# Do you think Jesus would like the way Christianity has gone? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 14, 2005, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021 "2005-11-14T18:10:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/61 "2005-11-28T21:46:34Z")
I haven’t seen the movie “Fallen”. I also do not think that Love and Violence are mutually exclusive, nor is peace always loving. My idea of memes is that we have the angelic hierarchy going off in every direction, and we climb these ideas(memes) as we try to understand them, assimilate them and transcend them in our quest to create our selves. Jesus Christ happens to be a very powerful one, and a fairly unifying theme generally, and I do believe that he actually walked the Earth at one point. Perhaps there is a particular love and peace message at the heart of it all, but the paths there are sometimes fraught with peril, and should not necessarily be judged as being incorrect, and I do not think that Jesus would necessarily look badly upon the way his followers are worshipping him. I was born on Christmas Day in 1977 at noon, and I’ve had quite an affinity for Jesus throughout my life, and I believe that his message is perverted, and _I_ do not like the way his name is used, it pisses me off daily in fact. The best example I can give of the conflict I have when judging the way people go about it is the church next to my house. There are two Benzes parked in the lot, but they also feed the poor lunch every day from 11-1 and give hungry people groceries. I went by there at 3:30 today, wanting to talk to a minister, and no one was there. I was far more pissed off by the fact that a church would be closed during the day than I was by the cars, though they added to my ire. This was teh second church I stopped by today only to find it closed. I live in the ghetto in Brooklyn and there are a million churches around here. If they can’t find people to staff the churches, then perhaps there are too many of them. Erek ---
**Author:** ![xanthous](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/53a042/32.png) [@xanthous](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xanthous)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/62 "2005-11-28T22:30:20Z")
One of my favorite lines from a Woody Allen movie (Hannah & Her Sisters), and my opinion, too: “If Jesus came back and saw what’s going on in his name, he’d never stop throwing up.” : ) ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/63 "2005-11-28T23:05:35Z")
I think Jesus might rethink the whole “camel through the eye of a needle” thing when he sees how empty Heaven is. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/64 "2005-11-28T23:09:27Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > I think Jesus might rethink the whole “camel through the eye of a needle” thing when he sees how empty Heaven is. Good point. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/65 "2005-11-28T23:21:29Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > I think Jesus might rethink the whole “camel through the eye of a needle” thing when he sees how empty Heaven is. > [@mswas](#): > > Good point. > [@](#): > > **Matthew 7:13** 13"Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14But **small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.** > [@](#): > > **Matthew 7:21-23** 21"Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 **Many will say to me on that day** , ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ 23 **Then I will tell them plainly, 'I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!'** **Bolding mine** I’m guessing he’s unconcerned. Did you guys read _any_ of the bible before posting with such abandon? ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/66 "2005-11-28T23:24:04Z")
Am I the only one near wretching at the overuse of the word, _“meme?”_ ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2005, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/67 "2005-11-28T23:26:40Z")
> [@the raindog](#): > > Did you guys read _any_ of the bible before posting with such abandon? For my part, I was being sarcastic, which is apparently wasted on the swing shift around here. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/68 "2005-11-29T02:03:11Z")
> [@the raindog](#): > > Am I the only one near wretching at the overuse of the word, _“meme?”_ Well, you know that grace will save a wretching like yours! 🙂 I used “meme” in its proper sense; **mswas** is using a slightly extended definition (from the context, I have a hunch he’s a John Barnes fan, like me). And may I offer you John 3:17, as counterplay to your “strait gate” scenario. Yes, Jesus is recorded as having said both. But given His history, I doubt strongly that He was referring to Biblical scholarship as His criterion. ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 4:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/69 "2005-11-29T04:06:48Z")
> [@Fear Itself](#): > > For my part, I was being sarcastic, which is apparently wasted on the swing shift around here. :rolleyes: Sorry for missing this… ---
**Author:** ![raindog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@raindog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raindog)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 1:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/70 "2005-11-29T13:15:00Z")
> [@Polycarp](#): > > Well, you know that grace will save a wretching like yours! 🙂 > > I used “meme” in its proper sense; **mswas** is using a slightly extended definition (from the context, I have a hunch he’s a John Barnes fan, like me). > > And may I offer you John 3:17, as counterplay to your “strait gate” scenario. Yes, Jesus is recorded as having said both. But given His history, I doubt strongly that He was referring to Biblical scholarship as His criterion. _Hello_ Polycarp. There was no specific use of the word that had my panties bunched up. Ever had a word that got on your last nerve? (for no apparent reason?) _Meme_ is that word for me. I seem to see it more and more, even in places where it seems to be tortured. It’s just me I guess… I appreciate the cite, and the point is well taken. I imagine that you would agree that there is a [healthy] balance between never having read any of it, and becoming a scholar. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/71 "2005-11-29T14:09:37Z")
> [@the raindog](#): > > _Hello_ Polycarp. > > There was no specific use of the word that had my panties bunched up. Ever had a word that got on your last nerve? (for no apparent reason?) > > _Meme_ is that word for me. I seem to see it more and more, even in places where it seems to be tortured. It’s just me I guess… > > I appreciate the cite, and the point is well taken. I imagine that you would agree that there is a [healthy] balance between never having read any of it, and becoming a scholar. I hear you about “meme” grating on you. I can remember some years ago when a debate about the nuclear weapons balance of power, where someone came up with the phrase, “a viable nuclear warfare policy.” As for me, I see that scholarship, Biblical or otherwise, is to be employed in the living of a moral life, one dedicated to the Two Great Commandments. Any other use is “vanity, and a chasing after wind.” 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2005, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021/72 "2005-11-29T14:22:59Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > I think he would be surprised that nodoby follows the Jewish Law. I think he’d be just as distressed by ultra-Orthodox Judaism as by fundamentalist Christianity. But in general I agree with Woody Allen: “…he’d never stop throwing up.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-jesus-would-like-the-way-christianity-has-gone/331021.md?page=3)