# Do you notice a lot of bicyclists with their seats too low? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 15, 2024, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890 "2024-03-15T19:57:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/61 "2024-03-18T21:12:24Z")
I got the impression that @WOOKINPANUBv.2 's bottom bracket was high enough that it was impossible to put a toe down at a stop and balance the bike while seated. Though I do have a bike that is old enough that this is possible; perhaps you do too. Point is, especially with newer bicycles (but many older ones as well), this is probably impossible unless the saddle is way too low. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 9:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/62 "2024-03-18T21:52:58Z")
I’d better walk away, as I’m having a hard time imagining what you describe. In 60 years of biking, I never had a bike - old or new, road or hybrid - that I couldn’t put a foot down while still on the seat. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/63 "2024-03-18T21:55:43Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Thanks. Reference went completely past me. Just to gauge exactly HOW out of touch I am, what percentage of folk do you think would get that reference? I can’t link it because the site is down, but I thought of the Dr. McNinja comic. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2024, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/64 "2024-03-18T22:05:55Z")
If you lean over, you can touch the ground. Or, perhaps with a toe tip, like on my bike. ETA I just double-checked, and definitely cannot sit on the saddle with the bike upright and put a foot flat on the ground. > [@Dinsdale](#): > > Thanks. Reference went completely past me. Just to gauge exactly HOW out of touch I am, what percentage of folk do you think would get that reference? I like Jay-Z; maybe I’m old? 🙂 On the other hand, he was recently named “the greatest rapper of all time” and is kind of famous. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanubv.2/32/3260_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2024, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/65 "2024-03-19T02:36:35Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > I got the impression that @WOOKINPANUBv.2 's bottom bracket was high enough that it was impossible to put a toe down at a stop and balance the bike while seated. Yes, that’s pretty much it. Perhaps real cyclists do not want/need that but I do 🙁 Anyway, sorry to turn this into the “Legs too short to ride with God” (how’s that for a musical reference?) thread. I appreciate everyone’s input. ---
**Author:** ![Cugel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cugel/32/1199_2.png) [@Cugel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cugel)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 5:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/66 "2024-03-20T05:23:07Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > ETA I just double-checked, and definitely cannot sit on the saddle with the bike upright and put a foot flat on the ground. Ditto. Tippy toe can just touch, but highly precarious. What grinds my gears is people riding around with insanely easy ratios, pedals are a blur, but they’re doing 4 km/h. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/67 "2024-03-20T11:48:18Z")
> [@Cugel](#): > > What grinds my gears I see people on bicycles when I walk Simi on a local trail. Maybe I’m extremely unobservant, but I’ve never noticed anything about them. I walk on the right and they pass us by on the left. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/68 "2024-03-20T11:51:27Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > I walk on the right and they pass us by on the left. Do they say, “On yer left?” Don’t get me started on walker/biker path etiquette… My favorite is the jogger who is staying to the right (with earbuds in, of course). But then, without bothering to look behind him/her, either they are done with their run or going to turn around, so they just veer to the left across the path. But, at least we can all agree that EVERYONE hates rollerbladers! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2024, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/69 "2024-03-20T11:54:38Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > Do they say, “On yer left?” I wouldn’t know. I usually have ear buds in and if I don’t I’m not wearing my hearing aid . A sign at the trailhead asks everyone to walk/run/bike on the right. ---
**Author:** ![wguy123](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wguy123/32/3161_2.png) [@wguy123](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wguy123)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/70 "2024-03-21T15:03:32Z")
I see the too low seats all the time along with the half-filled squishy tires. I’ve learned from my nephew that lives with us is he wants to put both feet on the ground while still sitting. It’s partially laziness and also that he refuses to get better at biking. We’ve tried and tried to get him comfortable standing while riding and doing the proper stand on one pedal to get going as well as to stop. He does it a time or two in the parking lot, then back to never getting his ass off the seat ever. He’d also rather take 30 minutes to walk to school than ride it in a few (it is one mile). That’s another thing we’ve noticed: Young people walk really, really slowly. > [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > Or just get off the seat to put your foot down. > [@DPRK](#): > > ETA I just double-checked, and definitely cannot sit on the saddle with the bike upright and put a foot flat on the ground. This is true for my bikes except for mtn bike with dropper seat, but the seat has to be dropped. When I grew up, we had “bike rodeo” day at school and they taught us the basics of standing in the pedals, starting and stopping while standing, etc. It would be very odd for me to stay in the seat when stopped and get started from a seated position. This is the technique we’ve tried to teach our nephew and he just won’t do it. 🤷 > **[How to Start and Stop on a Bicycle](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LHkgTuwtKOg%2F)** ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/71 "2024-03-21T15:13:59Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > It is? I have never heard of these things and, after looking it up, I’m pretty sure I’ve never seen one. I have two kids under ten, and they just have normal bikes to learn on (they haven’t quite yet), and I’ve never seen the pedealless ones in my neighborhood being ridden by the other kids. Are they really that common (given the fact no one else remarked on it, I’m guessing they must be.) I don’t know about “standard”, but pedal-less trainer bikes are definitely becoming more common. IMO they are vastly superior to the “traditional” method of using training wheels and then running after your kid to keep them from falling over until they gain some sense of balance. The pedal-less ones work as velocipedes and the kid essentially train themselves. They gain a sense of balance very quickly and when they are coasting along on them feet up, they can transition seamlessly to a pedal bike. It happens very quickly. We got my son one when he was 3 years old and he was riding a regular bicycle in a month - when his grandparents bought him his first pedal bike, we didn’t even bother with the training wheels. He just hopped on and off he went. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/72 "2024-03-21T15:15:46Z")
I’ll have to look into those. Neither of my kids can ride a bike, so far as I know, and they’re 10 and 8. They just have a training wheel bike they barely use. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/73 "2024-03-21T15:19:58Z")
They are mostly made for very young kids. At 8 and 10, another option would be to remove the training wheels AND the crankset/pedals, and lower the seat so that they can reach the ground seated. It’ll essentially work the same way. I’d bet they would enjoy the bike more and thus get comfortable with balance very quickly. Once you see them coasting along at speed with their feet up in the air you know you can raise the seat and reinstall the pedals. A day of getting used to maintaining that balance feeling while pedaling and they should be fine. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/74 "2024-03-21T15:24:23Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > EVERY. SINGLE. ONE. of them has their seats set WAY too low. Could it be because, like me, they don’t even know that there is a “correct height” for a bicycle seat? 😳 By the way, what is considered the “correct height” and why? ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/75 "2024-03-21T15:30:36Z")
> [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](#): > > Coming back to this to ask how one starts off / gets going if their feet don’t touch the ground? > … There seem to be two methods to that: 1. (preferred by the more agile) Begin cycling not sitting in seat but standing on the pedals; after bicycle is rolling and stable lift ass to seat. 2. (preferred by the less agile, like me) Sit on seat, dominant-side foot on pedal ready to push down, bicycle leaning to nondominant side so nondominant-side foot is standing on the ground. Push up and forwards from nondominant-side foot and at the same time push down pedal with the other foot, put nondominant-side foot on pedal, keep balancing for a few tenths of a second, pedal until bike is stable. ---
**Author:** ![WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wookinpanubv.2/32/3260_2.png) [@WOOKINPANUBv.2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WOOKINPANUBv.2)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/76 "2024-03-21T17:22:53Z")
> [@Mops](#): > > 1. (preferred by the less agile, like me) Sit on seat, dominant-side foot on pedal ready to push down, bicycle leaning to nondominant side so nondominant-side foot is standing on the ground. Push up and forwards from nondominant-side foot and at the same time push down pedal with the other foot, put nondominant-side foot on pedal, keep balancing for a few tenths of a second, pedal until bike is stable. Thanks, Mops. Yes, that’s how I learned and it’s the only way I’m comfortable _at this point_. Like @Jasmine , I never knew their was a “correct” height. I don’t recall having a bike where my feet were flat on the floor, due to my short legs, but I’ve always at least been able to touch the ground with the ball of my foot and do the push off thing to get started. My understanding is that the correct height is when your knee is only slightly bent when your pedal is at its lowest point. Has to do with ergonomics and optimal performance, IIRC. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/77 "2024-03-21T18:04:26Z")
Thanks! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/78 "2024-03-21T19:01:21Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > ETA I just double-checked, and definitely cannot sit on the saddle with the bike upright and put a foot flat on the ground. Of course you are correct. But why would it cross your mind to do so? When I stop my bike, I keep one foot on the low pedal, keep the handbrakes engaged, and touch the front portion of my other foot to the ground. And not just the toes, but the entire front of the foot. The bike probably leans minimally in the direction of the foot on the ground, but not much. And it is steady as a rock. Not precarious at all. You’ve got 3 points on the ground, your other foot is pressing against the pedal, and the brakes keep it from rolling forward or back. If - for some reason I do not understand - I wanted my foot flat on the ground, I _could_ lean the bike over a little further. But why would the ball and toes of one foot be insufficient? To go, you slightly push with the toe on the ground to get the bike fully upright and have a teeny bit of forward momentum, place that foot on the up pedal, and press down. Hopefully you geared down before stopping. Before you go, you can turn the crank so the up pedal is just ahead of vertical, to allow you to push down on it. At most, you might have to sorta stand up on that foot while pusing for the initial pedal. If your bike has coaster brakes, when stopped, your pedals will be more horizontal, such that the foot on the pedal applies pressure to the brakes. If someone wanted their bike to function as a chair or a stool, such that they sat on the seat with both feet flat on the ground, I’d suggest they get a BMX bike - or a Schwinn Stingray! 😃 [quote=“wguy123, post:70, topic:998890”] > [@wguy123](#): > > We’ve tried and tried to get him comfortable standing while riding and doing the proper stand on one pedal to get going as well as to stop. … > > …they taught us the basics of standing in the pedals, starting and stopping while standing, etc. It would be very odd for me to stay in the seat when stopped and get started from a seated position. … Opposite is true for me. I ride hundreds of miles a month, and I’ve never been comfortable standing on the pedals. Periodically I’ll try it - especially if I just watched some cycling, but I just can’t get the hang of it. I’m not sure what you mean by “the proper stand on one pedal” to start/stop. If you are talking about people who stand on one pedal when starting and THEN swing their leg over, I’ve never heard or seen that that was the proper way, and have heard to the contrary that that stresses the bike. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/79 "2024-03-21T19:21:33Z")
> [@Jasmine](#): > > Could it be because, like me, they don’t even know that there is a “correct height” for a bicycle seat? Same for me. I doubt my parents had any clue either. When putting my nieces on bikes, my most recent bike experience, I don’t recall any discussion about tippy-toes or leaning to the side. We just put the seats where the kids said they wanted them, which I’m sure meant low enough for both feet to touch the ground. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2024, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890/80 "2024-03-21T19:28:56Z")
I realize different people do things differently. But even when I was a kid and my parents bought me my first bike, we bought it from a store where one of the few questions discussed was “what is the correct size bike?” Just strikes me as curious that someone would buy a bike and not observe that there were different sized frames/wheels, and consider whether one size/setup or another was more appropriate. Please don’t tell me you haven’t realized that the seat in your car is adjustable! 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-notice-a-lot-of-bicyclists-with-their-seats-too-low/998890.md?page=5)