# Do you find the Confederate flag offensive? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 27, 2004, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815 "2004-12-27T20:22:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/41 "2004-12-27T22:20:31Z")
yes, Qualifier: When I see it displayed in rural areas it is often accompanied by a derogatory lawn jockey. It sends a message that certain folk are not appreciated. As a representation of the South (in general) it is not offensive. I find traditional Southern values and manners to be top-notch and something to aspire to. It’s kind of like the [swastika](http://www.locksley.com/6696/swastick.htm). This is a symbol that was used for centuries around the world until it was co-opted by Hitler to represent a monstrous regime. I have a 1907 New Years postcard with: a swastika, a 4 leaf clover, and a horseshoe on it. Obviously it was part of a good luck theme for the coming year. It was printed in Germany. Picked it up the obvious irony. For the same reason, the Klu Klux Klan has probably damaged the image of the confederate flag beyond repair. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/42 "2004-12-27T22:41:44Z")
> [@Tigers2B1](#): > > It doesn’t MATTER the derivation of the word. It’s about your reaction and whether something is offensive based solely on your reaction or whether that limitation is based on my intent. A person can make a decision to put up a confederate flag for reasons wholly unrelated to the reasons most here seem to what to assign to that person. The person who displays the symbol decides what he or she is symbolizing. Otherwise, I doubt we could display much of anything without having to call it an offensive display at sometime with someone - Good to know. I’m going to get a T-shirt printed up that says “I hate niggers.” Because to me, the word “nigger” means “tomato.” Language is just a complex system of symbols, after all, and I get determine the meaning of any symbols I choose to display. ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/43 "2004-12-27T22:43:18Z")
Yes. If I saw someone flying it or with a sticker of it on their car, I would choose not to associate with them. ---
**Author:** ![anu-la1979](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/47e85d/32.png) [@anu-la1979](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/anu-la1979)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/44 "2004-12-27T22:47:19Z")
Yes. Raised in Quebec/New England. The first time I ever saw it was after college when I moved to a Union state in the Midwest for work. I’m a minority and it makes me distinctly uncomfortable because everyone I knew who touted it was of a KKKish bent of mind and usually started conversation with “you people” although I’m pretty certain they were probably unsure of my ethnic background altogether (I can pass for a couple). And whenever I see it I’m forever reminded of the fact that I was canvassing for a political candidate and knocked on the door of someone flying the Confederate flag (stupid me) and they set their rottweiler on me. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/45 "2004-12-27T22:53:23Z")
Yes and no. I don’t find the flag itself offensive and do not think it was bad that it used to be on Georgia’s flag but I am automatically wary of anyone I see wearing it on their clothing or has it as decoration on their vehicle and tend to avoid them. So, as a symbol, no, but as a decoration, yes. I’m Tennessean for what it’s worth. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/46 "2004-12-27T23:04:25Z")
I guess I’m more-or-less inured to it. Having lived for a while on the fringe of The South, and having spent a couple years making regular forays into its territory and culture (I dated a South Carolinan whose mother and father now live in NC and VA, respectively), it’s hard for me to think of the Stars and Bars as only a symbol of slavery. That’s such a gross oversimplification of the sentiments the flag represents, I find the notion conceptually almost as offensive as the practice it’s purported to represent. After all, the Civil War wasn’t just about slaves, and even Abe Lincoln himself proclaimed that if he could have saved the Union while keeping slavery, he might have settled for that; so let’s not get too cocky about our own heritage in The North, thinking that Old Glory doesn’t carry some of the same racial baggage. I do think the Confederate flag is meant in most cases to convey a fiercely independant “don’t fuck with me” attitude that often can go hand-in-hand with the other outward traits of the Guns-‘n’-God set that I have very little in common with; and it’s true some of those folks are truly racist. But it’s really too much to say it’s all about racism or ignorance or any particular pejorative adjective. I have zero interest in running around with that flag on my person, but I wouldn’t assume somebody who did was supporting Klan or something. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/47 "2004-12-27T23:25:00Z")
Yes, offensive because it’s waved around by rascist gun-toting idiots, and because historically it stands for slavery. ---
**Author:** ![Queen\_Tonya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/4491bb/32.png) [@Queen\_Tonya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Queen_Tonya)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/48 "2004-12-27T23:42:30Z")
Yes. Well, I’m not offended, I just think the bearer seems ignorant. The area of Michigan I’m from has a strong southern influence, the coal mine’s were a-closing as the auto plants were flourishing, not to mention our location on the underground railroad…a lot of transplanted southerners and southern culture. I rather think it sucks for the folks who really want it to just symbolize mint juleps and whatever their utopian version of southern living is, but since it’s been co-opted by the aryan supremacists it pretty much doesn’t matter how loudly the ‘normal’ folks try and explain their idea of it’s symbolism. Even if one ignores the current racial associations, then yeah, we’re back to seceding and the bloodiest war this country’s ever seen, that’s a better association? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Snooooopy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Snooooopy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snooooopy)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2004, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/49 "2004-12-27T23:48:51Z")
I don’t have a visceral reaction when I see the Confederate flag, but the lame justifications for displaying it do fill me with a great deal of what-kind-of-dumbass-do-you-think-I-am? irritation. ---
**Author:** ![JustPlainBryan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/57b2e6/32.png) [@JustPlainBryan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JustPlainBryan)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/50 "2004-12-28T00:01:06Z")
No. I’ve read too much history to hold any real hatred towards the South because of the Civil War. They thought their rights were being trampled on, and so they took up arms. They were wrong, we were right. And boy were they bloodied up for it. After the war, Lincoln himself said that reconcilliation should be the order of the day, rather than scorn and humiliation. I choose to go along with that. Besides, I’ve known folks who put up the Stars and Bars, but don’t have a rascist bone in their bodies. So I can’t ever assume that the Confederate flag is a beacon for rascism. And for those who care, I’m not white. ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/51 "2004-12-28T00:28:15Z")
I don’t find the flag to be offensive. I do find ignorance about the secession of the CSA to be offensive. Put it in a nice little box labeled slavery, tied up with a pretty bow and that absolves one of any further thought on the matter. How about rejection of what was seen as a federalist authority? States rights? The Confederate States can no more be capably viewed in a singular aspect than any other portion of history-unless you’re happy with what you learned in junior high. ---
**Author:** ![ZebraShaSha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/eada6e/32.png) [@ZebraShaSha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZebraShaSha)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/52 "2004-12-28T00:29:38Z")
For me, as with other dopers above, context matters. Sometimes, it is hateful and derogatory, akin to hate speech; an evil symbol representing evil deeds - much like the number in my post count. On the other hand, people who show [this](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederate_flag) are particulary dense, ignorant, or racist considering that there are [many](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confederate_flag) other Confederate flags that have not been used like the Navy Jack to represent white supremacy. Perhaps now the Navy Jack waves due to cultural inertia instead of hidden subliminal messages, but many other choices show Southern heritage, like the very first Southern flag, without prompting intial distaste. Oh, and does anyone here actually get offended by Malcom X T-shirts? In our county handbook at school these shirts are explicitly banned, probably for reconciliation for the banning of the Stars and Bars. I, personally, would not be offended by these - Malcom X, although off the path of civil disobedience like his contemporaries, was a civil rights leader who wanted first and foremost equality (along with, perhaps, revenge; but I digress). [I’m white and currently living in North Carolina, for what it’s worth] ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/53 "2004-12-28T00:31:05Z")
I’m another yes, though offended might not be exactly the right word. What I find incredible was the amount I saw it in central Pensylvania, when I lived a days march north of Gettysburg. I just wanted to shake people and tell them they were on the winning side. Oddly enough, I see much less of it in Nashville, though this is a pretty liberal enclave in some ways, and I saw a lot more of it last week when I was up in the East Tennessee Smokies (again, paradoxically, a loyal area in the War). ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 12:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/54 "2004-12-28T00:41:26Z")
No, but the context may offend me. To me that flag is a symbol of states rights over fed rights, and peoples rights over states rights, basically the opposite to what we have now. It is also a sad memorial to what the US has lost w/ the winning of that war (the peoples constitutional rights). It has no slavery or white supermist association for me. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/55 "2004-12-28T00:42:32Z")
> [@spectrum](#): > > Yes. The Battle Flat of the evil, thank-Christ-its-dead Confederacy is a banner of hate, racism, discimrination, ignorance and malice. Any who would be proud of it must have souls as dark as a moonless night. Burning is too good for that filthy banner and all the evil it stands for. > > To hell with the South. I will never go back. If you wish to express opinions of this nature, do so in The BBQ Pit, _not_ IMHO. ---
**Author:** ![SolGrundy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bbce88/32.png) [@SolGrundy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SolGrundy)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/56 "2004-12-28T00:51:41Z")
Yes\* \*Because it’s a symbol of divisiveness and failure. It represents a failed attempt to break apart the United States that resulted in the deaths of tens of thousands of Americans. It represents a failed attempt to show petty defiance of the federal government by resisting its attempts to ensure equality and integration for tens of thousands of Americans. I’m southern, and white (exceedingly so), and I’ve got plenty of pride in where I grew up, and I believe there’s a lot of things to love about the South. And if I want to acknowledge that, I’m going to find some real symbol of southern pride, not the flag of a failed war and a failed racist governor. ---
**Author:** ![wolf\_in\_second\_hand\_clothing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9d8465/32.png) [@wolf\_in\_second\_hand\_clothing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolf_in_second_hand_clothing)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/57 "2004-12-28T01:05:06Z")
yes people seen flying it look, at best, like that 40 year old loser on your block who still talks about his highschool football days like they _weren’t_ twenty years ago when they talk about it being their “heritage.” at worst they are hateful, racist scum. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/58 "2004-12-28T01:08:49Z")
I find it offensive. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/59 "2004-12-28T01:11:42Z")
I’m of Southern roots, and I find the flag itself unoffensive. I find the people who display it **very** offensive. ---
**Author:** ![nitroglycerine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c5a1d2/32.png) [@nitroglycerine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nitroglycerine)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2004, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815/60 "2004-12-28T01:21:30Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > To me that flag is a symbol of states rights over fed rights, and peoples rights over states rights. :dubious: Peoples rights? White peoples rights you mean. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-find-the-confederate-flag-offensive/281815.md?page=4)