# Do Seatbelts Sometimes Kill? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 3, 2011, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739 "2011-07-03T19:08:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/61 "2015-09-01T00:29:13Z")
Sure, but people are ejected in non rollover accidents too. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/62 "2015-09-01T02:11:24Z")
> [@Heracles](#): > > I saw a segment many years ago on 60 Minutes of a similar program, where they explained (with video) that school buses didn’t have lap belts because crash tests had shown that having just a lap belt increased kids’ chances of hurting their head on the hard back of the seat in front of them. Apparently it was statistically safer to not wear any belt at all. They didn’t discuss the possibility of having shoulder belts installed. > > Are school buses still devoid of seat belts? I haven’t ridden in one since the last century. Yes. School buses don’t have seat belts for the same reason you don’t require drivers to wear crash helmets; they just aren’t necessary and would create more trouble than they’d be worth. School buses are huge, lumbering things with seat layouts designed to prevent severe injuries if they crash. They are extremely safe the way they are. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/63 "2015-09-01T13:51:41Z")
And they’re also driven by professionals: That makes a difference, too. On point, though, almost all properly-designed safety features can sometimes cause death or injury, and if a safety feature does _not_ occasionally cause death or injury, it’s probably not properly designed. Let’s look at the question of how easily a seat belt buckle releases, for instance: Make it too easy to release, and they’ll get released sometimes when they’re not supposed to, sending passengers through the windshield. The harder you make them to release, the less of that you’ll have. On the other hand, make it too hard to release, and you’ll sometimes get a passenger trapped in a burning, sinking, or otherwise dangerous car, who can’t release it to get out. The easier you make them to release, the less of that you’ll have. You want to minimize the _total_ amount of deaths, from both kinds of accidents. And you do that by finding where the derivative is zero. That is to say, if a seat belt is properly designed, with just the right amount of difficulty to release it: If you start from that point and make it a very small amount easier to release, then the increased deaths from being thrown will almost exactly balance out the decreased deaths from being trapped, and vice versa. But this means that, at that point, it must be possible to decrease the number of deaths from being trapped. Which means that number will be nonzero. In other words, a properly-designed seat belt _will_ result in some deaths from people being trapped in the car. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/64 "2015-09-01T14:30:46Z")
Not sure about your state, but here the school bus drivers don’t need any more qualifications than a CDL. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/65 "2015-09-01T14:35:13Z")
Which is still a greater hurdle than most drivers have to clear. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/66 "2015-09-01T16:08:02Z")
[My favourite seat belt PSA.](http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W8dQy2gQ-ko) ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/67 "2015-09-01T17:19:46Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > [My favourite seat belt PSA.](http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=W8dQy2gQ-ko) Wait, you’re not from America if I’m not mistaken? And you’re linking to a PSA? It’s a trap! ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/68 "2015-09-01T19:25:52Z")
Zombies definitely don’t wear seatbelts or normally ride in cars. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/69 "2015-09-01T20:08:37Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Zombies definitely don’t wear seatbelts or normally ride in cars. They prefer… Wait for it… Traaaains. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/70 "2015-09-01T20:24:43Z")
If I had not been wearing a seatbelt when I was in a major smash in 1999, I’d now be posting as a zombie. ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/71 "2015-09-01T20:30:55Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > They prefer… > > Wait for it… > > Traaaains. Go stand in the corner and don’t come out until you’re told ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2015, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/72 "2015-09-01T23:04:02Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > They prefer… > > Wait for it… > > Traaaains. “Plaaaaaaaanes” would also have been acceptable. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 9:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/73 "2015-09-02T09:06:01Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > “Plaaaaaaaanes” would also have been acceptable. Only if there’s a treadmill around. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/74 "2015-09-02T09:19:19Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > They prefer… > > Wait for it… > > Traaaains. Speaking of zombies, do you know what vegetarian zombies eat? ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/75 "2015-09-02T14:11:28Z")
Plantaaaaains? ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/76 "2015-09-02T16:39:35Z")
I think people who claim that seat belts kill people are trying to reach for some evidence in order to be proudly contrary or defiant of conventional practice. They don’t like wearing seat belts, but that’s not enough; they have to find some justifiable sounding reason. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/77 "2015-09-02T18:48:50Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > Zombies definitely don’t wear seatbelts or normally ride in cars. \ Do we \*really \*need a comment like this every time someone comments on a old thread? ---
**Author:** ![gnoitall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bb73d2/32.png) [@gnoitall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gnoitall)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/78 "2015-09-02T19:12:55Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > \ > > Do we \*really \*need a comment like this every time someone comments on a old thread? Yes. Next question? ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/79 "2015-09-02T19:15:36Z")
> [@tetranz](#): > > In New Hampshire, adults are not required to wear a seatbelt. > > Well… I guess I misread you. I think you’re saying those drivers are not permitted to wear a seatbelt. > > Even so, I think NH is the only US state where seatbelts are optional. New Hampshire doesn’t require motorcyclists to wear helmets, either. And there are those in the motorcycle world who make the same kind of claims – that helmets cause neck and spine injuries, and that they’re dangerous, and that it’s safer to ride without one, etc. Same BS. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2015, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739/80 "2015-09-02T19:39:34Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > > [@Heracles](#): > > > > Are school buses still devoid of seat belts? I haven’t ridden in one since the last century. > > Yes. [Some do](https://www.google.com/search?q=school+bus+seat+belts&biw=939&bih=639&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&sqi=2&ved=0CDUQsARqFQoTCMvP54qN2ccCFQWLDQodEdgPUg). I’ve ridden in a couple. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-seatbelts-sometimes-kill/587739.md?page=5)