# Do we as citizens have a societal obligation to be productive?

**URL:** <https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-as-citizens-have-a-societal-obligation-to-be-productive/521660>\
**Category:** Great Debates\
**Created:** [December 17, 2009, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-as-citizens-have-a-societal-obligation-to-be-productive/521660 "2009-12-17T18:15:46Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 4\
**Page:** 4

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**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\
**Post date:** [December 31, 2009, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-as-citizens-have-a-societal-obligation-to-be-productive/521660/61 "2009-12-31T21:12:02Z")

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> [@Malthus](#):
>
> The heart-surgeon vs. game designer issue is an interesting one, because it contrasts doing something that is very important for one individual (saving his or her life, what could be more important?) with doing something only a little important for any particular individual, but that affects a lot of people (“playing a video game entertains me” multiplied by a million players).

Should we measure the productivity of the video game developer against the productivity that is lost as a result of his product?

> [@](#):
>
> I’d say it is difficult to measure, as our natural tendancy is to place an almost infinite value on an individual human life, so best rely on money as a very rough guide to do the measuring for us.

And yet it can’t be done that way. What if I give massages in a hospice for free while **msmith** sits in his window dressing department surfing the internet for $ 180,000 per year? Whose day was more productive? The guy who made a lot of money or the guy who made no money? And besides, what value to society overall does palliative care for those about to die have?

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**Author:** ![techno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/50afbb/32.png) [@techno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/techno)\
**Post date:** [January 1, 2010, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-as-citizens-have-a-societal-obligation-to-be-productive/521660/62 "2010-01-01T00:36:37Z")

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I think the question was not what constitutes productivity, but rather whether individuals are obligated to participate in society in a prescribed/approved manner.

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**Author:** ![Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/f04885/32.png) [@Qin\_Shi\_Huangdi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qin_Shi_Huangdi)\
**Post date:** [January 1, 2010, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-as-citizens-have-a-societal-obligation-to-be-productive/521660/63 "2010-01-01T02:52:07Z")

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Yes: “Ask not what your country can do for you, but what you can do for your country.” Citizens should produce and work hard to build the country’s economy and in wartime be conscripted if needed.

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**Author:** ![The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/9fc348/32.png) [@The\_Flying\_Dutchman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Flying_Dutchman)\
**Post date:** [January 1, 2010, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-as-citizens-have-a-societal-obligation-to-be-productive/521660/64 "2010-01-01T05:22:00Z")

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> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#):
>
> At what point would you say that people’s obligation to society ends, if at all?

We have an obligation to society to provide for ourselves, our offspring in their formative years and those we have contracted obligations with.

Beyond that,we have an obligation to the less fortunate in our society to share some of our surplus . We need to recognize that our chosen economic system which works for most of us is unable to provide the opportunity for everyone to participate in a satisfactory manner.

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