# "Doctor, I think I've caught. . . PORNOGRAPHY!" **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 19, 2004, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659 "2004-11-19T14:52:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![CrazyCatLady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@CrazyCatLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CrazyCatLady)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/61 "2004-11-19T21:50:29Z")
> [@Homebrew](#): > > Alcohol, caffeine and nicotene have been shown to be _chemically_ addictive. Show us one peer-reviewed study that shows porn has. They’ve also been shown to be _psychologically_ addictive. Recovering addicts often claim the psychological addiction is harder to beat than the chemical addiction. The studies cited in the OP’s article would seem to show that porn is also psychologically addictive. Unless you’re saying that psychological addiction doesn’t exist, or isn’t as much of a problem as chemical addiction? ---
**Author:** ![Tio\_Gringo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5e925/32.png) [@Tio\_Gringo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tio_Gringo)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/62 "2004-11-19T21:56:28Z")
> [@Waverly](#): > > Leydan is probably a lovely woman who is sincere in her beliefs. I’m less sure about the way she uses science to back up these beliefs. She’s appeared before this same senate committee before, and in 1999 stated that she has “not treated one case of sexual violence that did not involve pornography.” Not one? Out of how many? What _is_ pornography in this context? Apparently the senators prefer anecdotal evidence. She also maintained that **once a pornographic image was seen** , it was **“stored permanently”** and is **“permanently implanted”**. There is no hope to “detoxify” individuals once the have been exposed. > > So, it’s not just a disease, it’s incurable! Bolding mine. I sure wish that would work for my Calculus II class. > [@Homebrew](#): > > Tomato, tamahto, potato, potahto …lets call the whole thing off. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/63 "2004-11-19T21:57:09Z")
> [@Diogenes the Cynic](#): > > The whole thing sounds like an attempt to circumvent that pesky 1st Amendment by framing the issue as a “Public health” concern and categorizing it as an addiction. Of course, they admit that they have no data to prove that “porn addiction” has any appreciable destructive effects on families so I don’t see how this is going anywhere. You know, Diogenes, for a cynic, you can be really kinda Pollyanna-ish. Or don’t you remember how President Nixon’s Commission on Pornography found no evidence that porn was harmful, and Nixon proceeded to ignore the Commission’s findings and crack down on porn anyway? These guys don’t want evidence, they don’t want proof. They want any kinda rationale, excuse, or lie they can get. ---
**Author:** ![Waverly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/57b2e6/32.png) [@Waverly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waverly)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/64 "2004-11-19T22:05:18Z")
Add number two The scene opens and the camera is positioned behind two seated teenage boys. They are staring into a computer monitor, which is obscured behind the head of boy #2. Both boys seem to be moving their right arms furiously in the vicinity of their laps. Again the view is obscured. Suddenly, a beautiful woman in a black dress bursts through the door. Boy #1: Hey, it’s porn star Tara Patrick! Boy #2: Awesome! Tara: No boys, I used to be porn star… until I found Jesus. Now I’m a star for God. [half turning to camera] Did you know that that film video clip you are watching was produced using Afghani heroin money? That’s right, 89% of porn is illegally funded by TERRORISTS.\* Boy #2: No way! Tara: Way. Here’s something else you didn’t know: by watching porn together, you are 6X more likely to turn gay\*\*. That’s right; you could gobbling each other knobs by the end of the week! [Both boys look uneasily at each other] Boy #1: I’m sorry Tara, we didn’t know. Boy #2: Yeah, let’s go to church and pray that Jesus doesn’t turn us gay. Tara: [now fully to camera] Most porn addiction begins with gateway images like the Sports Illustrated Swimsuit Edition or the Sears Catalog juniors’ underwear section. From there, it’s just a matter of time before they are raping nuns or turning gay. Parents, talk to your children about the dangers of porn before it is too late. And the small print: \*Extrapolated figures from fictional accounts \*\*I’d like to say this is fantasy, but this is actually a belief held but some church groups ---
**Author:** ![Harborwolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Harborwolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harborwolf)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/65 "2004-11-19T22:10:24Z")
> [@Harborwolf](#): > > I know where to get the [cake](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=287517). 😛 That joke would’ve worked much better had I actually included the link. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/66 "2004-11-19T22:12:25Z")
I suppose of one is bashing the biscuit while simultaneously thinking of Jesus, one is probably too far gone to help… ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/67 "2004-11-19T22:27:38Z")
> [@CrazyCatLady](#): > > They’ve also been shown to be _psychologically_ addictive. Recovering addicts often claim the psychological addiction is harder to beat than the chemical addiction. The studies cited in the OP’s article would seem to show that porn is also psychologically addictive. Unless you’re saying that psychological addiction doesn’t exist, or isn’t as much of a problem as chemical addiction? We should probably make sure our terms our defined correctly. > [@](#): > > (From [Wikepedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Addiction)) > The medical community now carefully distinguishes between physical dependence and psychological addiction (or simply addiction). Addiction is now narrowly defined as “uncontrolled, compulsive use despite harm”; **if there is no harm to the patient or another party, there is no addiction.** (Bolding mine) So unless a dude is rubbing all the skin off his dork or it somehow affects his ability to work and finction in society then he does not have an addiction as that term is defined in the medical and mental health industry. Even then, you would have to somehow prove that the addiction is specifically _looking at pornography_ rather than just a compulsion to jerk off or keep producing sexual arousal. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/68 "2004-11-19T22:29:37Z")
There was a funny thread about kids making the “O” face for Jesus at Christian Rock shows… Anyhoo, count me in as one of those folks cautiously supportive of catagorizing compulsive pornography viewing as a paraphilia worthy of treatment. My brother had a roommate (and no, it wasn’t my fucking brother, so don’t even start) who ran up over $2500 worth of bills for 900 numbers; and when confronted, the guy tried to skip town. My bro took him to small claims court and won. So, this guy had to pay out $2500 plus some nasty court fees, lost a friend and a good appartment, and was publically humiliated. Guess what happened next? He kept calling the 900 numbers and wound up bankrupt, so my brother tells me. This guy fucked up his life for phone sex. If that isn’t a classic unhealthy addiction, I don’t know what is. People do really need help with stuff like this, whether its porn, gambling, drugs, food, or any one of those things that are fun & fine in moderation, and totally destructive when abused. As it is I’m pretty sure I’m getting hooked on this goddamn place, and need to knock it off. Lessee…ahhh, Halo 2! ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/69 "2004-11-19T22:36:33Z")
> [@Waverly](#): > > Here’s something else you didn’t know: by watching porn together, you are 6X more likely to turn gay\*\*. > \*\*I’d like to say this is fantasy, but this is actually a belief held but some church groups Hmmm…I don’t know how they manage that. Looking at images of naked women will turn a man gay? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![kung\_fu\_lola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f4b2a3/32.png) [@kung\_fu\_lola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kung_fu_lola)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/70 "2004-11-19T22:43:18Z")
> [@Loopydude](#): > > **People** do really need help with stuff like this, whether its porn, gambling, drugs, food, or any one of those things that are fun & fine in moderation, and totally destructive when abused. Bolding was mine, because when we talk about things that are harmless in moderation, we have to be very clear that problems originate with the _person_, and not the object being abused. The Anti-Sex Police are demonizing the object, pornography, and ascribing qualities to it that it simply doesn’t have. That is what makes them look ridiculous. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/71 "2004-11-19T22:43:50Z")
> [@](#): > > _posted by Captain Amazing_ > What neo-conservative policies or ideas are being pursued here? > > _posted by Diogenes the Cynic_ > Not so much a neocon policy as a sop to the religious right. Isn’t that a hallmark of the modern neocon methodology? It’s like a magic trick, where they wave their right hand in full view and shout “homo god pray porn jesus” so the target demographic doesn’t notice how the left hand is shoveling the nation’s treasury into corporate coffers. (There’s a joke here about “stupid flaggots,” but I’m damned if I can nail down the wording.) ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/72 "2004-11-19T22:45:38Z")
> [@The Devil's Grandmother](#): > > Is there a detox program for me? Should there be? Or should we just close down all message board because some people like me can’t do it responsibly? Of course we shouldn’t, and there shouldn’t be government action. However, in the original post, **Gobear** was doubting the existence of porn addiction. That’s what I was contradicting him on. I wasn’t calling for the government to do anything about it. ---
**Author:** ![Waverly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/57b2e6/32.png) [@Waverly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waverly)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/73 "2004-11-19T22:50:45Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Hmmm…I don’t know how they manage that. Looking at images of naked women will turn a man gay? > 😕 [Of course.](http://www.christiananswers.net/q-eden/edn-f016.html) It occurs at level 1, though to be fair, the raping and pillaging don’t take place until level 3. ---
**Author:** ![Loopydude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e56c9b/32.png) [@Loopydude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loopydude)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/74 "2004-11-19T22:52:48Z")
> [@kung fu lola](#): > > Bolding was mine, because when we talk about things that are harmless in moderation, we have to be very clear that problems originate with the _person_, and not the object being abused. > The Anti-Sex Police are demonizing the object, pornography, and ascribing qualities to it that it simply doesn’t have. That is what makes them look ridiculous. Well, that’s a good point, and certainly one I agree with. But in the spirit of not throwing the baby out with the bathwater, to those in this thread who seem to deny that even relatively harmless-seeming vices should be thought of as “abusable”, I would say you might be surprised. I’m not for outlawing porn or anything, but sex does appear to be something with serious abuse potential, and minimizing that concern doesn’t help with finding a rational solution to a very real problem. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/75 "2004-11-19T22:55:15Z")
> [@Waverly](#): > > About the players: > Leydan is probably a lovely woman who is sincere in her beliefs. I’m less sure about the way she uses science to back up these beliefs. She’s appeared before this same senate committee before, and in 1999 stated that she has “not treated one case of sexual violence that did not involve pornography.” Not one? Out of how many? What _is_ pornography in this context? Apparently the senators prefer anecdotal evidence. She also maintained that once a pornographic image was seen, it was “stored permanently” and is “permanently implanted”. There is no hope to “detoxify” individuals once the have been exposed. > > So, it’s not just a disease, it’s incurable! Here’s why I can’t laugh at this thread. You see a former friend of mine is “a lovely woman who is sincere in her beliefs.” One of those beliefs is that her now ex-husband is a sex addict. She has never said what she meant by that, only that he had to go to 90 12-step problems in 90 days before she’d consider letting him live in her home again. As a result, he’ll be spending Thanksgiving Day with me and my family, if he isn’t too depressed. I know him very well, and I know what he was accused of and how much of it was true (damn little). The people we believe to be behind his ex-wife have done far worse, including to me. I am a straight, healthy adult female. As a result, I enjoy looking at healthy adult males (if I’m only looking, it doesn’t make a difference whether they’re gay or straight). All of the straight or bi-sexual, healthy, adult males I’ve known enjoy looking at healthy adult females. I don’t have a problem with this, and, in fact, I’d be rather concerned if a man I was dating didn’t get a rise out of the prospect of seeing me naked (double-entendre intended!). I also find looking at people having sex to be rather exciting. I’m hardwired that way, and it seems to me to be a good thing. On the other hand, up until now, I’ve been pretty discrete about that. I look at porn once in a blue moon, but when I do, I enjoy it. Meh. I’m with the **Devil’s Grandmother**. Porn is nice once in a blue moon, although I haven’t had the guts to search for it on the web. This _message board_, on the other hand, is something I do have to watch out for! Maybe I should run naked through this thread while it’s still legal . . . . Nah. Last time I did that, **elucidator** apparently mistook me for a man! 😉 CJ ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [November 19, 2004, 10:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/76 "2004-11-19T22:56:40Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Why stop at just porn, though? Why not also warn about video games and soap operas-both of those “addictive”, in the way that porn is. You can try to take my porn. You can try to take my TV. But the day you come for Rome: Total War, there’s gonna be problems 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Waverly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/57b2e6/32.png) [@Waverly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waverly)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2004, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/77 "2004-11-20T00:43:59Z")
Siege, I’ve been joking most of the thread, but I was being dead serious in that particular post. I think Leydan is misguided, but sincere in her beliefs. I believe she is being manipulated and used in order to lend an air of scientific credibility to a conservative agenda. As you point out, Leydan and many otherwise good people can’t come to grips with human sexuality. Worse yet, most still feel the drives and are wracked with guilt because of it. Sorry to hear about your friend. I wonder when a War On Porn, and a search for Weapons of Ass Destruction, prompts the US to invade Sweden. OK, I’m joking again. I think. ---
**Author:** ![Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f04885/32.png) [@Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ninja_Pizza_Guy)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2004, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/78 "2004-11-20T01:16:15Z")
> [@](#): > > She told of one patient, a business executive, who arrived at his office at 9 a.m. each day, logged onto Internet porn sites, and didn’t log off until 5 p.m This kind of irks me. Eight hours of porn? Must be bad. If he’d spent that same eight hours surfing sports sites, playing fantasy football or the like, that’d be just dandy. Or if he spent that eight hours drinking and playing office golf. And need I mention that “she told…” is hardly convincing? I used to hear the same shit back when I still played D&D. “Someone did something horrible or something horrible happened to him, and he played D&D, so D&D is evil & bad & nasty.” I have this little fantasy that someday the concepts of “addictive behavior” and “addictive personalities” are recognized. ---
**Author:** ![Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f04885/32.png) [@Ninja\_Pizza\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ninja_Pizza_Guy)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2004, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/79 "2004-11-20T01:18:04Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > Hmmm…I don’t know how they manage that. Looking at images of naked women will turn a man gay? > 😕 You ain’t the only one. I actually had someone tell me that “only queers and dykes eat pussy.” That much head-scratching can raise welts. ---
**Author:** ![Hyperelastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Hyperelastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hyperelastic)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2004, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659/80 "2004-11-20T01:50:31Z")
> [@gobear](#): > > “Porn addiction”? What the hell are these censorious assmonkeys smoking? (I’m guessing it’s not the pole.) Humans enjoy erotica; you can find examples of erotic art in Neolithic archeology sites and in every human culture that has ever existed. From the erotic murals of Pompeii to the Kama Sutra to naughty etchings in 19th-century Japan, people have been stimulated by sexual images and have never reported being sexually aroused by visual images as “addictive.” > WTF? Are we going to be dragged back to the days of hypocritical Victorian prudery when piano legs were referred to as “limbs” and sex for pleasure was taboo, yet the number of prostitutes and cases of syphilis skyrocketed? Are we going to submit to self-appointed censors who want to translate their own sexual anxieties into law? Don’t you think there may be a middle ground between Victorian prudery and the present situation where any 12-year-old can sit down at a computer in a public library and pull up a picture of a woman eating feces out of another woman’s rear end? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/doctor-i-think-ive-caught-pornography/275659.md?page=5)