# Do US sports fans ever regret the absence of international competition? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [November 21, 2009, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419 "2009-11-21T17:27:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Todderbob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e47774/32.png) [@Todderbob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Todderbob)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/41 "2009-11-22T00:48:40Z")
Our sports are only national because the USA is treated as a single nation, if you break it down by State, they’re essentially international… California is more or less a different country from Ohio, sharing a Language, Passport and Monetary system. Treat the USA like the EU, with a closer cultural background, and you’ll start to see why our National Leagues are a lot like other countries International ones. ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/42 "2009-11-22T00:49:20Z")
> [@Lamar\_Mundane](#): > > Wow, what a non-sequitor. Overcompensate much? No compensation necessary unless you are referring to the size of my wiener. I want to see a surgeon about augmentation but that is neither here nor there. Be that as it may, I do think what I said is true about about the average American’s lack of interest in international sports. We have the NFL, NBA, MBL, NHL along with lots of college sports franchises on their own. Not even the most avid sports span has enough time to follow all of those let alone add any others. American football even at the college level is extremely big business with millions of fans. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/43 "2009-11-22T00:57:37Z")
To answer the OP: since Americans hate sports we cannot dominate, and since watching your national team dominate other teams on a regular basis isn’t really that much fun, we just don’t really miss it. As evidence, please note that there are plenty of chances for us to watch international competition in our major sports (other than, of course, American Football), and we usually eschew those chances. Yeah, we get a little jazzed over the basketball team during the Olympics, but NOTHING like how other countries get about, say, the World Cup, or team handball (imagine our whole country acting like it was Philadelphia after a Phillies win in the World Series :eek: :eek: :eek:). But, as people have pointed out, for a country that spans 3000 miles from one end to the other, and 1500+ miles top to bottom to get all worked up about any one thing takes something really, really special. Now, you want your RIVALARIES, I just attended a party today where 50 people all got together to eat, drink, nosh, yak, wear scarlet and grey, and generally have a good time. Oh, and they watched THE Ohio State University stomp on the Maize and Blue again. As did probably several MILLION people in the state of Ohio and even a few million up in Michigan. That sort of rivalry, which will be played out several times during the next couple weeks ('Bama v Auburn, Florida v Florida St., Cal v Stanford, Clemson v South Carolina, etc., etc., etc.) is roughly the equivalent of the national rivalries you are thinking about. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Todderbob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e47774/32.png) [@Todderbob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Todderbob)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/44 "2009-11-22T01:17:08Z")
> [@dsyoungesq](#): > > now, you want your rivalaries, i just attended a party today where 50 people all got together to eat, drink, nosh, yak, wear scarlet and grey, and generally have a good time. > Oh, and they watched the ohio state university stomp on the maize and blue again. As did probably several million people in the state of ohio and even a few million up in michigan. That sort of rivalry, which will be played out several times during the next couple weeks ('bama v auburn, florida v florida st., cal v stanford, clemson v south carolina, etc., etc., etc.) is roughly the equivalent of the national rivalries you are thinking about. 😉 **Go Bucks!** Michigan Sucks! The entire state of Ohio **STOPS** during the OSU-Michigan game, and holds its collective breath until the final moments. It really sucks for the Michigan coach, they need someone better so after we knock 'em down it doesn’t look pitiful. The 6th grader beating on the 1st grader is just sad, nothing to be proud of. ☹ And on that note… O-H ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/45 "2009-11-22T01:21:49Z")
> [@DSYoungEsq](#): > > But, as people have pointed out, for a country that spans 3000 miles from one end to the other, and 1500+ miles top to bottom to get all worked up about any one thing takes something really, really special. Frankly, I think this is nonsense. I can think of examples of countries that rival the US both in size and in population that can get pretty worked up over the performances of the national team. I’m pretty sure that a lot of people in India care about how the national cricket side is doing, I’m fairly sure that people in Brazil (nearly the same size as the US, with 190 million people living there) will go bonkers when the national football side is playing in South Africa and I know for a fact that people all over Russia (which is much larger than the US) were pissed off when Slovenia prevented them from going to the World Championships earlier this week. ---
**Author:** ![FordTaurusSHO94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f07891/32.png) [@FordTaurusSHO94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordTaurusSHO94)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 8:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/46 "2009-11-22T08:01:41Z")
Racing is a bit different. If you want to race at the top stockcar level, you want to come to America and race in NASCAR. If you want to race in the top open wheel series, you want to go to Europe and race in Formula 1. ---
**Author:** ![chowder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/977dab/32.png) [@chowder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chowder)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/47 "2009-11-22T09:15:08Z")
> [@Kyla](#): > > About as much as baseball is played in the UK. I’ll have you know that most of our girls schools play rounders ---
**Author:** ![footballisplayedwithyourfeet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/9f8e36/32.png) [@footballisplayedwithyourfeet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/footballisplayedwithyourfeet)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/48 "2009-11-22T12:10:04Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > One of the major problems in the U.S. is that soccer is considered a little femme beyond high school. That isn’t a value judgment, it is just a kids game in our mind and not something that is to be valued above the adolescent level. American super-star athletes are freaks of nature and tend to be huge and aggressive. > > Soccer simply isn’t violent enough and is too low scoring to hold most American viewers interests plus the TV production value is horrible. American NFL players, even those over 300 pounds can outrun me in the blink of an eye and crush my head with one hand. A lot of New England Patriots players live around where I do and it is obvious when you run into them in the Home Depot (which oddly is where I usually see them). Tom Brady used to live directly across the street from my in-laws. He is one huge and talented man. They are unusually large and gifted athletes and you can figure it out on your own just looking at them even if it weren’t for the gold chains around their necks and the custom license plates on their Mercedes-Benz. > > I hate to say it but international soccer players always strike me as someone that could make a good living whoring it up on the streets of San Fransisco just by their looks alone. I am happy that other countries find that type of thing appealing but it simply won’t work in the U.S. I am not even sure if it is a really well designed game either. It is all cultural. Ok, if this is your opinion of football (see what I did there:)), that’s fine. It wasn’t really the point I tried to make. I just wanted to make clear what this different ‘dimension’ is that we are talking about; in Holland football is just the most obvious example. My post waas about the importance of the international aspect, not about football per se. I can see how regional rivalries can be a substitute for internatinal games, but also what **Svejk** said. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/49 "2009-11-22T13:23:40Z")
> [@chowder](#): > > I’ll have you know that most of our girls schools play rounders Just like little rich white girls play soccer, in America’s suburbs. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/50 "2009-11-22T13:26:41Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Just like little rich white girls play soccer, in America’s suburbs. This is an untrue comparison. Lots of kids play soccer in America, even in high school. Most high schools now sport soccer teams, both male and female, whether urban or rural, rich or poor. And soccer is the biggest participation sport for youth in the country. Of course, when we talk about American youth soccer, you might not recognize the game if you’ve lived outside the US. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/51 "2009-11-22T14:56:11Z")
> [@Todderbob](#): > > Our sports are only national because the USA is treated as a single nation, if you break it down by State, they’re essentially international… California is more or less a different country from Ohio, sharing a Language, Passport and Monetary system. > > Treat the USA like the EU, with a closer cultural background, and you’ll start to see why our National Leagues are a lot like other countries International ones. I think your inter-state competitions are roughly analagous to international _club-level_ sports elsewhere, but not to contests between national teams. There is no California “national” football team or baseball team per se. You have city teams that are popular in certain regions, sure, and in some states college-level teams that pretty much the whole state can get behind, but you never get to see California vs. Ohio contests between the very best players in the sport from those states. ---
**Author:** ![Neptunian\_Slug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce7236/32.png) [@Neptunian\_Slug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neptunian_Slug)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/52 "2009-11-22T15:23:45Z")
> [@Todderbob](#): > > **Go Bucks!** > > Michigan Sucks! > The entire state of Ohio **STOPS** during the OSU-Michigan game, and holds its collective breath until the final moments. It really sucks for the Michigan coach, they need someone better so after we knock 'em down it doesn’t look pitiful. The 6th grader beating on the 1st grader is just sad, nothing to be proud of. ☹ > And on that note… > > O-H I-O! ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/53 "2009-11-22T17:59:09Z")
> [@Ximenean](#): > > I’m not talking about the Olympics-- in the major team sports, the Olympics are just a sideshow. Not to a Canadian hockey fan. The country’s going to grind to a halt during Olympic hockey games. [QUOTE=Svejk] and I know for a fact that people all over Russia (which is much larger than the US)… [/QUOTE] Russia is physically a larger country, but has less than half the population. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/54 "2009-11-22T19:54:34Z")
Well I know that - and I never said that Russia has a larger population. But **DSYoungEsq** was referring to size in particular, not to population. To be sure, though, if you carefully read my post you’ll see that I’ve included examples of countries that exceed the US population as well as examples that exceed the US in size. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/55 "2009-11-22T20:07:44Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Who says “our” sports DON’T have international competition? There are lots of great Japanese, Korean, Mexican, Dominican, Chinese, and Cuban players in Major League Baseball. > > There are lots of Germans, Spaniards, Russians, Chinese, Argentinians, Italians, Serbs and Nigerians playing in the National Basketball Association. That’s not “international competition”. There are about three Germans, three Argentines, three Spaniards and three Chinese in the NBA. There are a decent number of Eastern European players but certainly no more than 20, and probably 15 of them are Serbians. There are lots of foreigners playing in Major League Baseball but they’re almost to a man Carribean, Venezuelan, Japanese or Korean. > [@](#): > > Racing is a bit different. If you want to race at the top stockcar level, you want to come to America and race in NASCAR. If you want to race in the top open wheel series, you want to go to Europe and race in Formula 1. Hardly. There are, what… three foreign-born NASCAR drivers? Most top-flight drivers who want to try their hand at driving “stock” cars go to the German DTM, British Touring Car series or endurance racing. ETA: The truth is Americans don’t care about international competition because they assume they’d win anyway. That may be true, to some extent- but obviously it’s a pretty limiting philosophy. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/56 "2009-11-22T20:13:05Z")
> [@Todderbob](#): > > **Go Bucks!** > > Michigan Sucks! > The entire state of Ohio **STOPS** during the OSU-Michigan game, and holds its collective breath until the final moments. It really sucks for the Michigan coach, they need someone better so after we knock 'em down it doesn’t look pitiful. The 6th grader beating on the 1st grader is just sad, nothing to be proud of. ☹ > And on that note… > > O-H Is Ohio still a state? I thought that was remedied. ---
**Author:** ![Justin\_Bailey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/justin_bailey/32/8792_2.png) [@Justin\_Bailey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Justin_Bailey)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/57 "2009-11-22T20:14:19Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > There are about three Germans, three Argentines, three Spaniards and three Chinese in the NBA. There are a decent number of Eastern European players but certainly no more than 20, and probably 15 of them are Serbians. > > There are lots of foreigners playing in Major League Baseball but they’re almost to a man Carribean, Venezuelan, Japanese or Korean. While true, the point remains, baseketball, baseball and hockey are played all over the world. If you could somehow poll the entire world with the question “What sports do you play/follow” I’d put any of them against soccer and well beyond rugby, the sport that inspired the OP. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 8:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/58 "2009-11-22T20:51:25Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > While true, the point remains, baseketball, baseball and hockey are played all over the world. > > If you could somehow poll the entire world with the question “What sports do you play/follow” I’d put any of them against soccer and well beyond rugby, the sport that inspired the OP. I would be absolutely shocked if hockey had a tenth the popularity of soccer. There is only one country on earth, Canada, where hockey is more popular than soccer. As as much as I love baseball, it wouldn’t measure up either. It’s very popular indeed, much more so than hockey, but not at the level of soccer. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/59 "2009-11-22T21:06:11Z")
> [@Justin\_Bailey](#): > > While true, the point remains, baseketball, baseball and hockey are played all over the world. > > If you could somehow poll the entire world with the question “What sports do you play/follow” I’d put any of them against soccer and well beyond rugby, the sport that inspired the OP. Then you are deluded. Basketball admittedly gets a boost in pure numeric terms because it’s suddenly so popular in China, and that might put it ahead of rugby, but no major US sport is even in the same discussion as soccer. If you polled countries, rather than individuals, the gap would be even greater. ---
**Author:** ![FordTaurusSHO94](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/f07891/32.png) [@FordTaurusSHO94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordTaurusSHO94)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2009, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419/60 "2009-11-22T21:19:25Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Hardly. There are, what… three foreign-born NASCAR drivers? Most top-flight drivers who want to try their hand at driving “stock” cars go to the German DTM, British Touring Car series or endurance racing. There are several foreign-born drivers in the top 3 NASCAR series and even more in the Corona Series. Most “top-flight” drivers who want to drive a stockcar want to be in NASCAR. Even F1 drivers are starting to come into NASCAR. If you mean stock, as in actual production cars, then NASCAR is obviously not the series to try your hand at. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-us-sports-fans-ever-regret-the-absence-of-international-competition/518419.md?page=4)