# Do you think that this movie will be effective **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 27, 2008, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467 "2008-08-27T20:40:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/41 "2008-08-28T21:03:54Z")
[QUOTE=cosmosdan] Thanks Seems it was a little of both. [/QUOTE] Here’s some [more info](http://www.cnn.com/2003/SHOWBIZ/TV/02/25/donahue.ap/index.html) : > [@](#): > > The move was not a surprise. MSNBC hoped “Donahue” would provide a liberal counterweight to Fox News Channel’s competing “The O’Reilly Factor,” but the ratings started poorly and didn’t improve. > > MSNBC tried to tweak the show in November, putting Donahue in front of a live audience in New York instead of in a New Jersey studio, but it made little difference. > > The political talk show format has yet to prove – and may never – that it can support a liberal voice, said Andrew Tyndall, head of ADT Research, a television news consulting firm. > > Donahue’s chances weren’t helped by MSNBC’s impatience, he said. > > “They’re very quick to cancel shows,” Tyndall said. “Right from the start, they haven’t settled on a format and let it grow so people can find it. If it’s not working in a few months, they cancel it and move on to something else.” > > MSNBC also has sought a younger audience than its cable news rivals and the hiring of Donahue, 67, went against that strategy. “Anyone who’s under 25 doesn’t remember when his old talk show was on the air,” Tyndall said. > > During this month, a “sweeps” month in which ratings are watched closely to set advertising rates, “Donahue” averaged 446,000 viewers. O’Reilly drew 2.7 million viewers, up 28 percent from February 2002, according to Nielsen Media Research. ---
**Author:** ![SherwoodAnderson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@SherwoodAnderson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SherwoodAnderson)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/42 "2008-08-28T22:18:19Z")
[QUOTE=magellan01] First of all, you can take your “disingenuous” and shove it. Secondly, you mischaracterize the mindset of those in power over the last 16 years (and not just Presidents). Bush & Co. were not the first to entertain the idea of removing Saddam. Thirdly, the intitial stages of the war went extremely well. The problem is that we grossly misunderstood and underestimated the religious component in what was one of the more secular countries in the area. We also had too little experience understanding Islamic fundamentalists. And this is the part that I think divides the left and the right on this issue. The right sees Islamic fundamentalism for the barbaric, stone-age religion it is, and the misogynistic, hateful, principles it was built upon. They see it as simply unacceptable and refuse to give it the respect of the religion it hijacked. You, evidently, and others, see it as just one more of the many cultures in the wonderful beautiful mosaic that makes up the world. Fuck that. Finally, I suggest you look further into the kamikazis. Their tactics were a last-ditch effort to keep the war going, especially as they had so few experienced pilots left. And many of them we’re “encouraged” to become part of “the divine wind” in order to have their families looked after—or not. But the important distinction is that even kamikazi pilots were attacking MILITARY TARGETS—you know, battleships and the like. The fact that some people in history held a particular cause above their own life, often speaks well of them. Strapping a bomb on yourself and walking or driving into a school doesn’t. It says the opposite: that you are the lowest form of life possible and that is incumbent upon the rest of us to not tolerate it in any measure. So, fuck islamic fundamentalists. Fuck any of part of Islam that does not fully and vigorously condemn it and aid in ending it. And fuck anyone who seeks to apologize for it or explain away this true scum of the earth. The world should collectively send all people and future generations this message: we are tolerant and embracing of many of our differences. But there are limits. If you believe in stoning women for adultery, mutilating 12-year-old girls, beheading civilians, blowing up mothers and children and otherwise terrorizing the civilized among us. we will not stand for it. We will hunt you down and unceremoniously put a bullet dipped in pigs blood in your fetid brain. That is all. Oops. Thought this was in The Pit. Edited accordingly. My apologies. [/QUOTE] I remember you from back in '03 when I started lurking here… I think it would be more forthcoming of you and guys like Sam Stone et al to disclose - when discussing the war - that you back then were what i could only describe as hardcore war cheerleaders. I recall you guys full of enthusiasm pushing the latest talking points from the Bush admin. Moving weapons labs, mushroom clouds, surrender monkeys, freedom fries, the millions of people (like me) marching against the war actually being undercover stalinists… Defeatocrats. Later: secret truck caravans in the night smuggling atom bombs to syria, irrefutable proof found in Saddams file cabinets that every politician that ever were against the war only did so because they had recieved kickbacks from saddam. The inverted domino theory. I would suggest that there’s an opportunity here for an individual to grow by having a piece of humble pie and contemplating her shortcomings. Why not take a moment to consider how putting partisanship first, and - perhaps being easily duped - could make her complicit in letting a trainwreck unfold, of which she has a - however small - part of the blame. ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 10:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/43 "2008-08-28T22:21:45Z")
[QUOTE=SherwoodAnderson] I remember you from back in '03 when I started lurking here… I think it would be more forthcoming of you and guys like Sam Stone et al to disclose - when discussing the war - that you back then were what i could only describe as hardcore war cheerleaders. I recall you guys full of enthusiasm pushing the latest talking points from the Bush admin. Moving weapons labs, mushroom clouds, surrender monkeys, freedom fries, the millions of people (like me) marching against the war actually being undercover stalinists… Defeatocrats. Later: secret truck caravans in the night smuggling atom bombs to syria, irrefutable proof found in Saddams file cabinets that every politician that ever were against the war only did so because they had recieved kickbacks from saddam. The inverted domino theory. I would suggest that there’s an opportunity here for an individual to grow by having a piece of humble pie and contemplating her shortcomings. Why not take a moment to consider how putting partisanship first, and - perhaps being easily duped - could make her complicit in letting a trainwreck unfold, of which she has a - however small - part of the blame. [/QUOTE] I have no dog in this fight, except to wonder why you give a damn if someone on a internet message board eats humble pie for something they might’ve said 5+ years ago, but . . . the poster you’re quoting registered the same month you did. Summer of '04. What, exactly, do you remember magellan01 saying in '03 again? ---
**Author:** ![SherwoodAnderson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@SherwoodAnderson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SherwoodAnderson)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/44 "2008-08-28T22:27:19Z")
[QUOTE=Cisco] I have no dog in this fight, except to wonder why you give a damn if someone on a internet message board eats humble pie for something they might’ve said 5+ years ago, but . . . the poster you’re quoting registered the same month you did. Summer of '04. What, exactly, do you remember magellan01 saying in '03 again? [/QUOTE] I remember you as another cheerleader, my apologies for forgetting to mention you… ---
**Author:** ![Cisco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Cisco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cisco)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/45 "2008-08-28T22:36:16Z")
[QUOTE=SherwoodAnderson] I remember you as another cheerleader, my apologies for forgetting to mention you… [/QUOTE] Wow, that’s a great memory you’ve got there, pal. It’s so good that you remember things that never even happened! I don’t support the war and never did, nor am I a Republican, nor did I ever vote for Bush. You know, I’ve criticized dopers before for not being able to say anything that’s not rabidly pro-liberal around here without being assumed to be a right-winger, but you take the cake. I don’t think anyone else has ever straight-up lied like this; they’ve just jumped to conclusions. So now that I know for a fact that you’re lying about me, why should I believe anything you say about other posters? ---
**Author:** ![SherwoodAnderson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@SherwoodAnderson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SherwoodAnderson)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/46 "2008-08-28T22:38:45Z")
I think i’ll eat a bit of humble pie and aplogize for being sloppy and careless. Sorry. I’ll retract the part of my post that named names and make my point general. There’s no point in pointing fingers, especially when i’m this tired. ---
**Author:** ![SherwoodAnderson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@SherwoodAnderson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SherwoodAnderson)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/47 "2008-08-28T22:47:38Z")
That part about lying is quite off the mark though, just bad memory, carelessness and to much work. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/48 "2008-08-28T23:04:17Z")
[QUOTE=SherwoodAnderson] I remember you from back in '03 when I started lurking here… I think it would be more forthcoming of you and guys like Sam Stone et al to disclose - when discussing the war - that you back then were what i could only describe as hardcore war cheerleaders. I recall you guys full of enthusiasm pushing the latest talking points from the Bush admin. Moving weapons labs, mushroom clouds, surrender monkeys, freedom fries, the millions of people (like me) marching against the war actually being undercover stalinists… Defeatocrats. Later: secret truck caravans in the night smuggling atom bombs to syria, irrefutable proof found in Saddams file cabinets that every politician that ever were against the war only did so because they had recieved kickbacks from saddam. The inverted domino theory. I would suggest that there’s an opportunity here for an individual to grow by having a piece of humble pie and contemplating her shortcomings. Why not take a moment to consider how putting partisanship first, and - perhaps being easily duped - could make her complicit in letting a trainwreck unfold, of which she has a - however small - part of the blame. [/QUOTE] HA! You come in here shooting your mouth off and what you say is not and cannot be true. This is pointed out to you, and instead of being grossly embarrassed because you were caught in a…a…a…I can’t quite think of the word at the moment, you tee off on the person who politely pointed out that you might be mistaken. You should have embraced him, as it’s one thing to make a simple mistake and it’s quite another to knowingly communicate what you know to be an untruth. What a maroon. :rolleyes: And since you’re so awre of all this “pro war” talk I spewed, I’ll ask you for a cite. You are grossly mistaken about quite a lot evidently. Just in case you’re wondering, what you should be feeling now is 1) severe embarrassment and 2) seething anger—at yourself. Hope that helps. ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/49 "2008-08-28T23:16:45Z")
I loved your post so much I just had to cite part of it here again: > [@](#): > > I would suggest that there’s an opportunity here for an individual to grow by having a piece of humble pie and contemplating her shortcomings. Why not take a moment to consider how putting partisanship first, and - perhaps being easily duped - could make her complicit in letting a trainwreck unfold So, how’s the humble pie? Is that whipped cream you’re having with it or is that just the foaming from your mouth? Comedy gold. GOLD, I tellya!!! ---
**Author:** ![SherwoodAnderson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@SherwoodAnderson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SherwoodAnderson)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/50 "2008-08-28T23:19:31Z")
[QUOTE=magellan01] HA! You come in here shooting your mouth off and what you say is not and cannot be true. This is pointed out to you, and instead of being grossly embarrassed because you were caught in a…a…a…I can’t quite think of the word at the moment, you tee off on the person who politely pointed out that you might be mistaken. You should have embraced him, as it’s one thing to make a simple mistake and it’s quite another to knowingly communicate what you know to be an untruth. What a maroon. :rolleyes: And since you’re so awre of all this “pro war” talk I spewed, I’ll ask you for a cite. You are grossly mistaken about quite a lot evidently. Just in case you’re wondering, what you should be feeling now is 1) severe embarrassment and 2) seething anger—at yourself. Hope that helps. [/QUOTE] [QUOTE=SherwoodAnderson] I think i’ll eat a bit of humble pie and aplogize for being sloppy and careless. Sorry. I’ll retract the part of my post that named names and make my point general. There’s no point in pointing fingers, especially when i’m this tired. [/QUOTE] Reading comprehension? I feel no embarrassment, since: 1. I know i am a 33 year old adult; i know i make mistakes, and i have no problems with apologizing when it happens. 2. What I wrote I do believe in passionately; There’s a whole lot of people that have acted jerks for to long fucking stuff up galore, and with no owning up to their mistakes ever, whatsoever. I was stupid, though, to name names and throw out accusations - in general, and most especially when tired - nothing good ever comes from that. For that, i apologize, and i sincerely hope you and Cisco will accept my honest apology, and leave it at that. If you prefer to go on about it that’s between you and yourself. Cheers ---
**Author:** ![magellan01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@magellan01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/magellan01)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/51 "2008-08-28T23:38:37Z")
[QUOTE=SherwoodAnderson] Reading comprehension? I feel no embarrassment, since: 1. I know i am a 33 year old adult; i know i make mistakes, and i have no problems with apologizing when it happens. 2. What I wrote I do believe in passionately; There’s a whole lot of people that have acted jerks for to long fucking stuff up galore, and with no owning up to their mistakes ever, whatsoever. I was stupid, though, to name names and throw out accusations - in general, and most especially when tired - nothing good ever comes from that. For that, i apologize, and i sincerely hope you and Cisco will accept my honest apology, and leave it at that. If you prefer to go on about it that’s between you and yourself. Cheers [/QUOTE] Well, Your accusations were so specific that it’s hard to chalk them up to a simple mistake. But I’m eager to accept an apology when it is given. If only to encourage more people to make them when called for. Apology accepted. Thank you. Onward. ---
**Author:** ![SherwoodAnderson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@SherwoodAnderson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SherwoodAnderson)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/52 "2008-08-28T23:51:13Z")
[QUOTE=magellan01] And since you’re so awre of all this “pro war” talk I spewed, I’ll ask you for a cite. You are grossly mistaken about quite a lot evidently. [/QUOTE] You are quite right. After doing my homework i see that you have consistently made 3 points (all after 2003 since you were not a member then) - Publicly voicing complaints or doubt about the war emboldens terrorists and endangers the troops. - Bush is not the only one responsible since congress signed on. - Saddam was a bad guy and supported terrorism. The other stuff mentioned by me came from other posters and should not be hung around your neck. ---
**Author:** ![SherwoodAnderson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@SherwoodAnderson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SherwoodAnderson)\ **Post date:** [August 28, 2008, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467/53 "2008-08-28T23:52:58Z")
[QUOTE=magellan01] Well, Your accusations were so specific that it’s hard to chalk them up to a simple mistake. But I’m eager to accept an apology when it is given. If only to encourage more people to make them when called for. Apology accepted. Thank you. Onward. [/QUOTE] Good. They were an acummulated bag of “dirty laundry” for “war supporters”. I should know better then to project that on some guy on a message board that i know nothing about 🙂 Take care. I’m signing off. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-that-this-movie-will-be-effective/461467.md?page=2)