# Do you want an electric vehicle? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 5, 2009, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780 "2009-06-05T04:02:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/1 "2009-06-05T04:02:20Z")
The title pretty much says it all. Ok, let’s add some suppositions. If they’re unrealistic, discuss that instead: 1. An ev with close to or even greater than the performance you’re already used to is possible in a new car that costs $25k or less. 2. EV infrastructure will be part of the economic recovery. For example, you’ll see a lot more solar panels, and zones like workplaces and apartment buildings will be compensated for accommodating a lot of ev’s. Yes or no? Why? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/2 "2009-06-05T04:05:06Z")
Great Googly Moogly, yes. I’d trade in my '78 Blazer in a heartbeat for a good EV. Less maintenance, less cost per mile to drive, less moving parts, less pollution. Where do I sign? ---
**Author:** ![Invisible\_Chimp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/f05b48/32.png) [@Invisible\_Chimp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Invisible_Chimp)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/3 "2009-06-05T04:21:31Z")
If I had the money, I would buy a Tesla Roadster tomorrow. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/4 "2009-06-05T04:24:49Z")
If it could drive long distance (as in 180+ miles) and could be repaired at a cost similar to my current car, sure. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/5 "2009-06-05T04:25:04Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Great Googly Moogly, yes. > > I’d trade in my '78 Blazer in a heartbeat for a good EV. > > Less maintenance, less cost per mile to drive, less moving parts, less pollution. Where do I sign? I would trade a 78 Blazer for a vintage Yugo. And no, EV’s don’t have enough utility for me. I want a turbo diesel that can get out of it’s own way, tow a trailer, and drive as far as I want to travel. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/6 "2009-06-05T04:33:28Z")
I drive a Prius, so I’m halfway there. When I drive, it’s typically more than 100 miles each direction; so my electric vehicle needs to have a minimum 250 mile range at at least 70 mph. And I’d like to use it while visiting, so it would be better if it had a 500+ mile range at 70. So a plug-in is out. A fuel cell vehicle would do, since I could refuel during the trip. The Prius is useless in the snow. This Winter I could back out of my driveway and go back in. I couldn’t even get it on the road. Of course it would do better with chains, but it’s easier to rely on the Jeep. The MGB is more fun than the Prius. Still, I saw a guy who’d converted a Triumph Spitfire to a plug-in. It performed about as well as a regular Spitfire, but remember the Spitfire used a 1.5l engine at the end and isn’t much of a performer by modern standards. (The Prius accelerates to 60 about as fast as the '66 MGB, but the MG handles better.) ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/7 "2009-06-05T05:04:29Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > I drive a Prius, so I’m halfway there. > > When I drive, it’s typically more than 100 miles each direction; so my electric vehicle needs to have a minimum 250 mile range at at least 70 mph. And I’d like to use it while visiting, so it would be better if it had a 500+ mile range at 70. So a plug-in is out. A fuel cell vehicle would do, since I could refuel during the trip. > > The Prius is useless in the snow. This Winter I could back out of my driveway and go back in. I couldn’t even get it on the road. Of course it would do better with chains, but it’s easier to rely on the Jeep. > > The MGB is more fun than the Prius. Still, I saw a guy who’d converted a Triumph Spitfire to a plug-in. It performed about as well as a regular Spitfire, but remember the Spitfire used a 1.5l engine at the end and isn’t much of a performer by modern standards. (The Prius accelerates to 60 about as fast as the '66 MGB, but the MG handles better.) I haven’t found the Prius to be bad in snow. Do you live in a hilly area? ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/8 "2009-06-05T05:07:09Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > I would trade a 78 Blazer for a vintage Yugo. Not me. That Yugo can’t tow a horse trailer or a boat through the dirt roads of the Dixie Forest or Death Valley or anywhere else for that matter. And I hear they’re hell to get parts for. I love my Blazer, but I’d love to have an EV, too. And if it came to either or, yeah, I’d prolly go with the EV (at least, an EV as described by the OP). ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/9 "2009-06-05T05:24:39Z")
Of course. On a related note, I’d like two or three nude supermodels delivered to my mansion every night. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 9:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/10 "2009-06-05T09:24:27Z")
I already have an electric scooter for neighborhood runs. It’s a moped. Had it for a few years and it’s been great. Would love to have an electric vehicle too. ---
**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/11 "2009-06-05T11:20:21Z")
Most of my current driving would suit an EV. But I still have several long trips a year that I make that would require a real car. I’m not sure I want to be a two-vehicle person. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@The\_Tao\_s\_Revenge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tao_s_Revenge)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/12 "2009-06-05T11:37:40Z")
> [@furt](#): > > Of course. > > On a related note, I’d like two or three nude supermodels delivered to my mansion every night. [Actually possible for you](http://www.google.com/products?hl=en&safe=off&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=f4X&ei=GQMpSoGsM8OntgeErbGxCA&resnum=0&q=superman%20model&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=wf) ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/13 "2009-06-05T13:14:23Z")
Hell yeah! I hardly drive my car at all as is. Sign me up. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/14 "2009-06-05T15:19:40Z")
In my line of work, we have an expression. “Fast, good and cheap. Pick two.” Which is to say, there have to be compromises. You can’t simply wave your hand and say “let’s make an EV that performs as well as a traditional ICE, costs the same and is available right now.” The real debate is more like this: 1. Fast and good. You can get an EV right now that performs as well as a sports car. But it ain’t cheap. Or, you have to develop a system where every car user has access to both an EV for short, commuter-type transporation and a conventional vehicle that can go long distances, carry large loads, etc. That won’t be cheap, either. 2. Fast and cheap. You know those little golf-cart like vehicles that some villages and communities have to take people to the store and deliver small packages? They’re available right now, but they aren’t an all-purpose replacement. 3. Good and cheap. The technology is evolving, but you’ll have to wait for it. The ICE has a 100+ year head start. Now, what’s your preference? ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/15 "2009-06-05T15:31:41Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > In my line of work, we have an expression. > > “Fast, good and cheap. Pick two.” > > Which is to say, there have to be compromises. You can’t simply wave your hand and say “let’s make an EV that performs as well as a traditional ICE, costs the same and is available right now.” > > The real debate is more like this: > > 1. Fast and good. You can get an EV right now that performs as well as a sports car. But it ain’t cheap. Or, you have to develop a system where every car user has access to both an EV for short, commuter-type transporation and a conventional > vehicle that can go long distances, carry large loads, etc. That won’t be cheap, either. > > 2. Fast and cheap. You know those little golf-cart like vehicles that some villages and communities have to take people to the store and deliver small packages? They’re available right now, but they aren’t an all-purpose replacement. > > 3. Good and cheap. The technology is evolving, but you’ll have to wait for it. The ICE has a 100+ year head start. > > Now, what’s your preference? Good and cheap for $400, Alex. ---
**Author:** ![Xema](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9de053/32.png) [@Xema](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Xema)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/16 "2009-06-05T15:33:34Z")
> [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](#): > > let’s add some suppositions… > An ev with close to or even greater than the performance you’re already used to is possible in a new car that costs $25k or less. As you imply here, what people care about isn’t the precise nature of a vehicle’s powerplant, but rather the performance it delivers - in the general sense that includes speed, range, cost, convenience, reliability etc. If and when an EV can deliver these, people will want one. (Just now, most or all of these items are issues for EVs.) ---
**Author:** ![zoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zoid/32/336_2.png) [@zoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoid)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/17 "2009-06-05T15:50:19Z")
> [@Khadaji](#): > > Most of my current driving would suit an EV. But I still have several long trips a year that I make that would require a real car. > > I’m not sure I want to be a two-vehicle person. BINGO! My daily driving would make me an ideal candidate for a plug in EV. But serveral times a year I drive a pretty fiar distance to visit relatives and without some kind of method to QUICKLY recharge (about the same time as filling up) I’m gonna need a ICE. I MIGHT consider 2 cars, if I had a garage and could get the EV pretty cheap. The problem is that if I have to maintain 2 cars 25K isn’t cheap enough. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/18 "2009-06-05T16:33:32Z")
Perhaps the best questions are what kinds of trade-offs are you willing to make? Or even better, what kinds will most of the car buying public be willing to make? I think that few would give up on having a same or better total cost of ownership with at least comparable acceleration handling and speed and carrying capacity (passengers and stuff) to a competing ICE vehicle. But they may be willing to pay more up front for the savings over ownership cycle. Some will be unwilling or unable to compromise on the ability to use one car for both commuting and cross country trips - and for those an EREV will be required at those same cost over ownership time/performance points. Some will be willing to give up range down to commuting plus a comfortable margin of error (eg are already a two car family or always fly to vacation spots), but will expect something in return - likely lower cost over lifetime of ownership. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/19 "2009-06-05T18:18:05Z")
> [@](#): > > Do you want an electric vehicle? Certainly. I want a Segway as well…and a pony. > [@](#): > > 1. An ev with close to or even greater than the performance you’re already used to is possible in a new car that costs $25k or less. > > 2. EV infrastructure will be part of the economic recovery. For example, you’ll see a lot more solar panels, and zones like workplaces and apartment buildings will be compensated for accommodating a lot of ev’s. So…an electric car that costs less than $25k along with the entire electric infrastructure for recharging it? I suppose the question would be…how much would THAT cost me? > [@](#): > > Yes or no? Why? Maybe. It would depend on what the real costs would be. How much would my taxes go up for the recharging infrastructure? What would the real costs associated with the electric vehicle be (how often would I have to change out the batteries, the most expensive part of the car)? How long would it last? What performance characteristics would it have (how many miles could I go on a charge, how quickly would it recharge, what would the costs associated with day to day use be, etc etc)? -XT ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2009, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780/20 "2009-06-05T18:24:25Z")
If you’re supposing that all the drawbacks and objections have been overcome, can we suppose a car that runs on tap water, so I can have one of those instead? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/do-you-want-an-electric-vehicle/498780.md?page=2)