# Do singers know when they shouldn't? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [January 2, 2025, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502 "2025-01-02T22:48:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/1 "2025-01-02T22:48:42Z")
In a brief aside in the latest MMP thread I mentioned about how we had gone to a concert with primarily music by Gershwin and Ellington, and how the opera singer they brought in was the wrong choice of voice for that sort of music. I’m sure the woman has spent untold hours honing her instrument and is considered quite good in opera circles, but IMO she shouldn’t be tackling jazz licks with that voice. Now the question is: do trained singers know when they shouldn’t be venturing into another genre? Is it just my ear that’s offended? I would think they would know that while they’re hitting the notes, the genre is just all wrong for them. I bought a Christmas album by Diana Krall a couple of years ago without first sampling the music. HUGE mistake. While I like her jazz styling, that is NOT a genre that works well for her phrasing, etc. But I’m wondering if _she_ realized it. Deep thoughts for a lazy day. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/2 "2025-01-02T22:54:05Z")
Funnily enough I read this only a couple of days ago. [Katherine Jenkins](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katherine_Jenkins) [‘Karaoke? I’m absolutely dreadful’: Katherine Jenkins’ honest playlist](https://www.theguardian.com/music/2022/jun/27/katherine-jenkins-honest-playlist) > **The song I do at karaoke** > Everybody expects that I can sing anything on karaoke but, in all honesty, I’m absolutely dreadful. I murder anything I attempt. I have tried Whitney, Céline and Adele, and it’s a disaster. I’m just not trained as a pop singer. My husband always says: “You shouldn’t do that in public.” So I go for something unexpected, like Empire State of Mind. I can do the Jay-Z rap _and_ the Alicia Keys singing parts. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/3 "2025-01-02T23:07:14Z")
But Diana Krall _is_ a jazz/pop singer, not from another genre. I don’t understand that reference. Yes, I agree that opera singers should in general stay away from more popular genres. One that made something of a success of it, way back in the 50’s, was Eileen Farrell. Although trained as a soprano, when singing jazz/pop standards, she used her chest voice and changed her phrasing. I think this was after her opera career was over, because the photos and videos I’ve seen show her in late middle or early old age. She’s the only one I’ve ever heard make that transition reasonably well, but of course there may be others I don’t know about. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/4 "2025-01-02T23:11:31Z")
Apart from hitting the pitches, singing is pretty subjective. I was taught a classical style, with all the pure vowels, damped vibrato, rolled r’s, no dipthongs, crisp exact diction. That all sounds pretentious in pop, which is all about emoting in a ‘realistic’ voice. Some few people can switch between styles. Some people, obviously, think they’re switching but aren’t. I don’t know that pop needs a specific voice in the sense of range or tone, it’s more of a style or approach. Often I am surprised by how many pop singers carry a song not by techique, range, or quality of voice, all of which many pop singers are very much lacking in, but purely by confidence and expressed emotion. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/5 "2025-01-02T23:23:01Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > But Diana Krall _is_ a jazz/pop singer, not from another genre. I don’t understand that reference. But her Christmas album is not jazz music. She’s trying to sing it her own style, which just doesn’t work for most of it. Anyway, the question is: Do singers know when they shouldn’t be attempting another genre? Or are doing it badly? ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/6 "2025-01-02T23:25:40Z")
Well, singers who know they shouldn’t attempt another genre aren’t going to be making recordings of it, right? So the only ones you’ll hear butchering another genre are those who are oblivious. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/7 "2025-01-02T23:29:19Z")
One would hope. The concert we went to wasn’t recorded, obviously. I was just surprised that she accepted the invitation to appear as a guest star to sing something out of her wheelhouse. ---
**Author:** ![Dr\_Paprika](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr_paprika/32/3042_2.png) [@Dr\_Paprika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr_Paprika)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/8 "2025-01-02T23:31:36Z")
The last time I went to karaoke, the singers sure didn’t. I would guess some singers are pitch perfect, and some much better than others at knowing their strengths and degree of mellifluosity. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2025, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/9 "2025-01-02T23:33:09Z")
I saw the Three Tenors singing “New York, New York” once. Their style was completely inappropriate for the song – too much power one a song that should be smooth. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/my5J0XpcPLM/hqdefault.jpg "The 3 Tenors sings New York, New York") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=my5J0XpcPLM) ---
**Author:** ![Moonrise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moonrise/32/14764_2.png) [@Moonrise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonrise)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 8:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/10 "2025-01-03T08:02:40Z")
It’s not just singers. Many classical musicians have repertoire they excel in, other where they’re ok to bland, and some where they’re awful. So, you have people who are specialists of late Renaissance Italian madrigals and others who are _the_ reference for Belle Époque French orchestral music. On the opposite end of the spectrum, you have someone like pianist **[Sviatoslav Richter](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sviatoslav_Richter)** who was very good to legendary in everything. The only duds in his legacy are some of his Brahms which he tackled at the tail-end of his career. But apart from that, his interpretations of anything from Bach to Prokofiev are consistently excellent. ---
**Author:** ![Die\_Capacitrix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/die_capacitrix/32/9_2.png) [@Die\_Capacitrix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Die_Capacitrix)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/11 "2025-01-03T08:23:16Z")
Not a professional, but two different friends tried singing with an amateur rock band. Did not work. And everyone agreed. The quality of the singing was quite high. But it was not suitable. Any singer who has spent time learning how to breathe, sing, etc., should be able to recognize their strengths and weaknesses. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/12 "2025-01-03T08:36:13Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > I saw the Three Tenors singing “New York, New York” once. I can top that. Here she is, the queen of Nashville, Miss Bev Sills! [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/pn2aOQqftpw/maxresdefault.jpg "The Muppet Show - 409: Beverly Sills - “When the Bloom is on the Sage” (1979) (Part 1)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pn2aOQqftpw) ---
**Author:** ![peccavi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peccavi/32/388_2.png) [@peccavi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peccavi)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/13 "2025-01-03T15:24:39Z")
Of course, their are outliers. **Linda Ronstadt** : Pop - [Long Long Time](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nKzFOfIjMg) Country - [Silver Threads & Golden Needles](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flLoj5qxURw) Rock - [Heatwave](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0FTdzvQT2xA) Standards - [Skylark](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mkJPHoC_-ko) Ranchera - [Dos Rancheras](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZHUCYD9OzyQ) Operetta - [Poor Wandering One](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ud54BCPJv8) (Pirates of Penzance) Yes, she also did [Christmas songs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ihjxaxg986E), performed on the [Muppets Show](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_AXp9JOAs4), and credibly covered [Joni Mitchell](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lMqNcVIW7ko). ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/14 "2025-01-03T15:35:46Z")
> [@Moonrise](#): > > On the opposite end of the spectrum, you have someone like pianist **[Sviatoslav Richter](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sviatoslav_Richter)** who was very good to legendary in everything. But would he have been good at, say, Jerry Lee Lewis-style rock and roll? ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/15 "2025-01-03T16:50:12Z")
So I’m guessing that professional singers with any sort of self-awareness will know what they should or shouldn’t try to take on. And of course - for the listener - it’s a matter of personal taste. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanubv.2/32/3260_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/16 "2025-01-03T16:55:56Z")
I think Celine Dion covering AC/DC may have been a misstep ---
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/17 "2025-01-03T17:37:16Z")
Here’s Yuja Wang, one of the finest living classical concert pianists, dipping her [toes into jazz](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sr9mwqHyvGs). I don’t think there’s anything she can’t play insanely well. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/18 "2025-01-03T21:11:05Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](#): > > I think Celine Dion covering AC/DC may have been a misstep Also Pat Boone trying on heavy metal. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/19 "2025-01-03T21:27:37Z")
> [@Tibby](#): > > Here’s Yuja Wang, one of the finest living classical concert pianists, dipping her [toes into jazz](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sr9mwqHyvGs). I don’t think there’s anything she can’t play insanely well. If we are mentioning instrumentalists you can’t leave out Wynton Marsalis. He’s the only musician to win a Grammy in the classical and jazz categories in the same year. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2025, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502/20 "2025-01-03T22:46:05Z")
As a counterpoint - Jose Carreras and Kiri Te Kanawa do “West Side Story.” [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/74UmUhAsMgM/hqdefault.jpg "West Side Story - Tonight (Te Kanawa/Carreras)") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74UmUhAsMgM) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-singers-know-when-they-shouldnt/1012502.md?page=2)