seen progressives speak in these terms, they fit into a couple of categories: 1. Adherents to the aforementioned religions that want to defend their own personal faith. 2. Nonbelievers of that faith who have read/listened to some particular propaganda/sect’s statements about the ideals of the religion and are taking that at face value. This attitude when I’ve seen it expressed is cherry-picking the interpretation of the religion that is “positive”. Also, I don’t think it’s a case that they think _all_ religions are liberal at their core. Rather, they are picking from some part of the particular religion’s texts/ideals. > [@Velocity](#): > > For instance, has there ever been a time when people did something bad in the name of a religion, and progressives said, “That’s because their religion _tells_ them to do bad things,” or is it more of, “That religion is liberal, and they warped it by doing an illiberal thing in the name of that religion?” Again, progressives aren’t a monolith. Absolutely there are progressives that think religions promote “bad” actions. What’s a corruption of the inherent religion, what is an integral core idea/value of that religion, and what is interpretation of the religion? Humans being humans, we are very strong on generating religious schisms (thanks @thorny_locust ). One person’s prophet is another’s heretic. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 8, 2026, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/154 "2026-10-08T22:44:15Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > But, is it a belief of many progressives that any religion, when practiced in its “true” form, will consist of peace, tolerance and nonviolence? It seems like, in the eyes of many liberals, that any time someone does violence or bigotry in the name of his religion, that he must be acting on a warped and distorted version of it, and that it’s not possible that his bad deeds may actually be a true, genuine practice of his religion. I think that’s the dominant belief yes. The “logic” is simple: Religion is _axiomatically_ good, liberal/progressive values are likewise axiomatically good, therefore at their core religions _must_ be progressive/liberal. It’s all about assuming their conclusion and backwards-reasoning a justification. And avoiding even contemplating much less stating the completely unacceptable possibility that religion _might_ not be good. Atheism has long since been shoved back into the category of “so evil that it is never even to be mentioned” pile. I’ve seen hardline Communists who defend Stalin’s mass killings get all evasive about the offical atheism of the USSR, because _that’s_ a line they dare not cross. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2026, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/155 "2026-10-09T00:30:16Z")
Huh? Probably half the population of the advanced world believes religion to be axiomatically bad. It’s just in a few holdout countries, USA to the fore, that religious dogma is so entrenched that the “it’s bad” voices are drowned out by the “it’s good” voices. There’s also the unadvanced world, where primitive religion still holds sway over everyone. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2026, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/156 "2026-10-09T02:40:00Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Probably half the population of the advanced world believes religion to be axiomatically bad. > > It’s just in a few holdout countries, USA to the fore, that religious dogma is so entrenched that the “it’s bad” voices are drowned out by the “it’s good” voices. Then perhaps they should actually speak up about it, because by all appearances they don’t exist. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2026, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/157 "2026-10-09T06:31:13Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Probably half the population of the advanced world believes religion to be axiomatically bad. I seriously doubt that (I’m assuming by “advanced” here you don’t mean something tautological but rather akin to “developed”). About 50-60% of the population in developed countries identifies with a religion, so they’re all out. And of the rest, I highly doubt most are as firmly anti-religious as all that. Even France only ekes out around 21% outright atheists. Many more are just “no particular religion” but you can’t claim them for the “religion = bad” side absent further data. Hell, you can’t even count on 100% of the atheists. From what I can see from [Pew](https://www.pewresearch.org/religion/2018/05/29/attitudes-toward-spirituality-and-religion/), it’s more like 1/3 of people think that. In some countries like Scandinavian ones, you do get to half . [![](https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2018/05/PF_05.29.18_religion.western.europe-05-08-.png?resize=641,483) ](https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2018/05/PF_05.29.18_religion.western.europe-05-08-.png?resize=641,483) [![](https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2018/05/PF_05.29.18_religion.western.europe-05-09-.png?resize=421,395) ](https://www.pewresearch.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/20/2018/05/PF_05.29.18_religion.western.europe-05-09-.png?resize=421,395) ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2026, 12:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/158 "2026-10-09T12:42:56Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Hell, you can’t even count on 100% of the atheists. I’m more confused by the people who say they are both religious and spiritual, who also say that science makes religion unnecessary in their lives. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2026, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/159 "2026-10-09T13:30:03Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > I’m more confused by the people who say they are both religious and spiritual, who also say that science makes religion unnecessary in their lives. If your worry is “what will actually, tangibly help me and solve problems?” then science is a _much_ better choice than religion. People talk up being “religious and spiritual” as a good thing because they are taught from childhood that it’s so, and it’s the position society demands that they take\*. But if they are practical minded that are faced with the dilemma that religion and spirituality don’t actually _do_ anything. Science does. Oh, sure people can find them emotionally supportive, but there are many other sources for that. Religion can’t support you any better than getting a puppy can, and puppies don’t demand you adhere to what some old guy in a funny hat tells you to do. - I would not be surprised at all if many of the people who say that are lying in self defense. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2026, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297/160 "2026-10-09T13:45:26Z")
That’s just about exactly my take. But you said it better than the post I deleted would have said it. As kids they got / get indoctrinated. So they adopt “I’m religious” as one of their internal markers of self. Unless they have a major crisis of faith later, they can be OK as a non-practicing not-really-believer. And the odds of that major crisis go up the more all-controlling their sect. Mormons & Baptists famously breed rejectionist atheists. Episcopalians & other relaxed non-fundamental Protestants not so much. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-progressives-believe-that-all-religions-are-liberal-at-their-true-core/1033297.md?page=9)