# Do you object more to Trump's persona, or Trump's policies? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 2, 2019, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069 "2019-01-02T00:55:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2019, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/21 "2019-01-02T15:03:43Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > I guess I’m an outlier. I dislike his persona more. > > His policies are typical republican policies. I’d expect the same from Romney or pence. So would I, but that just means that generic GOP policies are abominable. > [@](#): > > But his person’s has destroyed the world’s ability to trust or respect us, and destroyed a lot of Americans ability to trust and respect each other. He has ushered in an age when being openly hostile to democracy is perfectly mainstream. Working to tear down NATO, kissing up to Putin, MbS, Erdogan, etc., pulling out of the Paris accords, getting in trade wars, etc. - these are _policies_. And mostly worse than generic GOP policies. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2019, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/22 "2019-01-02T15:30:13Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > Hi. I’m Canadian, and a complete outsider to this. But I would say that Trump is a mysoginist, narcissist, racist, sociopath, with an IQ lower than 120. Surely you don’t mean 120. I’d put him around 85. ETA: Unless you’re using the metric IQ scale. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2019, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/23 "2019-01-02T16:06:50Z")
> [@guizot](#): > > he’s just the ultimate, classic politician who will say anything to get what he wants for himself, distorting the truth, flip-flopping if necessary, unprincipled, and most of all, entirely fake. Hardly. A classic politician will piss on your back, call it rain, & tell you it’s helping you out. They are the ultimate in doublespeakers _but_ they are masters (at least in public) of what most people learn somewhere in their single digit years old. Sure, I may think \<_you_\> are an asshole, but I don’t say that publicly in a press conference or to my millions of twitter followers. With any other politician when someone leaves their service we get the bland, “We thank them for their service & wish them well in their future endeavors.” even if they were fired. With 46-1 (I can’t take credit for that, it comes from Pete Sousa, Obama’s official WH photographer & a great Trump troll. Of course after 8 years in the WH, he has a corresponding photo for pretty much _anything_.) we get a very juvenile, “he’s ugly & his mother dresses him funny.” response. At some point if all of these people who he’s fired are so stupid & not up to the task we have to ask how smart he is in picking lieutenants? > [@RTFirefly](#): > > Working to tear down NATO, kissing up to Putin, MbS, Erdogan, etc., pulling out of the Paris accords, getting in trade wars, etc. - these are _policies_. And mostly worse than generic GOP policies. He’s an isolationist; that’s his persona. Did the GOP have these policies to this level before him? He doesn’t get what the job is. He doesn’t get that he needs to be the consoler-in-chief. Any normal politician will come make the tour of the disaster area & at least _pretend_ to offer condolences or try get money to rebuild. He doesn’t get the pomp & circumstance part. He doesn’t get that there are rules, laws, & customs in this country & we can’t just change things because he wants it. The founding fathers were good that way. Definitely the persona much more than the policies. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/24 "2019-01-03T00:02:13Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > “Let’s shut down the entire government just so that the Dems and my base know that my farts are the smelliest farts ever.” > — is that policy or personality? > “It’s not enough to shut down the border. Let’s also torture the little children of the asylum seekers. My base will love it!” > — is that policy or personality? > “When you revise the tax code to help the rich; make sure to find clever little tricks to transfer wealth from blue voters to red voters!” > — is that policy or personality? > “Obama negotiated foreign deals? Let’s tear those up; set things back; and eventually come up with something almost as good … but with my name on it!” > — is that policy or personality? > > I didn’t know how to answer the poll. Well, I do. He can stew in the fetid swamp of his “mind” until he rots away; it’s his policies I object to. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/25 "2019-01-03T00:22:41Z")
His persona drives his policies, so I am puzzled that you have a choice for “I don’t object at all”, but not a choice for “object to both equally”. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/26 "2019-01-03T00:31:26Z")
I voted policies because his disgusting personality couldn’t affect us until it could drive policy. His being a racist is bad but wanting to deport refugees because of his racism is worse. His inability to concentrate for more than a minute is bad, but that this makes him make decisions out of ignorance is worse. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/27 "2019-01-03T00:44:47Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Surely you don’t mean 120. I’d put him around 85. > > ETA: Unless you’re using the metric IQ scale. 85 is lower than 120 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/28 "2019-01-03T01:28:22Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > He’s an isolationist; that’s his persona. Did the GOP have these policies to this level before him? > He doesn’t get what the job is. He doesn’t get that he needs to be the consoler-in-chief. Any normal politician will come make the tour of the disaster area & at least _pretend_ to offer condolences or try get money to rebuild. He doesn’t get the pomp & circumstance part. He doesn’t get that there are rules, laws, & customs in this country & we can’t just change things because he wants it. The founding fathers were good that way. > > Definitely the persona much more than the policies. See, that’s why I agree the two are inseparable. The things you describe are all just as equally policy. Isolationism is a policy that comes from his isolationist persona. His in ability to console people or try to get money is a policy decision. Not following rules, laws, and customs is a policy decision. Sure, his persona hasn’t changed, and would be fine if he didn’t have power. But the same can be said about his policies. The thing is, Trump is so simple that he lacks the ability to divide these things. He can lie, of course. But he lacks the ability to intentionally put forth a persona that is different from who he is at his core. That’s the case for all people who act like he does. It’s why I thought everyone understood such people were awful for society and, well, evil. There is no way that someone with a narcissistic, psychopathic persona can have good policies. Their core values are fundamentally at odds with doing things for the good of a country. ---
**Author:** ![kopek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kopek/32/337_2.png) [@kopek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kopek)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/29 "2019-01-03T03:12:36Z")
I’ll skip voting because in thinking about it, its basically a dead heat and too close to call one way or another. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/30 "2019-01-03T12:31:38Z")
I’d say his persona. The only policy I strenuously object to moreso than what other Republican presidents would have done is the Muslim ban. The others aren’t too egregious. Who knows, Bernie might have imposed tariffs as well but he would have done so in a thoughtful rather than haphazard manner, and other countries could trust Bernie to negotiate in good faith about them. The wall is a symbol of 45’s utter incompetence and imbecility, and I dislike it as such moreso than I dislike it as a symbol of his xenophobia. And also his mendacity: again, if I were a Democratic congressperson, I would trust other GOP presidents to negotiate in good faith about the wall, and afterward not try to shut down the government _too_ much over every little $5 billion dollar pet project. Whereas Trump might promise things only to immediately renege on them and will then proceed to use a government shutdown as a first line of attack rather than the last if he gets his stupid useless wall. ---
**Author:** ![Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Living\_Well\_Is\_Best\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Living_Well_Is_Best_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/31 "2019-01-03T15:10:58Z")
I need a “both” option. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/32 "2019-01-03T15:53:37Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > See, that’s why I agree the two are inseparable. The things you describe are all just as equally policy. Isolationism is a policy that comes from his isolationist persona. His in ability to console people or try to get money is a policy decision. Not following rules, laws, and customs is a policy decision. > > Sure, his persona hasn’t changed, and would be fine if he didn’t have power. But the same can be said about his policies. > > The thing is, Trump is so simple that he lacks the ability to divide these things. He can lie, of course. But he lacks the ability to intentionally put forth a persona that is different from who he is at his core. That’s the case for all people who act like he does. > > It’s why I thought everyone understood such people were awful for society and, well, evil. There is no way that someone with a narcissistic, psychopathic persona can have good policies. Their core values are fundamentally at odds with doing things for the good of a country. You’re really not very bright are you? Not very bright at all. (Oh wait, sorry, that’s my inner-Trump, insulting & belittling anyone who doesn’t agree with me 100%.) The fact that he doesn’t think there was Russian meddling in the election, despite that being the consensus of the intelligence community, the fact that he doesn’t think MSB didn’t have involvement in Kashogi’s murder despite even Republican senators stating that after a CIA briefing, the fact that he has stated he likes discord among his underlings, the fact that he counters his lieutenants; they publicly say something & he then countermines it in a tweet, the ‘fact’ that there are numerous sources that state he doesn’t read his briefings & goes on gut feel, for things which he doesn’t really know about is all telling. I don’t think there’s any real thought to his policies; it’s his persona that’s driving the policies. With Reagan’s tax cuts, there was a well thought out message about how trickle-down economics would work & it would be good for the economy. With this one, it’s more, ‘we’re paying too much’ is the reason for the tax cuts. ---
**Author:** ![rbroome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/838e76/32.png) [@rbroome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rbroome)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/33 "2019-01-03T15:56:31Z")
This is an interesting poll because it forces to the front a key point about Trump. Many posters here picked policies-but virtually all of the comments focused on his personality. Trump uses his personality to motivate his base and deflect attention from his policies. Everyone, especially his base, knows this and everyone succumbs to the effect. So I picked personality because as bad as his policies are, his personality enables those policies. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/34 "2019-01-03T16:17:20Z")
> [@rbroome](#): > > Trump uses his personality to motivate his base and deflect attention from his policies. Everyone, especially his base, knows this and everyone succumbs to the effect. So I picked personality because as bad as his policies are, his personality enables those policies. That was my thinking as well, with the added thought that even if his policies were bog-standard moderate and nothing odd, his personal behavior and general obnoxiousness would be enough for me to seriously dislike the man- he’s eroding the prestige, power and respectability of the office to which he’s been elected. None of the other presidents in recent memory have managed that, regardless of which side of the aisle you favor. They’ve all been appropriately dignified, serious, respectful, etc… and Trump won’t go visit war memorials because of rain, encourages neo-Nazis from the White House, tweets about all manner of weird-ass things, etc… ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/35 "2019-01-03T16:21:05Z")
Funny how everyone was fine with Trump for years. The Clintons went to his wedding and took his money. Bill played golf with him. He was on many tv shows. He had his own show. But NOW suddenly he is this bad guy? ---
**Author:** ![DrFidelius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drfidelius/32/3447_2.png) [@DrFidelius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrFidelius)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/36 "2019-01-03T17:13:47Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Funny how everyone was fine with Trump for years. The Clintons went to his wedding and took his money. Bill played golf with him. He was on many tv shows. He had his own show. > > But NOW suddenly he is this bad guy? There is a world of difference between being a local nykulturny New York buffoon and having the ability to destroy my country. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/37 "2019-01-03T18:07:22Z")
> [@DrFidelius](#): > > There is a world of difference between being a local nykulturny New York buffoon and having the ability to destroy my country. He’s always been this bad guy (as \*\*Urbanredneck \*\*puts it), but his impact was limited to local NYC stuff and being on television. The problem is that he’s now in office and can materially affect hundreds of millions of Americans, and billions of people worldwide. That’s a colossal responsibility, and he manages to approach it with a stunning lack of concern for that responsibility. I mean, a couple of his policies are already causing a lot of hardship- the government shutdown is starting to hit unpaid government workers pretty hard, and the trade wars are starting to ding farmers and other people hard now. Does he care? Apparently not- he’s busy repeating “No Collusion!” like a mantra and talking about this dumb-ass wall that nobody wants, especially the actual people who live near the border. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/38 "2019-01-03T19:07:42Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > 85 is lower than 120 🙂 Not if you are Trump and comparing your inauguration to Obama’s. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/39 "2019-01-03T19:14:46Z")
I think that what I object to the most is not quite either, specifically, although maybe it leans closer to persona? As an example, let’s discuss the wall. As a policy, I object to the wall. I think it’s a terrible idea. But if there was massive popular support for a wall, and a serious and responsible politician were elected president who did studies and put forth a serious and real proposal that both showed why the wall was the best dollar value for reducing illegal immigration and also answered all the practical questions about eminent domain and so forth, and then the wall was built; well, I would be sad, I would think it was a terrible mistake, I would hope that a future administration would tear it down, but it would at least be a terrible mistake somewhat in the bands of normal democratic governance. And I also object to his persona while discussing the wall… referring to Mexicans as rapists, etc. But it would be a mistake to think that my primary objection to his persona is just the language he uses. If private recordings of LBJ suddenly surfaced in which he said things about women or foreigners or whatever that were every bit as bad as Trump, that would suddenly make LBJ as bad a president as Trump. My objection is to the fact that the entire thing is vaporware. His most massive flaw (out of a LOT of flaws) is not that he chooses policies that I don’t like, and it’s not that he’s an abrasive lying perverted asshole – it’s that he does not remotely understand the presidency, or our system of government, or what he should be doing as president. And he doesn’t seem to care, and shows no desire to learn. But he thinks he does understand, thinks he’s doing a great job, and spews bullshit to that effect. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [January 3, 2019, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069/40 "2019-01-03T19:22:20Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > With Reagan’s tax cuts, there was a well thought out message about how trickle-down economics would work & it would be good for the economy. With this one, it’s more, ‘we’re paying too much’ is the reason for the tax cuts. It’s simpler that. It’s simply my friends and I (the term friends being used VERY loosely) want more money. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-object-more-to-trumps-persona-or-trumps-policies/827069.md?page=3)