# Do you think you could kill someone in self-defense, or defense of another? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 10, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190 "2010-11-10T17:00:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/61 "2010-11-11T03:13:22Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > Not to try to sound too tough, but I \*think \*I wouldn’t kill to save my own life, but it would amuse me highly to kill somebody that was trying to hurt my family. I wouldn’t even think twice about that. I may even celebrate w/a Dunkin Donut in that scenario. > > Best wishes, > hh See, up until this point, I could have been a character witness at your trial! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![wonky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wonky/32/393_2.png) [@wonky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wonky)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/62 "2010-11-11T03:16:35Z")
> [@Mr.Excellent](#): > > Yah. I could easily see myself second-guessing: > > “Did I _have_ to kill that guy? What did he actually say? What did he actually do? Did I kill him because I was scared and couldn’t see a way out? What if, instead, I killed him because I was angry? Because I _wanted_ him dead? My God - was I _happy_ that he died? What sort of person is happy at a thing like that?” I’m sad for you that we’re so much alike. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/63 "2010-11-11T15:16:50Z")
> [@Mr.Excellent](#): > > 1.) You jump me in an alley with a gun, say, “No one insults **Athena** and lives,” and I draw my own gun and shoot you once. Assuming I can establish the facts are as I’ve described, that’s a pretty solid self-defense claim. > > 2.) Same as above, except that I shoot you several times, immediately in a row. Probably doesn’t hurt my self-defense claim - I’m panicked, reacting on instinct, haven’t had time for “the blood to cool” and to realize that you’re down. > > 3.) I shoot you once, utter some psychopathic quip, then cooly and methodically empty the clip. This makes it damned near impossible to argue I reasonably believed my life to be in danger. Option 1 is clearly silly. There’d be a litany of people insisting to the police, “Well, yeah, **Skald** ’s daft enough to kill someone for slandering Athena, but he certainly wouldn’t jump him in an alley and announce himself first. That’s what acid-booby-trapped showers, car bombs, and trained bees are for.” ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/64 "2010-11-11T15:38:41Z")
I guess I would have chosen “could choose to kill” rather than “would”. That is to say, in some kind of hand-to-hand confrontation, if I got a stranglehold I would release it once the assailant passed out - no need to kill unnecessarily. Likewise if I managed to break an arm or a knee, I would not go on to kill the guy. OTOH, with a shotgun I would not “shoot to wound” - that isn’t practical. But once he fell over, I would stop shooting (God willing). No doubt I would have some sleepless nights afterwards. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/65 "2010-11-11T16:10:04Z")
Sorry, can’t answer this. Too many problems with the choices. “Assault” is one of them. I don’t think I would kill to prevent someone from being punched out. I don’t even think I would kill to prevent a rape. I think I would choose to kill if I believed I was witnessing an attack that might result in very serious physical harm or death to the person being attacked. Even that’s not really correct because of “choose”. I don’t own or carry a gun so I couldn’t choose to shoot someone. I don’t know enough about combat so I couldn’t deliver some kind of blow designed to kill someone. However, I would intervene, even knowing that the outcome might result in somebody’s death (including my own). I can conceive of some circumstances in which I might deliberately choose to kill someone who I felt was a big enough threat. But that choice doesn’t really fit into your poll. ---
**Author:** ![BleizDu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@BleizDu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BleizDu)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2010, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/66 "2010-11-11T16:27:05Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Sorry, can’t answer this. Too many problems with the choices. > > “Assault” is one of them. I don’t think I would kill to prevent someone from being punched out. I don’t even think I would kill to prevent a rape. I think I would choose to kill if I believed I was witnessing an attack that might result in very serious physical harm or death to the person being attacked. > > Even that’s not really correct because of “choose”. I don’t own or carry a gun so I couldn’t choose to shoot someone. I don’t know enough about combat so I couldn’t deliver some kind of blow designed to kill someone. However, I would intervene, even knowing that the outcome might result in somebody’s death (including my own). > > I can conceive of some circumstances in which I might deliberately choose to kill someone who I felt was a big enough threat. But that choice doesn’t really fit into your poll. Pretty much my thoughts. – I’ve been raped before and although I tried to run away from the guy, tried to trick him into letting me go, and tried to fight him off, and really thought I would die in the remote area he had brought me to, at no point did killing him entered my head. ---
**Author:** ![FallenAngel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@FallenAngel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FallenAngel)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/67 "2010-11-12T20:59:42Z")
After the initial adrenalin rush faded, I wouldn’t lose a moment’s sleep over it. I’ve severely injured or otherwise come very close to killing someone in violent situations on a few occasions, some defending myself and some defending utter strangers. It’s never bothered me in the least. In fact, I believe it’s a moral obligation to stop such an attack by whatever degree of force is necessary. That said, any time I’ve ever harmed anyone by accident, I’ve felt very guilty; so it’s not like I’m some violence junkie who likes to hurt people or anything. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2010, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/68 "2010-11-12T23:34:13Z")
Present a suitable threat to me or my family and you are dead. No ifs, no buts. I’m a single male with no dependents and no likelihood thereof; I’m expendable. Over here, we’re limited to use of ‘reasonable force’ in the case of violence. Reasonable force does not preclude lethal force. (Hence the limitation to ‘suitable threat’.) ---
**Author:** ![Soliloquy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@Soliloquy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soliloquy)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2010, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/69 "2010-11-13T06:57:35Z")
Have you ever held the hand of someone who has been raped? Ever watched as they were patched up, physically or mentally? Whether I knew the person being raped or not, I’d kill the rapist. Wouldn’t hesitate for a second, even if it meant beating the rapist to death because I forgot to carry my gun that night. (Yeah, right.) ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2010, 8:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/70 "2010-11-13T08:54:44Z")
I chose other because I didn’t like voting for “I wouldn’t choose to kill,” as it implies I would never kill. My point is that it would never be a preconceived notion–it would be an accidental result of defending someone or myself. ---
**Author:** ![History\_Geek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b19c9b/32.png) [@History\_Geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/History_Geek)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2010, 9:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/71 "2010-11-13T09:25:14Z")
In the given scenario, I think you have an obligation to kill the attacker. ---
**Author:** ![Soliloquy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5ac83/32.png) [@Soliloquy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soliloquy)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/72 "2010-11-14T17:04:07Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I guess I would have chosen “could choose to kill” rather than “would”. That is to say, in some kind of hand-to-hand confrontation, if I got a stranglehold I would release it once the assailant passed out - no need to kill unnecessarily. Likewise if I managed to break an arm or a knee, I would not go on to kill the guy. > > OTOH, with a shotgun I would not “shoot to wound” - that isn’t practical. But once he fell over, I would stop shooting (God willing). > > No doubt I would have some sleepless nights afterwards. > > Regards, > Shodan In my line of work, we call this “shoot to stop the threat”. It isn’t PC to say “shoot to kill” anymore. ---
**Author:** ![kombatminipig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5ac83/32.png) [@kombatminipig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kombatminipig)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2010, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/73 "2010-11-14T17:15:58Z")
I instinctively chose ‘kill’ on all counts, naturally reasoning that I value my own life rather highly, likewise that I would have no trouble or conscience issues with severely hurting whoever lay a finger on my girlfriend or my parents. I further reasoned that I would kill to spare any person of great suffering. Then I reflected on the scenario of knowing and caring about both parties (hypothetically one dear friend beating another), and realized that I would in such a case rather be hurt myself than risking killing the attacker. Likewise, I would never risk killing if assaulted by my girlfriend or my parents (for whatever reasons of temporary insanity on their parts). So I guess the question is rather difficult. ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2010, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/74 "2010-11-14T17:46:19Z")
Under different circumstances I could kill a killer, but it doesn’t mean I wouldn’t feel bad about it. I killed someone in a dream that was killing multiple people and I felt bad for half a week when awake. Sometimes your options are not something desirable no matter what, and that’s reality. ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2010, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/75 "2010-11-14T17:49:40Z")
Nothing ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 14, 2010, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190/76 "2010-11-14T18:03:53Z")
I’m one of those few “doesn’t fit” answers. I would never choose to kill. I would, however, hope that I would choose to do whatever was necessary to stop the assailant, including the use of force if necessary, and one possible consequence of that is that the assailant might die. All else being equal, I would attempt to leave the assailant alive; it just wouldn’t be at the top of my priorities. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-think-you-could-kill-someone-in-self-defense-or-defense-of-another/560190.md?page=3)