# Do you consider Asians to be "people of color"? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 7, 2018, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477 "2018-07-07T15:44:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2018, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/81 "2018-07-09T17:54:44Z")
I’m a white guy with vitiligo. I think all-y’all are people of color. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2018, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/82 "2018-07-09T18:25:37Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > But anyone who says “Asians are people of color” isn’t taking into account all that Asia actually is. Most Asians probably do qualify, but a good many do not. I am wondering if folks who feel ok lumping the recent descendents of Africans under the “people of color” umbrella manage to intuitively grok that European Africans are not included in this description. All this time I have assumed that this is universally understood, but maybe I am wrong. Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2018, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/83 "2018-07-09T18:31:01Z")
To me the shocking, yet unsurprising, revelation in this thread was **Darren Garrison** ’s link describing how the Jewish quota, or, more accurately, non-WASP quota at American Ivy League universities has never gone away. Unfortunately, according to the article, the descriptions of Asian applicants in the discovered documents have been redacted, so we don’t know if the wording includes the phrase “people of colour”. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2018, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/84 "2018-07-09T19:06:49Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > WAPs do; immigrants who don’t themselves qualify as WAPs don’t. White, sole-Anglophone, Protestant is definitely a distinct culture; you guys tend to view anybody else as “different from the norm” without realizing what is it you’re thinking of as “the norm”. You guys? Who’s you guys? And I don’t know where “Protestant” came into this, but “WASP” is more of a social class in this country than an ethnic group. There might still be enclaves of old-money “blue blood” people on the East Coast who are very serious about being of old English stock and members of religions like Episcopalianism, who have property in that region which goes back a very long time and whose family names carry much social cachet. But these people have very little in common with Dutch Reformed people in Grand Rapids, Michigan, or Scandinavian-Americans in Minnesota. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2018, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/85 "2018-07-09T20:29:30Z")
The key question is “Do they reflect light?”. All people who reflect any amount of light are “people of color”, the only question then being “What shade and saturation of color did genetics pass on to them?”. Only those people who absorb all light and reflect none, making them invisible to the naked eye, are the ones who cannot accurately be described as “people of color”. That answer is only semi-facetious. “People of color” is a human construct and means different things to different people when, in and of itself, it actually means nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2018, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/86 "2018-07-09T23:09:20Z")
> [@Brayne\_Ded](#): > > Are you deliberately misunderstanding? In WW2 the US interned people of Japanese ancestry, not Asians in general, and the Japanese interned European civilians (mainly Dutch, British and Australian). The Japanese also imprisoned the natives of the Asian countries of the countries they conquered. 'Nuff said about the treatment they got. I thought my second post had adequately explained whatever might have been misunderstood from my first post, but I guess I was wrong, so please indulge me while I try again. In World War II, The U.S. and Canadian government ordered Japanese immigrants as well as American citizens of Japanese descent interned. They did not do the same for German immigrants or German-Americans (despite the fact that there was a well organized [German American Bund](https://www.theatlantic.com/photo/2017/06/american-nazis-in-the-1930sthe-german-american-bund/529185/) before the war) or for Italian immigrants and Italian-Americans. On top of the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882, the Immigration Act of 1917, and various other exclusions which weren’t repealed until 1952, Asian-Americans in general, and Japanese-Americans in particular, felt they were discriminated against because of their race. Does that level of discrimination exist in the U.S. today? No. Do many Asian-Americans still have a feeling of “otherness” compared to whites? Yes. Does that mean Asian-Americans self-identify as “people of color”? Some don’t, many do. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2018, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/87 "2018-07-10T13:27:23Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > You guys? Who’s you guys? And I don’t know where “Protestant” came into this, but “WASP” is more of a social class in this country than an ethnic group. There might still be enclaves of old-money “blue blood” people on the East Coast who are very serious about being of old English stock and members of religions like Episcopalianism, who have property in that region which goes back a very long time and whose family names carry much social cachet. But these people have very little in common with Dutch Reformed people in Grand Rapids, Michigan, or Scandinavian-Americans in Minnesota. More or less in order: “You guys” is Americans. Protestant came into this both via the WASP expression and because we (where “we” is a bunch of foreigners trying to come up with an accurate label for a specific cultural group) found it to be a necessary part of the description: Catholics, Jews, Buddhists… were not part of that cultural group, did not display those specific behaviors. And what I’m saying is that those people who you think have very little in common do in fact have a lot in common. Mainly, that both WAPs and non-WAP-Americans consider WAPs to be the Default American; the people in that group never begin an anecdote or a conversation with the equivalent of “I’m Jewish”, “I’m Irish” or “I’m Chinese” (-American in all three cases); if they mention religion it’s in a religious (actual discussion of religion, attempts to convert you) or social context (“what church do you attend?”), not as a shorthand for cultural traits which are considered minoritary enough that they can’t be taken for granted. Also, and this is something which applies to anybody who considers himself or his culture to be The Norm (not just WAPs), they tend to be really bad at meeting outsiders halfway. By definition of “norm”, it is everybody else who has to adapt. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2018, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/88 "2018-07-10T13:39:55Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > More or less in order: > “You guys” is Americans. > > Protestant came into this both via the WASP expression and because we (where “we” is a bunch of foreigners trying to come up with an accurate label for a specific cultural group) found it to be a necessary part of the description: Catholics, Jews, Buddhists… were not part of that cultural group, did not display those specific behaviors. > > And what I’m saying is that those people who you think have very little in common do in fact have a lot in common. Mainly, that both WAPs and non-WAP-Americans consider WAPs to be the Default American; the people in that group never begin an anecdote or a conversation with the equivalent of “I’m Jewish”, “I’m Irish” or “I’m Chinese” (-American in all three cases); if they mention religion it’s in a religious (actual discussion of religion, attempts to convert you) or social context (“what church do you attend?”), not as a shorthand for cultural traits which are considered minoritary enough that they can’t be taken for granted. Also, and this is something which applies to anybody who considers himself or his culture to be The Norm (not just WAPs), they tend to be really bad at meeting outsiders halfway. By definition of “norm”, it is everybody else who has to adapt. Thanks for Spainsplaining our own culture to us. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2018, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/89 "2018-07-10T13:45:02Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > You guys? Who’s you guys? And I don’t know where “Protestant” came into this, but “WASP” is more of a social class in this country than an ethnic group. There might still be enclaves of old-money “blue blood” people on the East Coast who are very serious about being of old English stock and members of religions like Episcopalianism, who have property in that region which goes back a very long time and whose family names carry much social cachet. But these people have very little in common with Dutch Reformed people in Grand Rapids, Michigan, or Scandinavian-Americans in Minnesota. Both groups actually have plenty in common with each other. It’s true that there are differences between the two groups- but there are differences based on social class and location among Jews and Catholics and Muslims etc as well. It may be that you don’t notice the commonalities because of your specific circumstances - where and when I grew up, an German Catholic marrying an Italian Catholic was practically considered a mixed marriage, but I’m sure the Protestants couldn’t understand the fuss- after all, they’re both Catholic. But the Protestants most likely only saw the commonalities while the Catholics mostly saw the differences. ---
**Author:** ![Chicken\_Fingers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Chicken\_Fingers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicken_Fingers)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/90 "2018-07-11T17:54:50Z")
As I understand it, “people of color” is shorthand in America for anyone who isn’t white. As has been said, it’s a shame that we have this term, but that’s the reality for now. My partner is Vietnamese, and he considers himself a person of color in the US, because that’s how certain people see and treat him. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/91 "2018-07-11T18:03:51Z")
I voted “no”. To me the term means “black person”, due to it being a synonym for “colored person”, which is an archaic/obsolete american term for “black person”. I also consider “asian” to mean “east asian”. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/92 "2018-07-11T18:21:44Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > I voted “no”. To me the term means “black person”, due to it being a synonym for “colored person”, which is an archaic/obsolete american term for “black person”. [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Person_of_color) says: > [@](#): > > **The term “person of color”** (plural: people of color, persons of color; sometimes abbreviated POC) **is used primarily in the United States to describe any person who is not white.** The term encompasses all non-white people, emphasizing common experiences of systemic racism. The term may also be used with other collective categories of people such as “communities of color”, “men of color” (MOC), and “women of color” (WOC). Person of color was originally equivalent in use to the term “colored”, but usage of the appellation “colored” in the Southern United States gradually came to be restricted to “negroes”. (bolding mine) While trying to look up an “official definition,” I came across this column: [The term “people of color” includes Asian Americans](https://theithacan.org/columns/the-term-people-of-color-includes-asian-americans/). So there’s one person’s answer to the thread title’s question. ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/93 "2018-07-11T18:30:28Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Person_of_color) says: > (bolding mine) Just pretend that I included the same quote and bolded the last sentence instead. To me “people of color” = “colored”, and I never received the memo that we’re dissociating the terms now because the latter got tainted. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/94 "2018-07-11T18:41:53Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > Just pretend that I included the same quote and bolded the last sentence instead. To me “people of color” = “colored”, and I never received the memo that we’re dissociating the terms now because the latter got tainted. I understand that last sentence to be saying that “colored” _used_ to mean anyone who isn’t white, but then it changed to refer specifically to black people. “Colored” isn’t used much any more in either of those meanings; but if you’re going to say that “people of color” = “colored,” you have to tell us _which_ “colored.” ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/95 "2018-07-11T19:03:31Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I understand that last sentence to be saying that “colored” _used_ to mean anyone who isn’t white, but then it changed to refer specifically to black people. “Colored” isn’t used much any more in either of those meanings; but if you’re going to say that “people of color” = “colored,” you have to tell us _which_ “colored.” By my understanding of that thing called “the english language”, _english syntax_ suggests that “colored people” is a synonym of “people of color”. I get that various strange people have allegedly tried to draw a sharp line between the terms in an attempt to ‘reclaim’ the “of” version of the term for inclusiveness reasons, but I’m not seeing as how that means I have to _defend_ recognizing the obvious linguistic and historical connection. And in any case, I straight-up told you which “colored” I mean when I use\* the term - the archaric/obsolete “colored”=“black” one. \*I actually don’t use the term. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/96 "2018-07-11T19:32:03Z")
Think NAACP: National Association for the Advancement of Colored People. So Black, Negro, Afro-American, Colored Person are all equivalent terms–but some are out of style or even considered politically incorrect. And “person of color” = “colored person”. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/97 "2018-07-11T19:36:42Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > By my understanding of that thing called “the english language”, _english syntax_ suggests that “colored people” is a synonym of “people of color”. You should at least be aware that the majority of people who use the term “people of color” (at least in the U.S.) today use it as an _idiomatic_ phrase (i.e. you can’t necessarily deduce the meaning based on standard English syntax) that means something different from what you use it to mean. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/98 "2018-07-11T19:55:51Z")
[same as below only everything’s black] When you was born you was pink When you was sad you was blue When you was hot you was red When you was sick you was green When you was scared you was yellow And you call me colored. –Agra Gra (note: this is attributed to this person and also noted as some kind of winner of “best poem of 2005” but I saw it as a poster in a bookstore in a somewhat different form, long before that. I would have linked, but there are many versions. Some with additional colors.) ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/99 "2018-07-11T20:03:14Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Thanks for Spainsplaining our own culture to us. The foreigners in question came from Spain, Mexico, Dominican Republic, Argentina, Chile, Colombia, Costa Rica, China, Taiwan, Morocco, Niger, Congo, France, Germany and Vietnam that I remember. I may be forgetting some. And unlike mansplainers, I made my best to make it clear that I do realize I am speaking from a foreigner’s POV. Or in this case, that of a bunch of very-confused immigrants who spent many hours trying to find a fitting label for something we saw in our new country. “White” wasn’t accurate, “anglo(phone)” wasn’t either, and it was more frequent in people from certain areas but not exclusively linked to any. Turns out every person we’d seen exhibit that behavior was white (by the American definition), sole-anglophone and a protestant. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2018, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477/100 "2018-07-11T20:57:55Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > By my understanding of that thing called “the english language”, _english syntax_ suggests that “colored people” is a synonym of “people of color”. [Mark Twain](https://www.goodreads.com/quotes/4957-the-difference-between-the-almost-right-word-and-the-right) had something to say about that. > [@](#): > > The difference between the almost right word and the right word is really a large matter. ’tis the difference between the lightning bug and the lightning. English is not arithmetic. The transitive property does not apply. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-consider-asians-to-be-people-of-color/817477.md?page=6)