# Do you think you could kill someone in self-defense, or defense of another? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 10, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190 "2010-11-10T17:00:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/1 "2010-11-10T17:00:46Z")
Suggested by the current “Kill X or Y” threads, but hopefully less pointless. Assume that the person you would have to choose whether or not to kill is NOT innocent – that is, that she or he has been actively trying to kill, rape, or inflict grievous bodily harm on you or the person you are defending, and that by whatever contrivance you find necessary to stipulate, you have the opportunity to turn the tables by killing him or her. Also assume that no help is in sight and that you have no knowledge that help is (or is not) to come. Poll coming in a moment, but you needn’t let that delay you. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/2 "2010-11-10T17:04:33Z")
No. As I’ve said before, I am incapable of bringing physical harm to others, for any reason. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/3 "2010-11-10T17:11:19Z")
Yep. I made that decision before I ever purchased a firearm. Try to hurt/kill me - die. Try to hurt/kill my wife - die slowly. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/4 "2010-11-10T17:19:37Z")
Before anyone complains, I realize that no one really knows what they’d do until they have been put to the test. That’s why I phrased the options as I did; I’m looking for your intellectual assessments of yourselves. **Czarcasm** ,I don’t wish to insult you, so forgive me if it comes off that way. Are you speaking of your character or your constitution when you say you’re not capable of hurting anyone? That is, do you mean that you are so dedicated to the ideal of not killing that you would refuse to defend yourself using lethal force, or that you feel you could not muster the resolve to do so even in a situation where you would judge another justified in doing so? I will understand if you choose not to answer this. **silenus** , I’m glad to not hear any of the “shoot-to-wound” silliness. ETA: I made the poll anonymous for obvious reasons, but I myself voted for willing to kill in self-defense of myself and any friend or family member. I’m not sure what I’d do for a total stranger. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/5 "2010-11-10T17:22:03Z")
I used to think I wouldn’t, until I got burgled when I was in the house. I believe I would have killed the guy if I’d have got hold of him. As to whether I’d kill to protect a stranger, I dunno. I seem to have lost some of my humanity by spending time in the third world and seeing people die there. I saw a woman drown in Bangladesh a couple of weeks ago and though I was concerned and sad for her, I wasn’t emotionally moved (there was nothing I could have done to save her). I just thought “that’s awful, meh, nothing I can do”. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/6 "2010-11-10T17:30:35Z")
I think i would. And the reason I say so, is that though I am a very calm, serious person these days, I know that i can summon up a veritable font of rage when I need to. But it would have to be in the heat of the moment. I don’t know if I could do it coldly, afterwards, but at that moment, pull the trigger or sink a knife into them? Out of rage? Absolutely. Oh, it’d have to be for me or my SO, absolutely. Or his niece and nephew, I think I could do it for them. No one else, though. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/7 "2010-11-10T17:32:17Z")
I think you’ve got one set of selections up there twice. I said “I’d choose to kill” in every scenario, but I challenge that wording. I’d do whatever had the greatest chance of protecting myself/spouse/children/relative/stranger, and if that included an action that had a very high chance of killing them, e.g. multiple shots to center of mass, that’s what I’d do. If something else had a greater chance of protecting them, e.g. driving away, then that’s what I’d do. If a weapon was invented that had as great or greater chance of **stopping** the person as a firearm, but had no chance of killing them, (e.g. a phaser on heavy stun) and was so reliable & dependable that police traded in their firearms for it, I’d happily use it instead of a firearm. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/8 "2010-11-10T17:38:02Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > I think you’ve got one set of selections up there twice. You only _think_ that? Because I’m _sure_ of it. :smack: > [@](#): > > I said “I’d choose to kill” in every scenario, but I challenge that wording. I’d do whatever had the greatest chance of protecting myself/spouse/children/relative/stranger, and if that included an action that had a very high chance of killing them, e.g. multiple shots to center of mass, that’s what I’d do. If something else had a greater chance of protecting them, e.g. driving away, then that’s what I’d do. I took it as a given that we’re not talking about situations in which escape is a reasonable option. > [@](#): > > If If a weapon was invented that had as great or greater chance of **stopping** the person as a firearm, but had no chance of killing them, (e.g. a phaser on heavy stun) and was so reliable & dependable that police traded in their firearms for it, I’d happily use it instead of a firearm. If my grandmother had wheels, she’d be a wagon. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/9 "2010-11-10T17:48:54Z")
I’ve done things that have directly led to the deaths of other human beings before. It’s honestly not that hard. The only thing I would fear would be legal prosecution. I’m assuming, **Skald** , that for whatever reason, I have assurances that I won’t end up doing 20-life for this. So yeah, I’d kill anybody that was attacking another person for any reason, be it rape, murder, or robbery. I really have no problem removing scum from this earth and I don’t have a problem with anyone else doing it either. Don’t want me to kill you? Behave. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/10 "2010-11-10T17:56:39Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > I’ve done things that have directly led to the deaths of other human beings before. It’s honestly not that hard. The only thing I would fear would be legal prosecution. I’m assuming, **Skald** , that for whatever reason, I have assurances that I won’t end up doing 20-life for this. I put that assumption into the OP at one point, and then took it out because I thought it was unrealistic. There’s no way I can see to get that assurance that don’t imply the scenario is rigged; and if Loki has put you in the situation, he’s goign to find a way to screw you no matter what. Not that it really mattered anyway. I’d rather take my chances at trial than be killed. And I’d rather live in prison that let someone rape my wife. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/11 "2010-11-10T18:01:40Z")
My, we are a blood thirsty bunch. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/12 "2010-11-10T18:04:47Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > **Czarcasm** ,I don’t wish to insult you, so forgive me if it comes off that way. Are you speaking of your character or your constitution when you say you’re not capable of hurting anyone? That is, do you mean that you are so dedicated to the ideal of not killing that you would refuse to defend yourself using lethal force, or that you feel you could not muster the resolve to do so even in a situation where you would judge another justified in doing so? I will understand if you choose not to answer this. Not so much a virtue as it is a psychological quirk-I’ve never been able to strike out, no matter how I am provoked. My jackass father once tried to “fix” me by signing me up for boxing classes-not a pretty sight. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/13 "2010-11-10T18:05:03Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > My, we are a blood thirsty bunch. 🙂 My thread on Canadians going to hell was bloodthirsty. This one isn’t. A bloodthirsty question would be _If somebody killed your dog, would you track him down and slit his throat?_ ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/14 "2010-11-10T18:06:54Z")
I’d be strongly hesitant to kill one stranger in defense of another stranger. Who knows what incidents led to the situation? Don’t want to kill an undercover cop or interfere in a typical dirtbag-on-dirtbag crime. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/15 "2010-11-10T18:13:45Z")
I voted yes for all of them, but I wouldn’t actually _try_ to kill someone in defense of another; if I had a gun, I’d be aiming for the gut, or thighs, or whatever (and yes, I know even LEOs can’t usually hit people in a specific body part). ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/16 "2010-11-10T18:18:26Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > if I had a gun, I’d be aiming for the gut, or thighs, or whatever (and yes, I know even LEOs can’t usually hit people in a specific body part). Matt Helm says to “point it at the center of the body and pull the long, skinny thing that comes out the bottom until it quits making noise.” ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/17 "2010-11-10T18:22:33Z")
> [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > You only _think_ that? Because I’m _sure_ of it. :smack: Once you hit “Post Reply”, you can’t see the actual Poll questions anymore, so I couldn’t confirm it. Plus, you know, the bees and all. > [@carnivorousplant](#): > > My, we are a blood thirsty bunch. 🙂 And that’s my previous point. I wouldn’t kill someone because I want to kill them. I would kill someone because that’s got the highest probability to ensure the safety of the persons I’m protecting. If something else had a higher probability, that’s what I’d do, even if I thought I was legally in the clear to kill them. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/18 "2010-11-10T18:28:59Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I voted yes for all of them, but I wouldn’t actually _try_ to kill someone in defense of another; if I had a gun, I’d be aiming for the gut, or thighs, or whatever (and yes, I know even LEOs can’t usually hit people in a specific body part). Amigo, the gut counts as center of mass. And if you fire a handgun at someone’s gut or shoulder, you are trying to kill him. Probably thighs as well, but I’d want somebody like **Qadgop’s** opinion there. And I refuse to consider things like shooting the gun out of somebody’s hand, because if you’re in front of the person it’s an impossible angle, and if you’re behind him or to the side, you have the drop on him and it’s not exactly self-defense at that point. ---
**Author:** ![llcoolbj77](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/eb9ed0/32.png) [@llcoolbj77](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/llcoolbj77)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/19 "2010-11-10T18:30:56Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > My, we are a blood thirsty bunch. 🙂 Because of my job, I have seen some of the more heinous things people can do to eachother, for little to no reason. I pity the fool who attempts to harm me, my family, friends, and even the innocent bystander that I reasonably believe to be innocent. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2010, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/20 "2010-11-10T18:37:07Z")
I chose other, because I don’t think “choosing” would be involved. If I thought my life, or the life of a loved one was in serious jeopardy, I wouldn’t be putting together a balance sheet to figure out what I would do. I’d probably just spaz out and attack wildly all while hoping I don’t get snuffed. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190.md?page=2)