# Do we have less compassion for the poor? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 15, 2015, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707 "2015-02-15T06:33:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Macca26](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/13edae/32.png) [@Macca26](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Macca26)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/161 "2015-02-19T17:46:48Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Good heavens, no. She should go ahead and have unprotected sex, and the rest of us should be perfectly happy to support her and her offspring without complaint. > > That’s compassion. You could look it up! > > Regards, > Shodan You’re talking about an ideal and I’m talking about the real world. Teenagers make dumb decisions. Teenagers are pressured by peers. Teenagers are not communicated to well by their parents. She probably does not WANT to have unprotected sex, but “Micki told me you can’t get pregnant if you’re a virgin…and I love Tom a lot…and god, this rubbing feels good…he doesn’t want to use a condom because it feels bad but he wants me…shit, ok, ok, it’s ok, god this feels good LET’S DO IT I mean nobody else in class is pregnant right? And the girls are doing it, that’s what they tell me, and they’re not pregnant, so I’ll be OK…MMPFH YES!!” The way to be compassionate is realize wow, their parents and schools have failed in educating them on good choices and being prepared before they got into this high-pressure situation. That they ended up in this situation is not totally their own fault. Education and communication is key and we, as a society, have failed in these respects. Compassion at that point is understanding the damage is done, it is not reversible, and we need to do something now because they’re human beings. It would’ve been better to stop it before now, but we didn’t try hard enough. ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/162 "2015-02-19T17:50:42Z")
> [@Your\_Great\_Darsh\_Face](#): > > I think my compassion for the poor is still in working order (at least, I think so - it’s not easy for a Demon Prince to be sure), but I don’t have much compassion for bad argumentation. You got roundly spanked on your implication that many illegitimate children must surely be the product of rape, and on being shown the figures - that themselves appear to rely on an inflated rape-pregnancy statistic, which should have given you more of the benefit than you deserve - you start wildly flailing around appealing to emotion in the name of the ugly spectre of _paternal_ rape. > > Yes, it matters to the one person who is struggling to support the child that was forced on her by her own monstrous father, but you ought to have the intellectual honesty to concede that for every one of these there are orders of magnitude more who were perfectly capable of realizing that pregnancy is a common outcome of sex, that a 98% chance is not the same as a sure thing, and that you would not think it a good idea to cross the street if you had only a 98% chance of making it. > > Some of your post I’ll leave alone, because surely it’s not necessary that I disagree with _everything_ you say. Of course I would cross the street with a 98% chance of making it. I’m not going to quake in my house if I don’t have a 100% guarantee of safety at every turn. I’m afraid you don’t get what I am saying about pregnant teen rape victims. The specific number is irrelevant. You seem to believe that we should mentally dismiss these people unless there are enough to matter. I believe that they matter regardless of how few there are, AND that when you add up all of the people who practically anyone would agree are not at fault for their situation, it is not such a tiny number anyway. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/163 "2015-02-19T17:51:52Z")
> [@AnaMen](#): > > I didn’t say they were impossible to get. No, you said they were “barely even for sale”, which is demonstrably untrue. ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/164 "2015-02-19T17:57:18Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > No, you said they were “barely even for sale”, which is demonstrably untrue. I said they were “barely even for sale” because most places that sell regular condoms, like convenience stores, do not sell them. The reason they do not sell them is because people do not often want them. If people wanted them, they would be for sale in more places. So obviously, they do not. Get it? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/165 "2015-02-19T18:02:37Z")
If it were easy to not be poor, then no one would be poor. It’s easy for some people to not be poor – it was easy for me. It’s hard for some people to not be poor. There are tons and tons of reasons why this can be so. One person’s experience does not translate to everyone’s experience. ---
**Author:** ![Tuxie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ee59a6/32.png) [@Tuxie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuxie)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/166 "2015-02-19T18:18:12Z")
> [@AnaMen](#): > > When you are surviving where you are, you still have something to lose. When you aren’t (you’re still _alive_ obviously, but your situation is untenable), there is a certain freedom. Once you’ve been stripped of your possessions, you don’t have to cart them around anymore. Once you’re sleeping under a bridge, any bridge will do. Once you’ve lost all of your friends, you might as well live near any set of strangers. That doesn’t mean you’re doing yourself any favors by jettisoning any of the above, obviously, but if they are gone, you must live by your wits as that’s all you’ve got left. > > Some people can’t though. You say you “see” immigrants that have surmounted these obstacles, but aren’t they the survivors? Don’t assume they are a random sampling. Picking up and leaving your country is risky and if it goes poorly and they are victims of sex trafficking, etc. it would seem they had made a mistake and some other decision could have worked out well for them. Sure, but there are millions of people that immigrate to the US. Far too many to all be outliers. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/167 "2015-02-19T18:29:18Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > If it were easy to not be poor, then no one would be poor. If it were easy not to be poor, then most people would not be poor. And indeed, in the US, where it is easy not to be poor, most people aren’t poor and most poor people don’t stay poor forever. > [@](#): > > It’s hard for some people to not be poor. Yes, because some people are stupid. > [@](#): > > There are tons and tons of reasons why this can be so. Sure. But if one of the reasons is “I am embarassed to ask the pharmacist for a female condom and my boyfriend won’t wear a regular condom and I don’t know how to go to Wal-Mart and get a prepaid debit card so I can order one off the Internet so I will go ahead and have unprotected sex and so the taxpayer should support me and my children because my boyfriend talks to his child once a week on the telephone” is not one of the reasons that tends to cause the heart to melt with compassion. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/168 "2015-02-19T18:53:15Z")
> [@Tuxie](#): > > Sure, but there are millions of people that immigrate to the US. Far too many to all be outliers. Of course they are outliers. When and where is it the norm to move to a particular different country? Historically, maybe sometimes, but typically this is not the case. The mere act of succeeding and surviving such a move already weeds out the least competent, assuming the move was voluntary. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/169 "2015-02-19T19:17:43Z")
> [@AnaMen](#): > > I said they were “barely even for sale” because most places that sell regular condoms, like convenience stores, do not sell them. Eww, who buys condoms at a convenience store? When I think of convenience stores, I think of gasoline, cigarettes, and beer. Maybe a newspaper or a soda during a road trip. But an intimate personal item like a condom? Eww. ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/170 "2015-02-19T20:47:43Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Eww, who buys condoms at a convenience store? When I think of convenience stores, I think of gasoline, cigarettes, and beer. Maybe a newspaper or a soda during a road trip. But an intimate personal item like a condom? Eww. Eww, you aren’t putting that convenience store soda into your personal mouth hole and getting it all inside your digestive tract are you? You’ll probably even let some of the sugars incorporate themselves right into your body. Talk about intimate and disgusting! ---
**Author:** ![Tuxie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ee59a6/32.png) [@Tuxie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuxie)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/171 "2015-02-19T21:00:04Z")
> [@AnaMen](#): > > Of course they are outliers. When and where is it the norm to move to a particular different country? Historically, maybe sometimes, but typically this is not the case. The mere act of succeeding and surviving such a move already weeds out the least competent, assuming the move was voluntary. So you’re implying a poor person who can’t relocate is somehow incompetent? Way to show compassion for the poor, AnaMen :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 9:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/172 "2015-02-19T21:11:38Z")
> [@AnaMen](#): > > Eww, you aren’t putting that convenience store soda into your personal mouth hole and getting it all inside your digestive tract are you? You’ll probably even let some of the sugars incorporate themselves right into your body. Talk about intimate and disgusting! As soon as I typed “soda”, I knew you’d come back with something like that. Seriously, though, who buys things like health care items in a convenience store? They have a limited selection of overpriced items in whatever categories they happen to carry. Why not go to the pharmacy across the street? I wouldn’t buy meds or saline solution at a convenience store, either. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/173 "2015-02-19T21:18:14Z")
> [@Macca26](#): > > You’re talking about an ideal and I’m talking about the real world. Teenagers make dumb decisions. Teenagers are pressured by peers. Teenagers are not communicated to well by their parents. She probably does not WANT to have unprotected sex, but “Micki told me you can’t get pregnant if you’re a virgin…and I love Tom a lot…and god, this rubbing feels good…he doesn’t want to use a condom because it feels bad but he wants me…shit, ok, ok, it’s ok, god this feels good LET’S DO IT I mean nobody else in class is pregnant right? And the girls are doing it, that’s what they tell me, and they’re not pregnant, so I’ll be OK…MMPFH YES!!” Teenagers also believe in fairy tales. She may imagine the first boy she has sex is The One. Maybe she’s not really in love with him, but what “him” represents. Marriage, stability, family. Being “important” in her community. Maybe she says “yes” when he asks for sex because she thinks saying “yes” will take her that much closer to the life she’s always aspired to have. Saying “no” will take her farther way from that. A loser with no “man”, no future. If she ends up pregnant, she imagines that OF COURSE he’ll want to keep the baby. Because he’s The One, and that’s what The One would want. And she’ll keep that baby just in case he changes his mind and comes back. When her brain finally matures, she’ll realize it was all a childish fantasy. But when you’re 15, you don’t know. You don’t know anything. ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/174 "2015-02-19T21:27:53Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > As soon as I typed “soda”, I knew you’d come back with something like that. > > Seriously, though, who buys things like health care items in a convenience store? > They have a limited selection of overpriced items in whatever categories they happen to carry. Why not go to the pharmacy across the street? I wouldn’t buy meds or saline solution at a convenience store, either. You must live in a city, where that might indeed be the case. Many people don’t live particularly close to pharmacies. That’s why it’s such a problem when a Walmart pushes out smaller pharmacies and then lets their pharmacists refuse to sell birth control prescriptions. Often the next-closest non-Walmart pharmacy is a significant distance away. The condoms, saline solution, etc. at the convenience store are sealed in sterile packaging. They are perfectly safe and non-gross to buy there, if a bit overpriced, plus the convenience store is generally open longer hours. Better to pay a bit more for the condom you can conveniently buy than pay 18 years of child support. ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/175 "2015-02-19T21:39:50Z")
> [@Tuxie](#): > > So you’re implying a poor person who can’t relocate is somehow incompetent? Way to show compassion for the poor, AnaMen :rolleyes: Incompetent is a descriptor, not an insult. Why would I not feel compassion for someone because they were not competent at something? There are also people with very low intelligence. They can’t figure out how to solve problems even when the solutions seem obvious. Sometimes they have a named intellectual disability of some sort, sometimes no one has bothered to officially label them. Either way, I feel compassion for them too. Am I supposed to reserve compassion for bright able hapless victims of circumstance? ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/176 "2015-02-19T21:45:35Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > Teenagers also believe in fairy tales. She may imagine the first boy she has sex is The One. Maybe she’s not really in love with him, but what “him” represents. Marriage, stability, family. Being “important” in her community. Maybe she says “yes” when he asks for sex because she thinks saying “yes” will take her that much closer to the life she’s always aspired to have. Saying “no” will take her farther way from that. A loser with no “man”, no future. > > If she ends up pregnant, she imagines that OF COURSE he’ll want to keep the baby. Because he’s The One, and that’s what The One would want. And she’ll keep that baby just in case he changes his mind and comes back. When her brain finally matures, she’ll realize it was all a childish fantasy. But when you’re 15, you don’t know. You don’t know anything. It’s pretty normal to want to keep the baby you just gestated for nine months, regardless of whether you are a dumb teenager and think it will bring back your boyfriend. ---
**Author:** ![LavenderBlue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e95f7d/32.png) [@LavenderBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LavenderBlue)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/177 "2015-02-19T22:01:45Z")
My little bro is poor. He’s poor because he’s lazy and stupid. He’s 40 and he sponges off my father, paying a token rent of about a hundred bucks a month. My late mom used to complain about what a lazy brat he was. Our last conversation was how he broke her dishwasher, trashed her car and had been out of work for nearly two years. Since then, he’s managed mostly menial jobs that pay little more than minimum wage. I know he doesn’t do much housework as my dad complained to me that he had to hire a maid. Bro sent me an email last month whining about how mean my dad is to him. Over the years I’ve tried to help him. I’ve send him lists of jobs he can do online complete with detailed instructions as to how to apply, pay rates, who to contact and what the work entails. Most of those jobs paid at least ten bucks an hour. Not much but then his expenses are minimal. He could have easily taken several of them and cobbled together a decent living that would pay for all of his expenses. At one point, I spent more than a week searching for a two bedroom apartment that he could buy where he lives now. I offered to provide the down payment as long as he agreed to pay me back when he sold it later on. All he had to do was find the right place and agree to pay any maintenance costs. He was free to stay there. Most of the places he looked at had costs under three hundred dollars a month including utilities, costs that could easily be captured by renting out the second bedroom to any one of his friends. Of course he didn’t take me up on the offer. So I guess my compassion for my poor bro is out the window. He’s stupid, nasty, lazy and arrogant. He’s a sexist fuck who likes to explain why the PUA movement has the right idea and why I was wrong to marry someone who isn’t Jewish. The best I can say for him is that he’s at least unmarried and has not fathered any kids. If he shows up on my door once my dad dies, I will offer him a place to sleep. But I fail to see where anyone owes him anything else. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/178 "2015-02-19T22:24:17Z")
> [@AnaMen](#): > > You must live in a city, where that might indeed be the case. Most people live in an urban area, as in 82%. [https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html) > [@](#): > > They are perfectly safe and non-gross to buy there, if a bit overpriced, plus the convenience store is generally open longer hours. Most poor people have a lot of time on their hands, so longer store hours don’t really matter. > [@](#): > > Better to pay a bit more for the condom you can conveniently buy than pay 18 years of child support. Even better is to keep it in your pants. Most teenagers aren’t parents. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/179 "2015-02-19T22:30:14Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > If it were easy to not be poor, then no one would be poor. It’s easy for some people to not be poor – it was easy for me. It’s hard for some people to not be poor. There are tons and tons of reasons why this can be so. One person’s experience does not translate to everyone’s experience. To give another example, it is very easy not to be poor in Qatar. It is not at all easy not to be poor in Somalia. ---
**Author:** ![AnaMen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dfb087/32.png) [@AnaMen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AnaMen)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2015, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707/180 "2015-02-19T22:40:40Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Most people live in an urban area, as in 82%. > > [https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html](https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/us.html) > > Most poor people have a lot of time on their hands, so longer store hours don’t really matter. > > Even better is to keep it in your pants. Most teenagers aren’t parents. Teen pregnancy rates are a third higher in rural areas. [http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/02/22/1626061/teen-pregnancy-rural/](http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/02/22/1626061/teen-pregnancy-rural/) Most poor people have 24 hours per day, like everyone else. The time just goes by slower when you’re poor, so it seems like there’s more of it. Most teenagers are not parents, but most people do have sex as teens. There is nothing better about not having sex as a teen. You probably missed/are missing out on a lot of great sex. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-we-have-less-compassion-for-the-poor/712707.md?page=10)