# Do very nice steakhouses actually have temps like "med. rare plus"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 13, 2009, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120 "2009-12-13T18:14:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 6:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/121 "2009-12-17T06:24:31Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > And frankly your bullshit patronizing is just a tad overdone, **Labiador Conceiver**. > [@devilsknew](#): > > I feel for ya. For me, this is like trying to carry on a conversation with a syphilitic sociopath that has contracted rabies. > [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > None of my posts are half as snotty or condescending as the idiocy contained within posts number 60 & 74. > [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > It’s like carrying on a conversation with a narcoleptic amnesiac. None of these posts are appropriate for this forum, so I’m formally warning **devilsknew** and **Labrador Deceiver**. Everybody else is advised to be civil. Thank you. ---
**Author:** ![tr0psn4j](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@tr0psn4j](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tr0psn4j)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/122 "2009-12-17T07:18:53Z")
The first time I had a rare steak was at Outback Steakhouse. Man, that was horrible. But I tried it again at home and it is by far the best way to eat a steak. I’m not sure I can handle eating a blue steak though. That’s getting to be pretty raw. ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2009, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/123 "2009-12-17T07:27:12Z")
> [@Notassmartasithought](#): > > Rex Goliath, I think your notion of a $26 NY strip at a top end steakhouse is probably way low. This from the menu from Craftsteak, the restaurant of Tom Collichio, the head judge of “Top Chef.” “Prime New York Strip 18 oz., 28-Day, C.A.B., NE 50.” That’s a $50 NY strip. I’ll take bets the Porterhouse at Peter Luger is more; the price isn’t listed on the web. > . Price doesn’t necessarily carry over nor is representative of the quality, it’s representative of cache’. I was selling $26 kosher aged and marinated filet 16 years ago because we were the best restaurant with a name. What does that say about the market, what does that say about inflation? It says very little about the actual steak. I have had excellent dry aged steaks at run of the mill, medium level, steakhouses in the $20-$30 range and I guarantee they were every bit as good as Craftsteak. ---
**Author:** ![Rex\_Goliath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bcef8e/32.png) [@Rex\_Goliath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rex_Goliath)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/124 "2009-12-18T18:48:04Z")
> [@Notassmartasithought](#): > > Rex Goliath, I think your notion of a $26 NY strip at a top end steakhouse is probably way low. It would be, if that’s what I had written. Fortunately, I acknowledged it as a very good steakhouse, rather than top tier. Fortunately, this entire thread was predicated on the notion that I had _not_ worked in a “top end” steakhouse, only a very good one. Also, $26-28 for a strip in College Town, Alabama is a hell of a lot more expensive than a $28 strip in New York City. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/125 "2009-12-18T18:55:19Z")
> [@devilsknew](#): > > Price doesn’t necessarily carry over nor is representative of the quality, it’s representative of cache’. Nitpick: _cachet_. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/126 "2009-12-18T21:39:53Z")
> [@Notassmartasithought](#): > > On the other hand, when I find a steakhouse that has steak tartare on the menu, or will do if for me if I ask, and I do, that’s what I’ll order. 1/3 lb., raw and lean, chilled, chopped fine, with onion, egg yolk, capers, brandy, worchestershire, salt and pepper, in descending order. But equal parts egg yolk, capers, and brandy, and much less of the last two. Served on toast points, with hash browns and asparagus hollandaise. Its really rich, so you won’t eat nearly as much meat as you usually do. This is what we used to have for dinner on New Year’s Day. My grandmother called it _Gehacktesfleisch_. Fantastic stuff. Dang, now I’m hungry. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/127 "2009-12-18T21:58:48Z")
> [@](#): > > On the other hand, when I find a steakhouse that has steak tartare on the menu, or will do if for me if I ask, and I do, that’s what I’ll order. 1/3 lb., raw and lean, chilled, chopped fine, with onion, egg yolk, capers, brandy, worchestershire, salt and pepper, in descending order. But equal parts egg yolk, capers, and brandy, and much less of the last two. Served on toast points, with hash browns and asparagus hollandaise. Its really rich, so you won’t eat nearly as much meat as you usually do. Another nitpick: _Worcestershire_ sauce. Pronounced _wooster-shurr_. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/128 "2009-12-18T22:52:28Z")
> [@Notassmartasithought](#): > > On the other hand, when I find a steakhouse that has steak tartare on the menu, or will do if for me if I ask, and I do, that’s what I’ll order. 1/3 lb., raw and lean, chilled, chopped fine, with onion, egg yolk, capers, brandy, worchestershire, salt and pepper, in descending order. But equal parts egg yolk, capers, and brandy, and much less of the last two. Served on toast points, with hash browns and asparagus hollandaise. Its really rich, so you won’t eat nearly as much meat as you usually do. I think I know what I am making for dinner on sunday! Except for the hollandaise on the asparagus, I like mine with a little salt and lemon juice. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/129 "2009-12-18T22:58:51Z")
> [@WarmNPrickly](#): > > I also have to disagree with this. A well done steak is the most difficult steak to cook. Most steak house restaurants simply can’t take the time to do it. > > I say this as someone who wants his steak rare. Charred meat just plain grosses me out. Anecdotaly, most of the people I have met that want their meat well done, don’t like steak. It could be because they have never had a good steak. It could be because they would prefer a rare steak if they could just get over the squeamishness of red meat. Out of five times that I have tried, I have successfully produced one well done filet mignon that my wife kinda enjoyed. I knew in advance that that one was good. I’m one of those “Break the horns off, wipe his ass, and trot that sumbitch out here.” kind of guys that somebody was complaining about back on page one. In a good steakhouse I order blue, but in a middle of the road place like a Logan’s or Texas Roadhouse or similar places I have to emphasize the very devil out of my preferences and 9 times out of 10 it’s still too well done. I almost always just eat it, because you get what you get in those places. I’ve offered the server an extra $10 tip to split with the chef if they could bring a steak rare enough for me to send back. It has never happened. My wife eats hers well done. The only way I can prepare an acceptable steak for her is to start hers around 45 minutes before mine, cooking it low and slow in the oven, and then I toss it on the grill for a couple of minutes on a side with mine. Otherwise hers gets dry and hard on the outside before it’s done in the middle. You should try that with your wife’s steak. Either that, or butterfly the steak. Having a mixed marriage like that is a real hassle. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/130 "2009-12-18T23:15:57Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > My wife eats hers well done. The only way I can prepare an acceptable steak for her is to start hers around 45 minutes before mine, cooking it low and slow in the oven, and then I toss it on the grill for a couple of minutes on a side with mine. Otherwise hers gets dry and hard on the outside before it’s done in the middle. > > You should try that with your wife’s steak. Either that, or butterfly the steak. Having a mixed marriage like that is a real hassle. I am the rare steak person, my husband is the well stake person. Back when we lived in Virginia Beach there was a place called the Grate Steak, they had a salad bar, and you picked your piece of meat out of a rotating fridge and cooked it yourself on a huge grill in the middle of the dining room. I would go get my salad and start, he would throw a steak on. About the time I was finishing up my salad he would toss mine on, flip it once and bring it to the table with his. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bcef8e/32.png) [@The\_Man\_In\_Black](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Man_In_Black)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2009, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/131 "2009-12-18T23:22:50Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > That’s how most restaurants define Medium. > > Med Rare is red and warm > Rare is red and cool > Blue is red and cold Never heard of that before. Rare= warm red meat. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/132 "2009-12-19T01:39:12Z")
> [@The\_Man\_In\_Black](#): > > Never heard of that before. > > Rare= warm red meat. [Cite](http://www.ruthschrisdestin.com/doneness.htm) [Cite](http://www.kevinrathbunsteak.com/menuforkevinrathbunsteak.htm) [Cite](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperature_%28meat%29) ---
**Author:** ![devilsknew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4da419/32.png) [@devilsknew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/devilsknew)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/133 "2009-12-19T02:16:06Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > That’s my wife’s favorite way to have them. That’s pretty much my standard way to do them at home. It’s really easy (you can just use water), and you get a perfect texture. But probably my favorite fried egg is basted in bacon fat. Fried in a cast iron skillet, the white- bubbly, blistered, and emroidered in light brown, crunchy lace- The bright yolk flitted white by a flick of the wrist and a splash of hot Hickory Bacon Fat. Perfect to penetrate and sop with real wonderbread toast. The one thing the Europeans can’t claim for their bread… toast! We make better toast. The Europeans even buy our bread and prefer it for toast. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/134 "2009-12-19T06:18:30Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > [Cite](http://www.ruthschrisdestin.com/doneness.htm) > > [Cite](http://www.kevinrathbunsteak.com/menuforkevinrathbunsteak.htm) > > [Cite](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temperature_%28meat%29) From the Wikipedia cite, though, note the temperature range given for rare meat: > [@](#): > > 52–55°C 125–130°F That’s hardly “cold” - it’s what I and many other people would call “warm”. That should be the temperature at the center of the meat, not the outside. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/135 "2009-12-19T14:42:28Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > From the Wikipedia cite, though, note the temperature range given for rare meat: > > That’s hardly “cold” - it’s what I and many other people would call “warm”. That should be the temperature at the center of the meat, not the outside. I didn’t say “cold”. That is the description given for Blue in most steakhouses. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/136 "2009-12-19T18:22:26Z")
> [@Labrador\_Deceiver](#): > > I didn’t say “cold”. That is the description given for Blue in most steakhouses. No, but the Wikipedia page uses the word “cold”. Regardless of whether the word is “cold” or “cool” (the word you and your first two cites used), even as a cook I think that confuses people to the point where there are some people who think a rare steak is supposed to be lower than room temperature. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/137 "2009-12-19T19:20:07Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > No, but the Wikipedia page uses the word “cold”. Regardless of whether the word is “cold” or “cool” (the word you and your first two cites used), even as a cook I think that confuses people to the point where there are some people who think a rare steak is supposed to be lower than room temperature. I think high end steakhouses use those guidlines because their steaks are extraordinarily thick. While the majority of the interior of one of those steaks reaches a peak temp of 125, the very center is likely a good bit cooler. If you’re cooking a 3/4 inch steak, then it’s a bit easier to get a more uniform doneness/temperature throughout. A one pound steak is more like a mini roast. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/138 "2009-12-19T19:23:15Z")
deleted; Labrador can speak for himself. ---
**Author:** ![Labrador\_Deceiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7c8e57/32.png) [@Labrador\_Deceiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Labrador_Deceiver)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/139 "2009-12-19T19:34:47Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Labrador can speak for himself. Gah! Don’t assume anything when it comes to me. ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2009, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120/140 "2009-12-19T23:34:39Z")
Interestingly recent research indicates that the internal temperatures recommended for various degrees of doneness do not coincide with customers expectations. KSU did the research [here](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T6T-4P37JFX-2&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_searchStrId=1141673326&_rerunOrigin=google&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=25fc3b5326a77d3bb51c7a8b9e42f6cb) and again on the Meat Science site [this older study](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6T9G-3RHD3G4-8&_user=10&_rdoc=1&_fmt=&_orig=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_searchStrId=1141690662&_rerunOrigin=google&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=dc8f121522c5f83ff62dddedd272e337) indicates that 30% of people don’t get what they order in terms of doneness. [This report](http://digitalcommons.unl.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1172&context=rangebeefcowsymp) from the Beef Industry Council in part says : \*5. Degree of doneness did have an effect on customer satisfaction. For instance, the highest ratings were given to those steaks cooked Medium Rare or less. The affect of degree of doneness, however, was influenced by other factors. More than 80% of consumers in the study cooked their beef to a Medium degree of doneness or higher. Overall Like ratings in this study were not always directly related to degree of doneness. Top Loin Steaks cooked to Well Done, for example, had ratings similar to those cooked to Medium.\* So it looks as though what lots of people believe about cooking steaks is based on supposition rather than facts. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-very-nice-steakhouses-actually-have-temps-like-med-rare-plus/521120.md?page=6)