# Do You Vote **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [December 27, 2010, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472 "2010-12-27T01:21:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/41 "2010-12-28T02:07:27Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > First, I don’t own a gun. That’s another right that I choose not to exercise without dishonoring the men and women who fought and died for it. > > Second, where am I being pessimistic and sour? It’s not pessimistic to acknowledge the undeniable fact that a single vote is next to worthless. And it’s not sour to get defensive when people say, with a straight face, “if you don’t vote, you can’t complain” or some equivalent self-righteous statement. In other words “Oooooh, you vote. BFD. Let me know when you do something difficult to support your country.” > > It’s as insulting as someone saying to a soup-kitchen volunteer, “hey, don’t talk to _me_ about the poor. I gave $5 to the Salvation Army last Christmas!” I spent 23 years doing the “difficult” thing for my country in the military, so you can stop squealing that noisy flute. Do you really think you did any good by being in the military? Really? After all, you were only one rifle, so how could you possibly make any difference? Or did you lead by example and influence others to emulate you? If I vote and I tell others that they should vote, well maybe the other nine votes in my mentioned election were from people I influenced. Unlikely, but possible. ---
**Author:** ![mittu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecd19e/32.png) [@mittu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mittu)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/42 "2010-12-28T02:27:12Z")
Eligible, registered, have never voted. I don’t follow politics so have never been in a position where I could make an informed decision. I liken voting to ‘Who Wants to be a Millionaire’ when they do ‘ask the audience’. All 100 people in the audience vote but only a handful may have any idea what the correct answer is, the upshot is that the informed answers are drowned out by the guesses. If you, as the contestant, could request that only people who knew (or were 95%+ sure) voted then you would be far more likely to find the correct answer. In elections I am happy for those who are more informed than I am to make the decision on my behalf. Of course many people vote for a party out of habit, coercion from family/friends, because they like the candidates smile or new hairstyle or simply out of a sense of duty that they must vote. _If_ I were someone who had fought for democracy I think I would be more put out by people voting mindlessly and ‘muddying’ the results than people not voting at all (not suggesting that people in this thread vote mindlessly but I am sure many others do). ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/43 "2010-12-28T02:29:34Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > As for the “people fought and died for this” argument…is that also a reason I should own a gun? Should I also petition the government for redress of grievances? Should I not quarter my fellow soldiers in my home? Should I go commit a crime so that I can exercise my right to a speedy trial and protection from cruel and unusual punishment? Clearly, failure to exercise a right says nothing of one’s respect or desire for such right. Those privileges follow on from the fundamental (which in the not too distant past liberal democracies have been forced to defend with blood - see the word choice in Ike’s D-Day speech - ‘liberty-loving’, ‘Nazi tyranny’, ‘oppressed’, ‘free world’, ‘free men’). You may disagree with any of those, or be vehemently in favour, but without suffrage who gives a damn what you think. If you don’t vote, you have no voice on whether you want any of those or more. Without it, the government isn’t accountable to the people, doesn’t have a popular mandate and can do what it wants without any sense of responsibility to those it is meant to be safeguarding. Which is why a crappy democratic government is always better than a good dictatorship; it has a great, great strength above all other forms of governance - if you don’t like the policies the government is enacted, vote them out. If you do, keep voting. Either way, the people get the government they deserve. ---
**Author:** ![Walmarticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Walmarticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walmarticus)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/44 "2010-12-28T02:36:29Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > I spent 23 years doing the “difficult” thing for my country in the military, so you can stop squealing that noisy flute. Do you really think you did any good by being in the military? Really? After all, you were only one rifle, so how could you possibly make any difference? Or did you lead by example and influence others to emulate you? If I vote and I tell others that they should vote, well maybe the other nine votes in my mentioned election were from people I influenced. Unlikely, but possible. I really doubt either of you made a substantial difference, but as far as civic participation goes, I think joining the military is WTFOMG **LIGHTYEARS** more substantial than casting a vote. You handsome gentlemen probably are justified in bitching about government, regardless of whether you vote or not. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/45 "2010-12-28T02:37:57Z")
> [@Walmarticus](#): > > “people fought and died for this” annoys the fuck out of me. Sorry, those people are sunk costs. If I wanted to prevent people from dying in the future, dead people certainly shouldn’t be relevant in deciding my course of action. Now, if you want to make it into a moral issue- whereby nonvoting is offensive to their spirit/memory, then by all means call me immoral. Just don’t call me impractical. It’s more emphasising the importance of the franchise, rather than trying to force a guilt trip. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/46 "2010-12-28T02:41:50Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Always vote, every election. And every vote counts, even if you think your preferred candidate is going to lose. Ah, but he more voters there are, the less your vote counts. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Walmarticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Walmarticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walmarticus)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 3:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/47 "2010-12-28T03:08:03Z")
> [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > It’s more emphasising the importance of the franchise, rather than trying to force a guilt trip. I’m aware of how very important it is. My penis is very important, in that many have sacrificed themselves and I’d fight to keep it (as would others). That doesn’t mean I should use it, just 'cause it’s there and valuable. ---
**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/48 "2010-12-28T03:11:18Z")
> [@Walmarticus](#): > > I’m aware of how very important it is. My penis is very important, in that many have sacrificed themselves and I’d fight to keep it (as would others). That doesn’t mean I should use it, just 'cause it’s there and valuable. I woke up this morning with a bad hangover And my vote was missing again. This happens all the time. It’s detachable. This comes in handy a lot of the time. I can leave it home, when I think it’s gonna get me in trouble, or I can rent it out, when I don’t need it. ---
**Author:** ![Walmarticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Walmarticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walmarticus)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/49 "2010-12-28T03:15:45Z")
> [@Frank](#): > > I woke up this morning with a bad hangover > And my vote was missing again. > This happens all the time. > It’s detachable. > > This comes in handy a lot of the time. > I can leave it home, when I think it’s gonna get me in trouble, > or I can rent it out, when I don’t need it. I really don’t like being without my vote for too long; it makes me feel like less of a man. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/50 "2010-12-28T03:16:37Z")
> [@Walmarticus](#): > > I’m aware of how very important it is. My penis is very important, in that many have sacrificed themselves and I’d fight to keep it (as would others). That doesn’t mean I should use it, just 'cause it’s there and valuable. But by the same token you should be aware of what you’re missing out if you don’t use it. ---
**Author:** ![carnut](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnut/32/3531_2.png) [@carnut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnut)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/51 "2010-12-28T03:37:56Z")
I always vote. My dad was a city clerk (the vote collector) and he instilled this value deep in his children. If you don’t vote, you don’t have a right to bitch about your government, taxes, or the military. ---
**Author:** ![Canadjun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/76d3ee/32.png) [@Canadjun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Canadjun)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/52 "2010-12-28T17:04:47Z")
In a manner of speaking I am registered to vote since I am on the voter’s list (I tick the relevant box on my Income tax form every year), but being registered is not a pre-requisite for voting, it just speeds things up. Yes, I vote in most elections. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/53 "2010-12-28T18:02:15Z")
> [@carnut](#): > > If you don’t vote, you don’t have a right to bitch about your government, taxes, or the military. Did you just skip all of my posts? Care to back that up with any semblance of a logical argument? Start with “Person doesn’t vote” and end with “person doesn’t have a right to bitch”, please. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/54 "2010-12-28T18:05:45Z")
> [@Walmarticus](#): > > I really doubt either of you made a substantial difference, but as far as civic participation goes, I think joining the military is WTFOMG **LIGHTYEARS** more substantial than casting a vote. > > You handsome gentlemen probably are justified in bitching about government, regardless of whether you vote or not. I disagree with your first statement. Joining the military was, for me, involuntary; my career was the result of circumstance and not devotion to duty. On the other hand, the exercising of rights is critical to the survival of the republic. Too often, we accept the government we have because we feel powerless, and to a great extent, we are. But that’s the result of apathy and acquiescence. Those in power will overstep their authority with impugnity as long as they think the people are too lazy or too stupid to hold them accountable. ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/55 "2010-12-28T18:19:31Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > I spent 23 years doing the “difficult” thing for my country in the military, so you can stop squealing that noisy flute. Do you really think you did any good by being in the military? Really? After all, you were only one rifle, so how could you possibly make any difference? Or did you lead by example and influence others to emulate you? If I vote and I tell others that they should vote, well maybe the other nine votes in my mentioned election were from people I influenced. Unlikely, but possible. I know you have, and I’m very big on not stealing the honor of others. I have the honor that is due to me, and you have yours. But that’s beside the point. My point is that voters often get this attitude that nonvoters are not patriotic. They act as if voters are more virtuous than nonvoters. Those people are the ones that are making it about patriotism in the first place. I only bring up military service to say that most of the people that pull this stunt are going to lose a patriotic pissing contest against me. Everybody has the right to bitch about the government. Whether you vote or not says nothing about how much your bitching should be respected/heeded. Nor does service in the military. Lastly, might I point out that you brought up convincing other voters to vote a certain way. That’s a far, far different thing than actually voting yourself. We’re no longer talking about whether your vote matters, but instead whether your political campaigning matters. That’s another matter entirely. > [@Mr.Kobayashi](#): > > Those privileges follow on from the fundamental (which in the not too distant past liberal democracies have been forced to defend with blood - see the word choice in Ike’s D-Day speech - ‘liberty-loving’, ‘Nazi tyranny’, ‘oppressed’, ‘free world’, ‘free men’). You may disagree with any of those, or be vehemently in favour, but without suffrage who gives a damn what you think. If you don’t vote, you have no voice on whether you want any of those or more. Without it, the government isn’t accountable to the people, doesn’t have a popular mandate and can do what it wants without any sense of responsibility to those it is meant to be safeguarding. Which is why a crappy democratic government is always better than a good dictatorship; it has a great, great strength above all other forms of governance - if you don’t like the policies the government is enacted, vote them out. If you do, keep voting. Either way, the people get the government they deserve. Those arguments don’t support the conclusion that I should vote, only that I should defend _my right_ to vote. That’s an entirely different thing. I still have suffrage. I still monitor the government’s actions and talk about them with friends and associates. I still form opinions of policies and candidates for office. But there’s no reason I should have to express that opinion by voting. There’s nothing wrong with keeping your opinions to yourself, at the voting booth and elsewhere. “If you don’t vote, you have no voice” - sure, but why is that automatically a bad thing? I’m perfectly comfortable keeping mum. Why does that impugn my character? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Kobayashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4af34b/32.png) [@Mr.Kobayashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Kobayashi)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/56 "2010-12-28T18:36:58Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > Those arguments don’t support the conclusion that I should vote, only that I should defend _my right_ to vote. That’s an entirely different thing. I still have suffrage. I still monitor the government’s actions and talk about them with friends and associates. I still form opinions of policies and candidates for office. > > But there’s no reason I should have to express that opinion by voting. There’s nothing wrong with keeping your opinions to yourself, at the voting booth and elsewhere. “If you don’t vote, you have no voice” - sure, but why is that automatically a bad thing? I’m perfectly comfortable keeping mum. Why does that impugn my character? Very true, but what would be music to the ears of any government wishing to erode the privilege of suffrage? An apathetic voter base that doesn’t use it. You might think that’s pretty far fetched, but I maintain that the franchise must be watched, carefully, for anything that undermines its objective (a government that is representative of the people). ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/57 "2010-12-28T18:43:37Z")
[Mod Note]Please take the debate about voting to the appropriate forum. Thank you.[/Mod Note] ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/58 "2010-12-28T18:45:43Z")
I always vote. But I only do it to piss off **Chessic Sense**. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/59 "2010-12-28T18:50:27Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > [Mod Note]Please take the debate about voting to the appropriate forum. Thank you.[/Mod Note] Arrrghhh, cap’n. ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2010, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472/60 "2010-12-28T23:05:51Z")
I vote regularly. Most recently in this poll. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-vote/565472.md?page=4)