# Do you include apes when you think of "Monkeys"? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 8, 2020, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146 "2020-01-08T23:09:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/21 "2020-01-09T02:40:43Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > That’s a Monkee, not a monkey. > > I’m so persnickity (sp?) today. Persnickety. 😉 And yes, you are right about the Monkee/ey ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/22 "2020-01-09T02:55:10Z")
> [@ASL\_v2.0](#): > > Excuse me? The baboon in Lion King? That ape (Orangutan?) which I maintain is also a monkey in Jungle Book? > > Clearly more than one. And then there’s [Curious George](https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinakillgrove/2016/09/30/curious-george-turns-75-but-is-he-a-monkey-or-an-ape/#e69112417d32). ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/23 "2020-01-09T07:48:36Z")
Apes _are_ monkeys, AFAIAC, but not all primates are monkeys, hence I could not, in good conscience, vote for any of the choices given. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/24 "2020-01-09T13:04:34Z")
Man, I don’t care! If someone illustrates a “monkey see, monkey do” meme with a picture of a chimp, I’ll take a look at it and do the same thing. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanub/32/132_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUB)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 1:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/25 "2020-01-09T13:06:18Z")
I voted “yes” but I was concentrating on the “think of” part. When I hear the word “monkey” the first, instantaneous image that comes to mind is of a chimpanzee. Possibly dressed up. As an adult, I’ve known for years that chimps are apes but as a kid I thought “monkey” and “chimpanzee” were two different words for the same thing.Childhood ideas are hard to get rid of. So, technically, I do, momentarily. The same way the word “ape” instantly brings a picture of a gorllla to mind. Even though I know they’re only one type of ape, they’re what I always think of. ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/26 "2020-01-09T13:14:33Z")
In my world, there are monkeys and gorillas. All are hairy. Monkeys are little, gorillas are big. It may not be accurate, but it works for me. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/27 "2020-01-09T13:34:00Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > I encountered one of those in a Japanese whorehouse. 'Twas a night to remember. Yeah, [she’s hot](https://i.imgur.com/oU19iGo.jpg). ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/28 "2020-01-09T14:51:09Z")
The funny thing for me is that Afrikaans just uses “aap” for _all_ simians. ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/29 "2020-01-09T15:03:31Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > I would have answered “No” but it wasn’t an option - just some business about tails which doesn’t really factor into my thinking. Same here. I think of “apes” as including “monkeys” not the other way around. Monkeys are the small ones that you’d encounter in trees. The apes that are as big or bigger than humans and tend to spend most of their time on the ground are GREAT apes and they ain’t monkeys. ---
**Author:** ![Kron](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kron/32/12444_2.png) [@Kron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kron)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/30 "2020-01-09T15:43:17Z")
> [@ASL\_v2.0](#): > > Excuse me? The baboon in Lion King? That ape (Orangutan?) which I maintain is also a monkey in Jungle Book? > > Clearly more than one. What about [the Librarian](https://discworld.fandom.com/wiki/The_Librarian), and are you going to call him a… _whispers_ _monkey_? ---
**Author:** ![aceplace57](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aceplace57/32/3500_2.png) [@aceplace57](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aceplace57)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/31 "2020-01-09T16:14:50Z")
I casually refer to most primates as monkeys. Gorillas and orangutans are the only exception. I know there’s a difference between monkeys and apes. But, I’m not in high school biology class anymore. I don’t have to be precise. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/32 "2020-01-09T16:30:18Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > And then there’s [Curious George](https://www.forbes.com/sites/kristinakillgrove/2016/09/30/curious-george-turns-75-but-is-he-a-monkey-or-an-ape/#e69112417d32). I think I saw a movie about his dotage, _The Madness of Curious George III_. ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/33 "2020-01-09T16:42:31Z")
I deliberately try to picture a gibbon any time someone says “ape,” just because I fell sorry for it. It’s the _only_ lesser ape. Every other ape gets to be a great ape, but the “lesser ape” category was invented just to put down the gibbon for not making nests. But sometimes I picture Kim Hunter in full makeup. When someone says “monkey,” I picture Oliver North, after someone pointed out to me how much he looks like the flying monkeys in the movie _The Wizard of Oz_. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/34 "2020-01-09T17:23:51Z")
I would answer yes to the question as posed in the title. Hell, I’d include humans. But I voted for the loris. When communicating to others I would expect monkeys to be understood less all-inclusive, and use great ape for the non human great apes. ---
**Author:** ![Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hypnagogic_jerk/32/4252_2.png) [@Hypnagogic\_Jerk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypnagogic_Jerk)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/35 "2020-01-09T17:27:30Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > The funny thing for me is that Afrikaans just uses “aap” for _all_ simians. Similarly, French does not distinguish between monkeys and apes; they’re both _singes_. So I don’t really know what the difference is supposed to be between apes and monkeys. I’m aware of the great apes, who are definitely distinctive species (also called _grands singes_ in French), but I know there are also lesser apes but couldn’t tell you how they are supposed to be different from monkeys. On preview, according to **RivkahChaya** lesser apes are gibbons, and Wikipedia agrees. So I guess now I know: apes are _grands singes_ with the addition of gibbons. I was actually thinking about this today since I’ve seen, probably on this board, discussions that Pierre Boulle’s novel _La Planète des singes_ should be called _Monkey Planet_ rather than _Planet of the Apes_. Both are perfectly accurate translations of the French title, but with definitely different connotations in English. As I understand it (not having read it), Boulle’s novel is somewhat satirical, so maybe the less pompous-sounding English title is in fact better. ---
**Author:** ![Icarus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icarus/32/72_2.png) [@Icarus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icarus)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/36 "2020-01-09T17:30:13Z")
> [@aceplace57](#): > > I know there’s a difference between monkeys and apes. But, I’m not in high school biology class anymore. I don’t have to be precise. Me too. There is pedantic precision, and then there is common language. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/37 "2020-01-09T18:26:50Z")
Having been corrected a few times by my zookeeper brother, I know to be sure to make the distinction. In his presence, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![cochrane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cochrane/32/10441_2.png) [@cochrane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cochrane)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/38 "2020-01-09T19:15:24Z")
“Get yer stinkin’ paws off me, you damn dirty monkey” wouldn’t have had the same impact as the original line. ---
**Author:** ![Trancephalic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trancephalic/32/380_2.png) [@Trancephalic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trancephalic)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/39 "2020-01-09T19:26:23Z")
In addition to the nested hierarchy above, it’s important to note that apes arose within old world monkeys after old world monkeys split from new world monkeys. That is to say baboons are more closely related to humans than they are to howler monkeys, so it makes no sense to partition them together for superficial reasons. Either all primates are monkeys or none of them are. It’s why all vertebrates are fish or none of them are. (Coelacanths and lungfish are more closely related to us than they are to your tuna fish sandwich, fyi) ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2020, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146/40 "2020-01-09T19:28:43Z")
No. Monkeys have tails and apes do not. They are quite distinct from one another. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-include-apes-when-you-think-of-monkeys/846146.md?page=3)